This has got to be a goddamned JOKE.

[MrBenis]

Re: This has got to be a goddamned JOKE.

If the thread has deteriorated this much, then it is in my humble judgement to say the thread should be locked, sin-binned and forgotten.

I'd rather see a new thread of the same idea, full of a useful well of thought, than some retarded spam war.

I give this the big thumbs down!

[maranello]

Re: This has got to be a goddamned JOKE.

If the thread has deteriorated this much, then it is in my humble judgement to say the thread should be locked, sin-binned and forgotten.

I'd rather see a new thread of the same idea, full of a useful well of thought, than some retarded spam war.

I give this the big thumbs down!

I am not going to lock threads just because someone flamed someone else. Then we would have to lock every single thread in this forum.

[MrBenis]

Re: This has got to be a goddamned JOKE.

A quick skip over the thread in whole revealed evidence to the contrary maranello! Observe more closely that theres more than just 1 man taking the mickey off someone else.

[maranello]

Re: This has got to be a goddamned JOKE.

A quick skip over the thread in whole revealed evidence to the contrary maranello! Observe more closely that theres more than just 1 man taking the mickey off someone else.

lol

Trust me, it would be sooooooooooooo much easier for me to just to "lock" the threads instead of issuing warnings/bans or making explanations. But we can't just simple lock the thread just because someone went crazy.

I did issue a few warnings to people who flamed others. If they keep going, they will recieve a 1 week ban. I'll make sure that flaming won't happen here again. If it does, then I'll lock the thread AND issue bans.

Does that satisfy you sir?

[maranello]

Re: This has got to be a goddamned JOKE.

Anyways, lets just get back to topic. Any further discussion about that other stuff should be continued via PM (just PM me if you think you have more to say about it).

[Cornbread Mafia]

Re: This has got to be a goddamned JOKE.

I'll try to bring back some constructive criticism to this thread...


I believe the PKM is balanced well within the game now.. The assault rifles are able to fire more accuractely from the crouched and standing position, than the PKM, therefore the assault rifles have an advantage in head on confrontations where both players are in a crouched or standing position...

The speed to go prone, and to stand up from the prone position has been decreased, and since the prone position is the Support kits primer and most effectve position, it creates a disadvantage to counter the higher PKM accuracy of the prone position.. As any assault player, a kit which uses assult rifles, shouldn't go prone, especially against a support player. The assault players need to crouch at the very most. And since going crouch or just standing is much fatser than going prone, all other players have the advantage of first shot.. Make that a good first shot..

While the Support player is in a prone position, their head becomes the main target, and the head is a 1 shot to 2 shot kill. This also puts the support at a disadvantage. Snipers can easily pick off Support at a long range... And any assult player just needs to crouch and go for the head.

The balance is there. I believe alot of people who are complaining just need to realize there are new tactics to taking out Support players and adapt. You don't run down the middle of a road now, as a support player can do his job and clear that road. Get a sniper to pick off support nests..

[No_Smoking]

Re: This has got to be a goddamned JOKE.

I thought the pkm was balanced before the patch just fine. I never had a problem killing people. http://bf2s.com/player/43697322/ my stats arent the greatest but 95% of what you see is pre patch (I dont pub too often anymore, just scrims and tournys).
I played against some really good guys in support too. pwned me real nice anyway.
Im all for turning it back the way it was. but im also fine with how it is now, makes me all that much better. no complaints by me :)

[Deavile]

Re: This has got to be a goddamned JOKE.

I would like to point out something I believe to be true regarding realism in games. Battlefield 2 is a game designed to simulate what combat might be like on a modern battlefield. The graphical engine attempts to accurately model smoke effects, sun glare, explosions and more. The sound engine attempts to model the sound of gunfire and the ringing effect from a nearby explosion. The models accurately portray their real life counterparts down to fairly minute details. It follows then that the weapon handling would also accurately model real life weapon handling. The balance of the weapons need not be taken into consideration because if they were not effective weapons, then they would not be used on the battlefield (assuming optimal supply conditions).
Each infantry weapon has it's role on the battlefield, assault rifles offer semi-automatic accuracy out to a range of 300M while being light enough to use in CQB situations with relative ease. Sniper rifles allow a company's sharp shooters to effectively remove officers and support personal at range of at least 600M without needing to expose themselves to return fire. Sub-machine guns work extremely well out to at least 50M with their light weight, high ROF and low recoil. Finally Squad automatic weapons or Light machine guns give a single man the ability to accurately lay down a large volume of fire out to at least 600M and so provide cover fire for his squad mates.

My point is (as explained above) if you model the weapons as you find them in real life then they will be balanced. Why would any army use a weapon (again, assuming optimal supply condition) if it was not effective at doing what it was designed to do?

The limitations of the battlefield 2 engine mean that you will almost never engage targets at ranges over 300M (even 200 is very rare in my experience), but these conditions can also be found in real life. Infantry statistics have shown that 95% of rifle combat took place at range under 400M and 72% took place at 200M or less. (http://www.angelfire.com/art/enchanter/range.html) In my opinion this means that there is no need to adjust the accuracy of weapons in BF2 due to the engine limitation on view distance because most engagements in real life take place at range under 400M anyways.

What I would suggest for changes is not to make the MGs less accurate, but to bring the assault rifles in line with what they should be. Make the ARs as accurate as their carbine counterparts (it makes no sense that the longer barreled version of the M16 is less accurate than the short barreled M4); giving them the ability to fire with reasonable accuracy from any position. This would mean that the MG would kick any one else's butt from a prone position with a bit of room between himself and his target, but up close assault troops could rapidly move in on him and take him out at close range.

Finally I would like to point out what I believe the term suppressive fire means. Well trained troops have been instructed to ignore incoming enemy fire. They are trained not to react to the bullets zipping over their heads or kicking up dirt in their faces. Granted, some troops fresh out of training might have a hard time doing this, but in theory they are capable of it. This means that they only way to make an infantry man put his head down is by showing him that if he keeps it out there, its going to get shot up. Suppressive fire works because the enemy has to take cover from incoming fire or they WILL be hit.

I apologize for the length of this post, I just wanted to properly articulate my points.

-Deavile

[WickedDevil]

Re: This has got to be a goddamned JOKE.

Believe me, this thread is a LOT more civilized that some of the other's I've seen. And by the way, Marenello is the new god now. Screw DrunkenP. :laugh:

J/k. But I am impressed about the moderator response in regards to my post. That was quite a sight. :) Thanks Marenello.

BTW, I didn't mean troll the forums for losers that post stuff like that. I ment just in this topic.

And thank you for your input Deavile. I can understand that quite well. Yet I am not entirely sure why there are those discrepancies in the weapon accuracy, ROF, etc.

[maranello]

Re: This has got to be a goddamned JOKE.

J/k. But I am impressed about the moderator response in regards to my post. That was quite a sight. :) Thanks Marenello.

No problem:) Just doing my job:p

[redrider]

Re: This has got to be a goddamned JOKE.

I told you guys before the patch, you would see a lot more support players and it would be blamed on the noobs. Trust me on this though, its just the flavor of the month. It will pass. For me, Ive been trying to increase my time and skill with the medic class. The PKM has helped out a lot with that. You see there is always a different view on any subject.
Might I suggest a different course of action though. If the PKM is so over powered as some say why not bring up every thing else? Im getting kinda tired of the people who say "No fair, I got killed, Nerf that weapon". Instead lets leave the PKM alone and give everyone 2 or 3 more health bars and add accuracy to some of the other weapons. Also lets leave the AA alone but give all the AirCraft some more health. I personally like lots of big bangs and lots of choices, but the Nerf thing is getting old. Dont you think so? . . . . . .Red

[maranello]

Re: This has got to be a goddamned JOKE.

Not going to say anything, just watch the video:

http://media.putfile.com/The-New-PKM

I am neither for it nor against it. I found this video in another forum and wanted to share it with people.

Discuss.

[Keith Maniac]

Re: This has got to be a goddamned JOKE.

While the Support player is in a prone position, their head becomes the main target, and the head is a 1 shot to 2 shot kill. This also puts the support at a disadvantage. Snipers can easily pick off Support at a long range... And any assult player just needs to crouch and go for the head.

Prone support units are my favourite victims with the AT missile right after visible "Y 'ELLO THERE!!"-snipers :).

[Cornbread Mafia]

Re: This has got to be a goddamned JOKE.

Not going to say anything, just watch the video:

http://media.putfile.com/The-New-PKM

I am neither for it nor against it. I found this video in another forum and wanted to share it with people.

Discuss.

I believe the video showed a well balanced PKM. The PKM was able to take out people who bunched up, as shown after the support players second death when a player was killed followed by another player, a medic, getting killed while reviving the 1st dead player. The newly revived player was killed again because the medic shouldn't have revived him in the line of fire, in the first player..

And as shown from the video, when prone, the weapon is deadly... The initial scene in the cideo showed a player killed while running down the middle of a road; that should be an easy kill, being out in the open with your back to the gun... Then the player slides down the hill and catches a player to his right side, that was killed for not paying attention to his surroundings; once again an easy kill at the fault of the other player...

In conclusion i witnessed errors on the behalf of the victioms, more than any over powered weapon itself.. And even considering the errors of the victims, the support player still took his deaths..

[maranello]

Re: This has got to be a goddamned JOKE.

I believe the video showed a well balanced PKM. The PKM was able to take out people who bunched up, as shown after the support players second death when a player was killed followed by another player, a medic, getting killed while reviving the 1st dead player. The newly revived player was killed again because the medic shouldn't have revived him in the line of fire, in the first player..

And as shown from the video, when prone, the weapon is deadly... The initial scene in the cideo showed a player killed while running down the middle of a road; that should be an easy kill, being out in the open with your back to the gun... Then the player slides down the hill and catches a player to his right side, that was killed for not paying attention to his surroundings; once again an easy kill at the fault of the other player...

In conclusion i witnessed errors on the behalf of the victioms, more than any over powered weapon itself.. And even considering the errors of the victims, the support player still took his deaths..

I agree 100%...but you are leaving out the most important part of the video....

Didn't you realize how easy it was for him to kill people "off scope"? And he was neither crouching nor in prone position....He was standing up, he was at least 70-100 feet away from targets (not all of them, but most of them), he wasnt even zooming in. The weapon almost has no recoil and it's accuracy is amazing.

If you have played counter strike, or counter strike source for about 6 months, meaning you have good reflexes and you know how to aim, you can pretty much own 90% of the players in every server.

I mean I never wanted to open my mouth about this whole PKM issue. But after seeing that video, and those off scope kills, I really believe that it is totally overpowered.

If you are going to make a heavy automatic weapon like PKM highly accurate and overpowered, fine! but do the same to others. Make the M249 the same way or the M4 or the M203...you name it.

This is totally unfair and ridiculous. Yes you are right about the victim's mistakes. But that's not the point!

You shouldn't have watched the video that way. Watch the video to see how the guy gets amazingly easy kills with PKM and the kills I am talking about is off scope!!!

Nowhere in any army you get kills standing up, holding a 50 pound automatic weapon, without even friking aiming and yet kill people from 100 feet away! That's ridiculous even in an arcade game!