why is ramming so shunned in this game?

[roflrofl123]

Re: why is ramming so shunned in this game?

ramming is for noobs. close thread.

Nah, jihad jeeping probably one of the most effective ways to take out armour.

[Death Merchant]

Re: why is ramming so shunned in this game?

i dont see ramming or jihad jeeping as a bad tactic its valid in its own circumstances

an example: armour is coming at you from the front the guy in the vehicle cant see you yet but hes approching pritty fast with nowhere for your spec ops to go other than jump in a vehicle so you strap some c4 to a jeep then drive round and jihad him right in the rear

i dont see it as a noob tactic usually noobs fail in their jihadding attempts

[imported_[C*]Indest]

Re: why is ramming so shunned in this game?

I do some ramming, then get out of bed and play BF2

LOL

[Dairuka]

Re: why is ramming so shunned in this game?

Helos inflict more damage to the team than jets, thus I consider going into desperate attempt to "pull out at the last split second" and have an accident, acceptable.

I've never seen a helicopter go 99-0 on Wake, Dalian or Daqing before.

You guys are complaining a little too much about it. You know you wield terrible power when you fly a helo, and if theres a teamplayer on the other side they WILL want to take you out. After all, its the one who dies, who usually moans the most.

I can't stop jets from ruling the map, nor can I see every little infantryman wraggling around on the map. On stages like Daqing or Fushe, I can guarantee to you that Helicopters definitally do not rule the map. Mobile AA makes sure of that.

The person in the jet usually resorts to ramming, merely because he can't kill me in any other way. Hes tried his guns. Hes tried his missles. Lord knows he even tried bombing me when I went to repair at the helipad. He rams out of pride, or because they obviously haven't learned that Helicopters are erratic when it comes to evading. Maybe he rams me, because hes hoping to be able to carpet bomb the respawn of my helicopter for easy kills from then on?

If teamplay was really a factor, he'd have spent more time keeping my team's jets out of the air, rather then trying to down a solo helicopter for the past ten minutes. They usually think I'm an easy kill, thats why they go for it over and over and over again. As if I'm going to sit around and let a jet wittle down my helicopter's health with his vulture like tendencies.

If they haven't even come close to killing me in one pass, they shouldn't have been bothering in the first place. So why the hundreds of attempts and the ram finale?

Ramming is cheap because its a one-shot-kill, they are all considered "cheap" by those who die. The ammount of hypocrisy in this thread is apalling though.

Ramming is considered cheap not because it's a one-shot kill, but because there is quite simply nothing that the helicopter pilot can do to stop it from happening. No barrel roll, no loop, no fast turning, or divebombing can save you, when a malicious minded jet pilot comes for his two kills (they're usually dissapointed when they only get one kill) at the risk of one suicide death.

Ramming is the claymore spam of the sky.

[shadowmafia]

Re: why is ramming so shunned in this game?

i dont see ramming or jihad jeeping as a bad tactic its valid in its own circumstances

an example: armour is coming at you from the front the guy in the vehicle cant see you yet but hes approching pritty fast with nowhere for your spec ops to go other than jump in a vehicle so you strap some c4 to a jeep then drive round and jihad him right in the rear

i dont see it as a noob tactic usually noobs fail in their jihadding attempts

um....first of all, there is nowhere in the game where that situation could be true. You can always hide somewhere, ESPECIALLY if the tank doesn't see you yet. Second of all, you said you get in the jeep, then drive around and jihad in the rear.....I thought you said there was nowhere for you to go. All of a sudden, getting in a vehicle spawns a magic road that you can use to get around the tank? Basically, in that situation, you can stay on foot and use support to hide and C4 the tank when its close. Also, how is it that your worried the tank will see your body, but you jump in a huge vehicle and think hes still not gona see you?

It IS a noob tactic, because you took the noob way out. Instead of using some skill and planting C4 on the tank itself (sure it will be hard, but thats the whole point of skill), you take the easy route and suicide bomb him. Where is the skill? Dont try to argue that evading the tank and having him not see you is the skill there, because that is just lack of skill by the tank driver for not seeing a huge car coming towards him. Lack of skill on his part does NOT equall skill on your part.

Oh, and tell me on what map this situation would be possible. This would only work in a long alleyway with an exit in the front (tank coming here) and an exit in the back (you, with your magical jihad jeep that spawns a magical road to get around the tank). There are no places like this in the game.

[baggygreen]

Re: why is ramming so shunned in this game?

Personally, i dont mind it. The way the game was designed means that its gonna happen.

for instance:
Wake, you got a BH full of troops (6 kills) and the J10. looky here, 6 kills for the price of one. thats a kdr many people would love! the fact of the matter is, with the way the game works, that same pilot is able to get back in the jet and do the same thing.

Its in the game, it works for people, it takes away others' opportunities to get a higher score - thus it is shunned.

[shadowmafia]

Re: why is ramming so shunned in this game?

Personally, i dont mind it. The way the game was designed means that its gonna happen.

for instance:
Wake, you got a BH full of troops (6 kills) and the J10. looky here, 6 kills for the price of one. thats a kdr many people would love! the fact of the matter is, with the way the game works, that same pilot is able to get back in the jet and do the same thing.

Its in the game, it works for people, it takes away others' opportunities to get a higher score - thus it is shunned.

You can also shoot down that same helicopter with your J-10. What you just said there proves my point, its just taking the easy way out.

[Chris_Redfield]

Re: why is ramming so shunned in this game?

I've never seen a helicopter go 99-0 on Wake, Dalian or Daqing before.

Actually, Ive seen helo crews go as high as 100+, which is why I specifically said "when they are dealing with no contest". Ask anyone with brains enough, experience enough and they will tell you that helo crews are far more effective, theres really no need to even argue about this subject. Have you seen a jet crew drive USMC off the land in less than 4 minutes? Ive seen a chopper crew do that plenty.

I can't stop jets from ruling the map, nor can I see every little infantryman wraggling around on the map. On stages like Daqing or Fushe, I can guarantee to you that Helicopters definitally do not rule the map. Mobile AA makes sure of that.

"no contest". A helo CREW will take care of that mobile STA with ease, and then its ground rapage all over again.

The person in the jet usually resorts to ramming, merely because he can't kill me in any other way. Hes tried his guns. Hes tried his missles. Lord knows he even tried bombing me when I went to repair at the helipad. He rams out of pride, or because they obviously haven't learned that Helicopters are erratic when it comes to evading. Maybe he rams me, because hes hoping to be able to carpet bomb the respawn of my helicopter for easy kills from then on?

Obvious proof that you havent realy flown a jet to know why people ram choppers.

If teamplay was really a factor, he'd have spent more time keeping my team's jets out of the air, rather then trying to down a solo helicopter for the past ten minutes. They usually think I'm an easy kill, thats why they go for it over and over and over again. As if I'm going to sit around and let a jet wittle down my helicopter's health with his vulture like tendencies.

The easiest kills are ground kills, not choppers. And the reason oe would chase you for 20 passes, is because there are no other air targets for him.

If they haven't even come close to killing me in one pass, they shouldn't have been bothering in the first place. So why the hundreds of attempts and the ram finale?

Trying until the very end? Its not like they go and think "****, I cant take him, Ill just ram him!".

Ramming is considered cheap not because it's a one-shot kill, but because there is quite simply nothing that the helicopter pilot can do to stop it from happening. No barrel roll, no loop, no fast turning, or divebombing can save you, when a malicious minded jet pilot comes for his two kills (they're usually dissapointed when they only get one kill) at the risk of one suicide death.

You can "wiggle" your way out of a rammers way, it works using the same principles as TV missile shootouts, you gotta hit the hitbox. Which means that you can also manipulate your way so that the jet only clips you. You arent really that ignorant to believe that ramming is easier and more effective that missile spam, dont you?

Slow down, watch the flares go, watch the helo burn, and a jet has 375 metres and a whole second of time to do this.

Pilots ram because they want to take you with the cannons at full speed, many of them are newbies so they risk until the last moment and crash into you (peculiarly when the hello PITCHES UP!), and many experienced pilots also disengage too late.

Ramming is the claymore spam of the sky.

No its not. Dont be bitter because you cant handle rammers. Youre a hypocrite, you have great advice and some very good lines against people who complain about nade spam, yet you are complaining about rammers.

[Dairuka]

Re: why is ramming so shunned in this game?

Snip

I was going to respond to your entire post in peices like I did the last time, but you've essentially done nothing but called me a hypocrite for making assumptions; when you've done nothing but base your whole post on assumptions.

Perhaps Sloi could teach me the basics of this, 'Wiggle trick' you speak of, so that I may use it to counteract the process of jet ramming.

Wait. Sloi is against jet ramming also? Could it possible that TBF2's main helicopter advocate dislikes ramming even more than I do!? Good golly gee, maybe it's because this, 'wiggle trick' of yours is nothing more than a chance effect from a lucky evasion manuever. Were it possible to do it constantly, wouldn't it be part of Helicopter Tactics 101?

We may get 3 seconds to evade missles thanks to the lock-on warning, but there is no 'you gonna get rammed' siren to let us know when to 'wiggle' our way out of it.

It's okay to ram us with underpowered vehicles such as the J-10 though. It's a viable tactic to down those pesky overpowered helicopters. We're vastly more dangerous than any master pilot in a J-10.

As if Helicopters don't have enough to worry about from Transport Cars, APC's, Tanks, Attack Helicopters, Stingers/IGLA's, Mobile AA's, Jet Guns/Missles and Artillery. Now we have to sit back and accept Jet ramming as a valid tactic on us too.

What do Jets have to worry about again? I forgot.

Boy, I'd sure love to be able to intentionally ram a jet while it flies in the air. I'd do it non-stop to J-10's.

[Bronx19]

Re: why is ramming so shunned in this game?

Ive been banned from two servers, because I rammed one guy so many times he went mental, contacted one of his admin buddies, and they plotted against me.

My favorite map to use this tactic is Oman. And quiet often, I lead the board at the end. You not only get points when you kill, but you also get points when you recieve the 'you were killed by' message.

[Sloi sauce]

Re: why is ramming so shunned in this game?

You gentlemen are both right and I'll explain why.

A good helicopter (whether soloing or doubling) WILL ALWAYS do more damage than a jet when dealing with armored ground vehicles, other helicopters and the covering of flags for suppression or capture. However, the jet excels in specific areas and can be a real nuisance to the choppers if the pilot knows what he's doing.

In general, it's easy to avoid a jet on a collision course... unless the latter is intended on ramming into you, in which case, only a few techniques can save your butt... and even then, only in specific situations. Situational awareness, good timing and a fair bit of luck will be your saving grace, but a good helicopter is always busy dealing with targets, covering ground and counting down the seconds before going after respawned vehicles.

In other words, it's easy to avoid most ramming situations but timing and luck are important. Intentional rams are a different story... and most pilots on a suicide mission won't give you the benefit of a lock-on warning. Keep that in mind and consider how ridiculous it would be for a chopper team to constantly be shifting between the different camera angles while dealing with their main duties: now imagine the same for a soloer.

A proficient jet on your team really helps take the load off. Let's face it, good helis have their work cut out for them and are busy enough as it is...

[shadowmafia]

Re: why is ramming so shunned in this game?

Ive been banned from two servers, because I rammed one guy so many times he went mental, contacted one of his admin buddies, and they plotted against me.

My favorite map to use this tactic is Oman. And quiet often, I lead the board at the end. You not only get points when you kill, but you also get points when you recieve the 'you were killed by' message.

Good, I would have banned you in a heartbeat also. You just admited that you constantly rammed the same guy.....how much of a noob do you have to be that you can't kill him normally, that you have to jihad and kill yourself. 0 skill whatsoever


Edit: As far as the chopper/jet argument, I find that a lot (Id say most) of the rammings by jets into helicopters Ive seen is not intentianal. When trying to gun down a chopper, a lot of people wait till the last minute to pull away (as was already mentioned). This gets dangerous when the chopper is not facing you, so he doesnt know where you are, and therefore cant manuever away from you properly. This leads to him usually pitching up and you ramming him because you waited too long to pull away. I see jets and helos as EQUALLY usefull to a team. They both have their own strengths and weaknesses, and they use these in different areas. The best pilots of both vehicles can be equal on the leaderboards, so I wouldnt say that one is more beneficial than the other. Helos can suppress the enemy and kill infantry more efficiently, while taking out armor as well. Jets can bomb armor in a way that helos can't. They can be in and out with no risk of death at all usually. A helicopter has a lot to worry about because it is vulnerable hovering in the air while taking aim. A skilled jet pilot can shoot down a helicopter withought too much trouble Id say. Just because you cant do it, doesnt meen noone else can. Without friendly jets in the air, helicopters would have to worry about enemy helos, armor on the ground, aa turrets, AT missles, ect. They have enough to worry about as it is, and jets help alleviate some of that work. Without helicopters in the air, jets would have to worry about taking out taking out MORE armor, concentrating less on enemy aircraft that are attacking your troops, AA vehicles/turrets, and overall they wont be able to do their duties in the air that they should be. Theres no point in trying to argue which vehicle is more usefull in the air, so just end that right here.

[imported_[C*]Indest]

Re: why is ramming so shunned in this game?

I agree with your ShadowMafia,

But what frustrates me is why do they insist that they have pull up last second. Jets have all that speed, why not pull up a second before and do another run.

Do you see AT choppers ram into tanks and other vehciles? If they miss they tend to fly over and re-align.

Im not having ago at the Jet pilots, some are just to lazy or over confident.

I tend to find ramming happings more often on Gulf of Oman.

[shadowmafia]

Re: why is ramming so shunned in this game?

But what frustrates me is why do they insist that they have pull up last second. Jets have all that speed, why not pull up a second before and do another run.

Right, and I blame that on the pilot. I admit I have done this a lot, and I blame myself. You gotta know when to pull away and go around for a second try. When I do it, Im just focusing on gunning down the chopper, and I keep telling myself, "just a little bit more and he will blow up". Next thing I know Im about to hit him so I pull away. I always pull away in time to avoid the collision, but I always forget to anticipate his roll, or movement that may get in my path. Still my fault though.

Do you see AT choppers ram into tanks and other vehciles? If they miss they tend to fly over and re-align.

Actually, I do see that occasionally. Not as much as the jet scenario, but it does happen. Helicopter pilots try to aim down at the armor on the ground and blast it away with missles, then they realize they have had their nose down too long and wont be able to pull up fast enough, or overcompensated the dive and have too much momentum. Next thing you know they kill the tank they were trying to hit, but its too late to pull up and they smack the ground. This happened to me today in Oman. I was on the MEC airfield about to get into a jet when a helicopter tried to missle me before I could get to it. He killed me, then I hear him explode on the ground. He actually wrote after he respawned saying that he dove too low. Thats kind of the same thing as a jet pilot who doesnt pull away in time.

If its unintentional, I usually let it go. Even if it was a noob. Accidents happen.
If it happens more than once unintentionally, that person shouldnt be flying because he obviousely doesnt know how to properly control his aircraft.
If it is an INTENTIONAL ram, then thats what I have a problem with.

[WNx Makka99]

Re: why is ramming so shunned in this game?

aawwwwwww c'mon...isnt anyone gunna quote my funny comment on page 3?

anyways, ramming is for transvestite homosexuals with inverted penises