So this is IO..(infantry only)

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  • Bungalow_Bill

    #61
    Re: So this is IO..(infantry only)

    Let's face it the main reason people want IO mode is to help pad up those statistics. It's mind boggling I know but a lot of people seem to have a serious inferiority complex and BF2 statistics are a way for them to compensate.

    IO mode essentially takes all the required teamwork elements and required classes and tosses them in the dumpster and replaces it with more support nade spamming and medic revive whoring.

    Here's how a scenario would play out in normal mode and IO mode:

    Normal mode Karkand:

    Grenade rain as usual on Karkand but the vehicles which are essentially immunue to rain of grenades move up and take out the annoying spammers allowing the infantry to safetly move up. On the opposite team the camping long-range grenade spammers are quickly dispatched by a choice artillery strike. No one tactic is safe or immune to a counter attack. Suddenly teamwork is required as an APC rolls up to lay supressive fire down at a spawn. Medics are countered because under the superior fire power of an APC/tank they cannot make that sprint to his fallen teamate for easy revive points and if he tries both he and his teammate will be dead. The team has to have AT soldiers (all classes that are nonfactors in IO really) to counter the armor and push them back. The team has to have Spec Ops lone wolfs to invade the enemy base and disable the commander assets. Engineers lay mines to stop the armors advance and Spec Ops sets up a sneaky trap to destroy the armor heading down the path. The enemy team destroys the armor and allows a vital opening to their own armor to start pushing the enemy back and the cycle and delicate balance begins anew. No one class is dominant and superior weapons exist that keep the revive/grenade whores in check. The vehicles while powerful are nothing overwhemling when properly countered by the enemy team. This is called tactics and this is called TEAMWORK.

    Now let's play out the same scenario in IO mode:

    Grenade rain as usual on Karkand but the only difference being these type of whorish stat padding players go unchecked. No grenade-immune vehicles to push up the line and put some pressure on them. No artillery strikes to root out dug in grenade spammers camping behind the Karkand sandbags/fence. Medics and support class run wild with little to fear as it's an all out grenade - die - revive fest which essentially amounts to a stat padding loop. Because of the lack of serious real firepower (essentially a movable protective wall pushing up) or fast moving/airborne transport attacking the enemy team becomes extremely difficult. The end result? Camping on both sides with the continous grenade/die/revive loop happening throughout the duration of the round (with the odd claymore spammer thrown in fore spice) and many players who haven't really earned it getting well over 100+ points in an easy 12 minute round. Of course classes such as engineer, AT, asaault and Spec Ops are all but nonexistant. Without vehicles to challenge the enemy team depending on your teammates is NOT required and teamwork is NOT required.

    This isn't speculation this is fact. Go on any IO server and you'll see this pattern. On the large maps IO mode becomes a campfest as the walking distances become unreasonable and picking off attacking infantry is childs play.

    Without vehicles in this game the balance falls apart.

    F#@% you stat padder infantry whores for tainting my BALANCE and entertaining game.

    Comment

    • imported_jsr

      #62
      Re: So this is IO..(infantry only)

      Originally posted by PlaneWhore
      Let's face it the main reason people want IO mode is to help pad up those statistics. It's mind boggling I know but a lot of people seem to have a serious inferiority complex and BF2 statistics are a way for them to compensate.

      IO mode essentially takes all the required teamwork elements and required classes and tosses them in the dumpster and replaces it with more support nade spamming and medic revive whoring.

      Here's how a scenario would play out in normal mode and IO mode:

      Normal mode Karkand:

      Grenade rain as usual on Karkand but the vehicles which are essentially immunue to rain of grenades move up and take out the annoying spammers allowing the infantry to safetly move up. On the opposite team the camping long-range grenade spammers are quickly dispatched by a choice artillery strike. No one tactic is safe or immune to a counter attack. Suddenly teamwork is required as an APC rolls up to lay supressive fire down at a spawn. Medics are countered because under the superior fire power of an APC/tank they cannot make that sprint to his fallen teamate for easy revive points and if he tries both he and his teammate will be dead. The team has to have AT soldiers (all classes that are nonfactors in IO really) to counter the armor and push them back. The team has to have Spec Ops lone wolfs to invade the enemy base and disable the commander assets. Engineers lay mines to stop the armors advance and Spec Ops sets up a sneaky trap to destroy the armor heading down the path. The enemy team destroys the armor and allows a vital opening to their own armor to start pushing the enemy back and the cycle and delicate balance begins anew. No one class is dominant and superior weapons exist that keep the revive/grenade whores in check.

      Now let's play out the same scenario in IO mode:

      Grenade rain as usual on Karkand but the only difference being these type of whorish stat padding players go unchecked. No grenade-immune vehicles to push up the line and put some pressure on them. No artillery strikes to root out dug in grenade spammers camping behind the Karkand sandbags/fence. Medics and support class run wild with little to fear as it's an all out grenade - die - revive fest which essentially amounts to a stat padding loop. Because of the lack of serious real firepower (essentially a movable protective wall pushing up) or fast moving/airborne transport attacking the enemy team becomes extremely difficult. The end result? Camping on both sides with the continous grenade/die/revive loop happening throughout the duration of the round (with the odd claymore spammer thrown in fore spice) and many players who haven't really earned it getting well over 100+ points in an easy 12 minute round. Of course classes such as engineer, AT, asaault and Spec Ops are all but nonexistant. Without vehicles to challenge the enemy team depending on your teammates is NOT required and teamwork is NOT required.

      This isn't speculation this is fact. Go on any IO server and you'll see this pattern. On the large maps IO mode becomes a campfest as the walking distances become unreasonable and picking off attacking infantry is childs play.

      Without vehicles in this game the balance falls apart.

      F#@% you stat padder infantry whores for tainting my BALANCE and entertaining game.

      Cute speech, but did you ever consider the possibility that maybe some people don't really get off to vehicles?
      Believe it or not, but a lot of people who play bf2 also play other first person shooters.

      We don’t all spend 12 hours a day masturbating to Tom Clancy novels you know, some of us just like to run around killing crap in a first person shooter type of environment.

      Besides, if you don’t like it, why do you even care about it?

      Personally I think jet maps are retarded, it reminds me of Nintendo 64 kiddie crap like Star Fox, but I don't bother people who enjoy that sort of thing.

      Comment

      • MeNoPausE

        #63
        Re: So this is IO..(infantry only)

        I guess all IO supporters need to convey that we won't completely turn our backs on vehicle enabled servers. Maybe then less tears will be shed. I for one love the chance to choose but I will play on both equally.

        Comment

        • Bungalow_Bill

          #64
          Re: So this is IO..(infantry only)

          Originally posted by jsr
          Cute speech, but did you ever consider the possibility that maybe some people don't really get off to vehicles?
          That's fine. That's why DICE included other modes of play aside from vehicles. I don't get off on snipers (I find them quite annoying actually) and I constantly find myself running in to their claymores and get shot by them. I unlike others however realize the sniper is just one piece in a balanced tapestry of gameplay. I don't favor removing the sniper just as much as I'd favor removing any other core element of the gameplay just to make things easier for myself.

          Originally posted by jsr
          Believe it or not, but a lot of people who play bf2 also play other first person shooters.
          Actually I find that hard to believe. If this were true then when these IO crybabies wanted a head on infantry only battle they'd go play one of the other oh... thousands of online FPS that don't have vehicles.

          Originally posted by jsr
          some of us just like to run around killing crap in a first person shooter type of environment.
          Wait so you're trying to tell me that you're unable to do that with vehicles on a map? I just came from a game of 64 player Karkand with *gasp* vehicles. Playing purely as a medic I ended the round with over 100 points and 28 kills even with 2 APCs and a tank roaming the map. In fact they never even killed me the entire round because when I play a medic just to "shoot crap" I play in a smart enough fashion that allows me to shoot crap and avoid the vehicles.

          Originally posted by jsr
          Besides, if you don’t like it, why do you even care about it?
          Because it does effect me and every other Battlefield 2 player. I don't care to rehash the same undisputable points over and over again so if you need a refresher go read my post history for a while as I've clearly stated all my gripes about IO and how it effects *me* and others who don't play it.

          Originally posted by jsr
          Personally I think jet maps are retarded, it reminds me of Nintendo 64 kiddie crap like Star Fox, but I don't bother people who enjoy that sort of thing.
          That's your (stupid) opinion and you're entitled to it. In fact DICE has already included an "IO mode" of sorts for you to enjoy. Over half the maps in the game do not have airplanes period. If you drop the maps down to smaller sizes then suddenly even the airplane heavy maps have no vehicles whatsoever. If that STILL isn't good enough for you then you can choose to play on an unranked server and implement any whacky rule you like. You can have a "AT rocket only" server for all I care just keep your stat padding grenade spamming *** off my ranked servers where I play the game as it was intended.

          Comment

          • Dairuka
            Member
            • Aug 2006
            • 2730

            #65
            Re: So this is IO..(infantry only)

            I'd rather just see planes brought down in line in terms of balance with Armor, and Infantry.

            Give Anti-Tank a Surface-to-Air Missle that acts like a stationary AA, and I'll play on Wake again. :laugh:

            Comment

            • zipp0r

              #66
              Re: So this is IO..(infantry only)

              Originally posted by jsr
              Cute speech, but did you ever consider the possibility that maybe some people don't really get off to vehicles?
              Believe it or not, but a lot of people who play bf2 also play other first person shooters.

              We don’t all spend 12 hours a day masturbating to Tom Clancy novels you know, some of us just like to run around killing crap in a first person shooter type of environment.

              Besides, if you don’t like it, why do you even care about it?

              Personally I think jet maps are retarded, it reminds me of Nintendo 64 kiddie crap like Star Fox, but I don't bother people who enjoy that sort of thing.
              he is 100% right tho. these players should go and play another game as bf2 is all about vehicles. without them its just a lame statpadding game.

              Comment

              • Turnip

                #67
                Re: So this is IO..(infantry only)

                Originally posted by zipp0r
                he is 100% right tho. these players should go and play another game as bf2 is all about vehicles. without them its just a lame statpadding game.
                Actually it still is a squad based team fps, its not as bad as all you make it out to be. Theres no wall of gernades you cant get past, but it would be better if they got rid of some of the nades and invincible claymores. Its got the same problems as on vanilla.

                Comment

                • Lazza66

                  #68
                  Re: So this is IO..(infantry only)

                  Originally posted by PlaneWhore
                  Now let's play out the same scenario in IO mode:

                  Grenade rain as usual on Karkand but the only difference being these type of whorish stat padding players go unchecked. No grenade-immune vehicles to push up the line and put some pressure on them. No artillery strikes to root out dug in grenade spammers camping behind the Karkand sandbags/fence. Medics and support class run wild with little to fear as it's an all out grenade - die - revive fest which essentially amounts to a stat padding loop. Because of the lack of serious real firepower (essentially a movable protective wall pushing up) or fast moving/airborne transport attacking the enemy team becomes extremely difficult. The end result? Camping on both sides with the continous grenade/die/revive loop happening throughout the duration of the round (with the odd claymore spammer thrown in fore spice) and many players who haven't really earned it getting well over 100+ points in an easy 12 minute round. Of course classes such as engineer, AT, asaault and Spec Ops are all but nonexistant. Without vehicles to challenge the enemy team depending on your teammates is NOT required and teamwork is NOT required.
                  And this is exactly what the 1.4 beta testers are reporting. Of course there are those that say it's all good and don't mind the "hop, hop, prone, nade throw, die, revive" loop, but then thats only because they're there singly for the points whoring.

                  IMO the stats whoring has gotten so deep into these "players" psyches that I have no respect at all anymore for the opinion of players who exclusively play Karkand.

                  After 1.4 comes out you will all prove me right. In less than 2 weeks IO servers running full map rotations will be barren. But the IO 24/7 Karkand will be full of nade spamming, reviving point whoring "groundpounders".

                  And DICE will have wasted all the work put into what should have been another game mode, when all they should have done was remove the vehicles from Karkand.

                  Originally posted by MeNoPausE
                  LOL, I am not a karkand whore!!!
                  Are you saying this isn't you?



                  Maybe Karkand whore was too specific, since you have some time elsewhere, maybe infantry map whore is more agreeable to you.

                  Originally posted by MeNoPausE
                  I don't play enough to be considered a whore in any shape or form. You are pretty foolish though, you are basing all your anger and misguided negativity on what you assume will happen after the new patch comes out. I think you know the old saying about assumptions and asses...
                  Yet it's okay for you to speak for all "people". And similarly it's ok for you to make assumptions? Hypocritical to say the least. Additionally, I never liked the term "whore" when referring to any player, but since the IO supporters labelled me with it I have made a point of labelling anyone who disagrees with anything I say as a ?something? whore. 8)

                  Originally posted by MeNoPausE
                  I hope the "Old loyal community" doesn't punish you for calling people whores on their behalf. And last time I checked, BF2 seemed to exist due to EA/Dice, not you and the old guys, if they want to add IO just deal with it. I'm sure if they introduced Air Whore Only server option you'd be all up in there!
                  Actually I'm an engy / armour specialist. But lately I've tried to do nothing but fly, I want to get inside their heads. Challenges like this are not only possible, but interesting in vanilla BF2.

                  Originally posted by MeNoPausE
                  1. Servers that appeal will be halved in number.

                  doesn't that tell you something?
                  Well, obviously it tells me theres two game modes now.

                  Originally posted by MeNoPausE
                  2. Favourite server may be switched to IO.

                  seems like everyone wants to play IO!
                  A delinquency leak, lol.

                  Originally posted by MeNoPausE
                  3. Less players on vanilla servers, less players on IO servers.

                  we will have to wait and see.

                  4. Less appealing servers available, game declines.

                  I think more options for server choice, game excels.
                  LOL.

                  Originally posted by MeNoPausE
                  5. IO spam / stat pad fest disillusions new players, diminishing noob numbers.

                  what the hell are you talking about??? vehicle whoring/spamming has been a problem from the start.
                  Oh silly me. Yes, of course, making it worse will be better.

                  Originally posted by MeNoPausE
                  6. Game direction (BF3) alters.

                  The game direction is the same, nothings changed. spawn/kill/cap/respawn, whether in a vehicle or on foot.
                  Umm, try thinking harder about the definition of "game direction".

                  Originally posted by MeNoPausE
                  7. Old loyal community (BF42) loses their favourite franchise (no more appealing titles).

                  I doubt that, BF2 has been around for a while and people lose interest cause of that, communities dwindle naturally. I bet you will still be interested in upcoming BF titles.
                  Hmm, two more assumptions, yet I'm not allowed to make assumptions. Strange.

                  Comment

                  • Bungalow_Bill

                    #69
                    Re: So this is IO..(infantry only)

                    Originally posted by Lazza66
                    And this is exactly what the 1.4 beta testers are reporting. Of course there are those that say it's all good and don't mind the "hop, hop, prone, nade throw, die, revive" loop, but then thats only because they're there singly for the points whoring.

                    IMO the stats whoring has gotten so deep into these "players" psyches that I have no respect at all anymore for the opinion of players who exclusively play Karkand.

                    After 1.4 comes out you will all prove me right. In less than 2 weeks IO servers running full map rotations will be barren. But the IO 24/7 Karkand will be full of nade spamming, reviving point whoring "groundpounders".

                    And DICE will have wasted all the work put into what should have been another game mode, when all they should have done was remove the vehicles from Karkand.
                    You know Lazza when I read your first post in this thread I thought to myself "finally someone who else knows what they are talking about" and following posts have only strengthened that opinion. Back to IO mode imbalances... I made this prediction a LONG time before IO mode came out though because it's simple gameplay dynamic really and you don't need to see it in action to understand the consequences if you've got a big juicy brain like myself. But it doesn't take a Napoleon or Sun Tzu to see the end result of such a drastic gameplay change either (but don't expect to see it if you're an idiot).

                    I'm very experienced with both vehicles and infantry and it pretty much boils down to it like this. If your infantry sucks then you can be the biggest badass ever in that tank gorging yourself with countless enemy kills but your team is still going to lose badly because you're not moving forward and capping flags. The skill and teamwork factor of your infantry force is the biggest factor in deciding who is going to win a game because in the same regard that infantry is critical for capturing points it is also critical that they work together to hault and defeat an enemies vehicles (AT, C4, TOW, Mines, S2A ... whatever).

                    This is the first part of balance and the counterbalance to the above is vehicles. Without vehicles this whole infantry/vehicle balance breaks down and the game becomes a stat padding cluster f@%^.

                    The flip side of this balance on a regular server is that if your vehicles suck (or in the case of IO don't exist) you get bogged down and have serious trouble breaking through the enemies defenses (but at LEAST the means exist!). Defending is easier than attacking in Battlefield 2 and this is the case with most games. This problem is compounded in IO because as a result of the absence of vehicles and artillery the enemy team no longer has a need for AT/Spec Ops/Assault/Engineer (while critical classes for dealing/managing vehicles are useless in any other function) and as a result the defending force has more medics, snipers laying claymores and support spamming grenades which makes the enemy defense even HARDER to break.

                    So hard will the defenses be in many cases in fact I think both teams will give up attacking and just sit back in a defensive fashion and spam nades and revive fallen teammates with the "stat paddles". The end result of this is exactly what I believe is the main reason most people want IO - and that is easy statistics. What a sorry excuse for gameplay IO will be. It hurts the community, it degrades the whole Battlefield 2 series and it wasted a huge chunk of DICE developement time.

                    Who would've rather instead of IO mode had reworked S2A, A2A missiles, destructable claymores and balance aircraft? *Raise hand!* That alone would've alleviated a huge number of gripes that infantry players have with vehicles on certain maps and would've made some maps where some vehicles such as the J-10 (for example) much more managable and balanced.

                    This whole thing is a fiasco and it really does piss me off.

                    Comment

                    • imported_jsr

                      #70
                      Re: So this is IO..(infantry only)

                      Originally posted by PlaneWhore
                      That's fine. That's why DICE included other modes of play aside from vehicles. I don't get off on snipers (I find them quite annoying actually) and I constantly find myself running in to their claymores and get shot by them. I unlike others however realize the sniper is just one piece in a balanced tapestry of gameplay. I don't favor removing the sniper just as much as I'd favor removing any other core element of the gameplay just to make things easier for myself.


                      Actually I find that hard to believe. If this were true then when these IO crybabies wanted a head on infantry only battle they'd go play one of the other oh... thousands of online FPS that don't have vehicles.


                      Wait so you're trying to tell me that you're unable to do that with vehicles on a map? I just came from a game of 64 player Karkand with *gasp* vehicles. Playing purely as a medic I ended the round with over 100 points and 28 kills even with 2 APCs and a tank roaming the map. In fact they never even killed me the entire round because when I play a medic just to "shoot crap" I play in a smart enough fashion that allows me to shoot crap and avoid the vehicles.


                      Because it does effect me and every other Battlefield 2 player. I don't care to rehash the same undisputable points over and over again so if you need a refresher go read my post history for a while as I've clearly stated all my gripes about IO and how it effects *me* and others who don't play it.


                      That's your (stupid) opinion and you're entitled to it. In fact DICE has already included an "IO mode" of sorts for you to enjoy. Over half the maps in the game do not have airplanes period. If you drop the maps down to smaller sizes then suddenly even the airplane heavy maps have no vehicles whatsoever. If that STILL isn't good enough for you then you can choose to play on an unranked server and implement any whacky rule you like. You can have a "AT rocket only" server for all I care just keep your stat padding grenade spamming *** off my ranked servers where I play the game as it was intended.

                      Cry me a river please.

                      Look, infantry combat in BF2 is NOTHING like the straight forward first-person shooter atmosphere found in any other game.

                      Quake, Wolfenstein, Unreal, Painkiller, Call of Duty, Counter-Strike, not one of these feel even remotely like BF2.

                      I'm not saying any of these games is superior to the next, but they all have their own unique feel and while I could sit here all day and point out the problems BF2 infantry combat has, I (like a large number of people) do enjoy it.

                      No one is saying IO mode needs to replace Vanilla, it's just a diversion.

                      It's no different than a mod really, just something different to break the monotony of playing the same old maps, in the same fashion day after day.

                      Now as for your obsession with it being ranked, so what if it is?

                      For someone who claims to not care about stats, you seem to be wound pretty tight about people getting points (they don’t matter anyways right?) for playing on these servers.

                      I’m going to go out on a limb here and guess you are worried about players abandoning vanilla servers in favor of IO ones, and in turn, your 47 page essays on video game airplane imbalance will have an even smaller audience…

                      But whatever, if you don't like it, don't play it.
                      Simple as that, you can stop crying now, case closed.




                      Originally posted by PlaneWhore
                      just keep your stat padding grenade spamming *** off my ranked servers where I play the game as it was intended.
                      Missed that gem.
                      I'm not even going to bother reading anything else you post; I thought for a second that you might at least be a level-headed competitive type that just has a different opinion.

                      Anyone who would drop a line like "stat padding grenade spamming ***" pretty much red flags themselves as role-playing pub warrior hell bent on living out his Tom Cruise fantasies through a video game.


                      Comment

                      • pYura

                        #71
                        Re: So this is IO..(infantry only)

                        Originally posted by Harmor
                        This is what they should had done:

                        1. 'Vehicle-lite' ranked map option:
                        • Replace Tank/APC spawns with Heavy Jeeps
                        • Replace AA vehicle spawns with Light Jeeps
                        • Remove Jets
                        • Replace Littlebird and Attack Helicopter spawns with Transport Helicopters


                        2. 'Vehicle-neutered' ranked map option:
                        Same as above but weapon's on the transport vehicles removed.

                        3. Also they should add 'Supply-line' ranked map option (you can only take flags in a certain order - the flag available to take would be highlighted in your HUD like a wounded soldier, except semi-transparent grey)

                        ALL maps of ALL sizes and ALL kits will be playable.
                        This is the best solution ever...

                        Comment

                        • pYura

                          #72
                          Re: So this is IO..(infantry only)

                          Let's face it the main reason people DONT want IO mode is becouse they rather vehicle whore wich won t produce points so fast as the IO mode will. They dont want to play IO and they also dont want others to score faster than they do.

                          Guys, if you are not in the top10 it is not a race... forget about you global score, its meaningless...

                          Comment

                          • imported_jsr

                            #73
                            Re: So this is IO..(infantry only)

                            Originally posted by pYura
                            Let's face it the main reason people DONT want IO mode is becouse they rather vehicle whore wich won t produce points so fast as the IO mode will. They dont want to play IO and they also dont want others to score faster than they do.

                            Guys, if you are not in the top10 it is not a race... forget about you global score, its meaningless...

                            It’s meaningless period.
                            Don't get me wrong, the stats and points thing is a fun and unique twist on the usual first-person shooter (even with vehicles) game play, but people put way too much emphasis on how well others are scoring.

                            I admit, I actually had fun going after some of the badges (expert knife was a ***** back on my old account before they changed the criteria) but I never gave a crap about the people who went to K/P servers to get theirs.

                            Comment

                            • Turnip

                              #74
                              Re: So this is IO..(infantry only)

                              In the words of samuel jackson

                              "I have had it with these mother Fu$#en tanks, and these mother fu$#en planes."

                              Comment

                              • SaS|firestorm

                                #75
                                Re: So this is IO..(infantry only)

                                lol sounds exciting...

                                Comment

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