Bashandslash Twitter/Webcast Confirms Changes for PC

[Dr Random]

Re: Bashandslash Twitter/Webcast Confirms Changes for PC

While I've never been a Treyarch fan I believe your right B|Rec.D-Man24.

[ThQp]

Re: Bashandslash Twitter/Webcast Confirms Changes for PC

After reading through this, I'm a little confused by everyone's comments. Readings things like "they don't know what this will do", "Steam sucks", and "let's hope Treyarch learns from these mistakes" really makes me wonder if you all understand that IW understands this whole situation much better than we do.

This isn't Gearbox with Borderlands. Had it been, the lack of dedicated servers would've been much more important. Whereas Gearbox hasn't necessarily found a winning formula with the Brother in Arms franchise, Infinity Ward obviously has with Call of Duty. There is also the matter of Treyarch, the other developer of the series. Do you think Activision didn't know what was going on here? Of course they did, otherwise they wouldn't have let it happen.

How you can sit here and tell me that IWNet is going to wreck the online experience is beyond me. When Blizzard launched Warcraft (different genre, I know), did anyone expect those servers to hold all the people they hold? I would think not. Guess what? Those servers that run Warcraft - Activision owns them, just as Activision owns IWNet.

Before you go saying that none of this will work, just ask yourself "have I actually tried it first-hand?" I think the answer will be no. As smart as all us commentators of the gaming industry are, its the owners of the gaming industry who really know what they're doing, whether you like it or not.

[Fallendreams]

Re: Bashandslash Twitter/Webcast Confirms Changes for PC

After reading through this, I'm a little confused by everyone's comments. Readings things like "they don't know what this will do", "Steam sucks", and "let's hope Treyarch learns from these mistakes" really makes me wonder if you all understand that IW understands this whole situation much better than we do.

This isn't Gearbox with Borderlands. Had it been, the lack of dedicated servers would've been much more important. Whereas Gearbox hasn't necessarily found a winning formula with the Brother in Arms franchise, Infinity Ward obviously has with Call of Duty. There is also the matter of Treyarch, the other developer of the series. Do you think Activision didn't know what was going on here? Of course they did, otherwise they wouldn't have let it happen.

How you can sit here and tell me that IWNet is going to wreck the online experience is beyond me. When Blizzard launched Warcraft (different genre, I know), did anyone expect those servers to hold all the people they hold? I would think not. Guess what? Those servers that run Warcraft - Activision owns them, just as Activision owns IWNet.

Before you go saying that none of this will work, just ask yourself "have I actually tried it first-hand?" I think the answer will be no. As smart as all us commentators of the gaming industry are, its the owners of the gaming industry who really know what they're doing, whether you like it or not.

+1

but dedi servers is what makes my computer exp. but im willing to give this IWNet Try, but i understand why everyone is upset. Its ruins the CoD Exp. we all know and love.... and as IW Website banning goes thats BS! PC Players have as much right to express them selfs about this.... if it was a Console thing being remove they would ***** too! and i realy dont feel like hearing little 12 year old 360 players *****. Console players have no right to start a war with us! But what can you do there 12 year olds. :laugh:

[ch3ch3n]

Re: Bashandslash Twitter/Webcast Confirms Changes for PC

so basicly does this mean we get a server browser like in gears of war and halo3 ?

[ThQp]

Re: Bashandslash Twitter/Webcast Confirms Changes for PC

but dedi servers is what makes my computer exp. but im willing to give this IWNet Try, but i understand why everyone is upset. Its ruins the CoD Exp. we all know and love.... and as IW Website banning goes thats BS! PC Players have as much right to express them selfs about this.... if it was a Console thing being remove they would ***** too! and i realy dont feel like hearing little 12 year old 360 players *****. Console players have no right to start a war with us! But what can you do there 12 year olds. :laugh:

While I agree with you that what is happening on their forums shouldn't be, that's something that most people have confused. It seems that people are now just tacking that on to a list of complaints they already had building. Does it matter what a moderator is doing on their forum? Is that going to screw around with your server? I think not. Put yourself in the situation where you're a volunteer on a forum, and a man working for the company has said something to anger entire community. You'd be trying anything and everything to get them to shut up, it's only natural.

What would happen here? Say Tim was going to shut down Total Battlefield, but announced it publicly first. Well, we'd have an awful lot of angry posts, some of which are most definitely crossing our forum rules. For that reason, they would be dealt with accordingly. Know what? We, the moderators, would be hated for following our own rules which have been set in place for four years. That's just how things go.

[Fallendreams]

Re: Bashandslash Twitter/Webcast Confirms Changes for PC

While I agree with you that what is happening on their forums shouldn't be, that's something that most people have confused. It seems that people are now just tacking that on to a list of complaints they already had building. Does it matter what a moderator is doing on their forum? Is that going to screw around with your server? I think not. Put yourself in the situation where you're a volunteer on a forum, and a man working for the company has said something to anger entire community. You'd be trying anything and everything to get them to shut up, it's only natural.

What would happen here? Say Tim was going to shut down Total Battlefield, but announced it publicly first. Well, we'd have an awful lot of angry posts, some of which are most definitely crossing our forum rules. For that reason, they would be dealt with accordingly. Know what? We, the moderators, would be hated for following our own rules which have been set in place for four years. That's just how things go.

True. IMO i just feel like on IW Website 360 players can say whatever they want and get away with it. but A PC gamers make a thread about Boycotting and it gets deleted.... but for ppl who break the rules, well then they deserve the month ban.

Im not Angry with IW i just wish they would have told us this 6 months to year ago what there plans where for us . I mean when someone ask 402 about how the muliplayer exp. was going to be for PC, he said it was going to stay the same.... thats just where im did IW want him to lie becuz they knew we would be mad and upset ? or is this IW Net some half *** thing they put together this month becuz they knew they where going to fall behind and not make the date ?

[[Expletive Deleted]]

Re: Bashandslash Twitter/Webcast Confirms Changes for PC

After reading through this, I'm a little confused by everyone's comments. Readings things like "they don't know what this will do", "Steam sucks", and "let's hope Treyarch learns from these mistakes" really makes me wonder if you all understand that IW understands this whole situation much better than we do.

This isn't Gearbox with Borderlands. Had it been, the lack of dedicated servers would've been much more important. Whereas Gearbox hasn't necessarily found a winning formula with the Brother in Arms franchise, Infinity Ward obviously has with Call of Duty. There is also the matter of Treyarch, the other developer of the series. Do you think Activision didn't know what was going on here? Of course they did, otherwise they wouldn't have let it happen.

How you can sit here and tell me that IWNet is going to wreck the online experience is beyond me. When Blizzard launched Warcraft (different genre, I know), did anyone expect those servers to hold all the people they hold? I would think not. Guess what? Those servers that run Warcraft - Activision owns them, just as Activision owns IWNet.

Before you go saying that none of this will work, just ask yourself "have I actually tried it first-hand?" I think the answer will be no. As smart as all us commentators of the gaming industry are, its the owners of the gaming industry who really know what they're doing, whether you like it or not.

I'm sure Flagship thought they knew what they were doing with Hellgate: London. :shakehead:
I'm sure Monolith thought they were doing with F.E.A.R.2. :shakehead:
I'm sure id thought they knew what they were doing with Quake Wars. :shakehead:
Pretty much everyone said the same thing about those games: "This isn't some little punk startup studio. These guys are pros, know what they're doing, and know more than you. So STFU, buy the game, and whine about it if it sucks later."
All of those games came from what should have been awesome pedigrees. Some of the rockstars of PC gaming have made some horrendous mistakes.

And Battlenet is NOTHING like IWNet based on 402's comments. Battlenet is run on their dedicated servers, lots of powerful servers. IW Net relies on clients to host, IW Net is just the matchmaking service/servers. They aren't hosting the games at all, XXXXSn1p3rXXXX1434(Because 1433 people stole his name first) will be hosting it from home with his $25 a month AT&T DSL at 3MB down 512Kb up. There is a huge difference. People have tried relying on listen servers on the PC recently, and it's never been pretty.

Their winning formula with making games doesn't extend to creating new tech and changing the entire way PC games are played.
The other systems that use this method have been horrible when I've experienced them. The waiting, the lag, the abusive hosts, the racist/homophobic voice chat... Does bringing Xbox Live to the PC seem like that great of an idea to you?
It might work on Live somewhat because it's a closed platform. What about hacking, though? Or glitching or racism or any of the other pain in the *** things people do? If there is no dedicated server, there is no admin except for the host. If the host is the one doing it, all you can do is leave. But as we've seen on Live, you stand a very good chance of jumping right back into that lobby again and again.

[ThQp]

Re: Bashandslash Twitter/Webcast Confirms Changes for PC

Flagship? Monolith? I would think that when Hellgate and FEAR 2 were released you didn't view them the same way you do Infinity Ward. Infinity Ward simply ranks higher on the list of gaming developers, they also rank higher on the list of those with successful titles.

As far as id and Quake Wars goes...that had nothing to do with servers (remember, that is the issue here), that was just a broken game that nobody wanted to play. It was released in Q4 of '07, quite possibly the most FPS-heavy month of all time.

And winning formula for making games doesn't mean they can change the way games are played? What did Nintendo do in the 1980s? Surely they were even smaller than Infinity Ward is back then. I just don't understand how you can judge the product before it's been released. I guess that's what happens when all we want to do is complain.

[[MyIS]Tim]

Re: Bashandslash Twitter/Webcast Confirms Changes for PC

I'm sure Flagship thought they knew what they were doing with Hellgate: London. :shakehead:
I'm sure Monolith thought they were doing with F.E.A.R.2. :shakehead:
I'm sure id thought they knew what they were doing with Quake Wars. :shakehead:
Pretty much everyone said the same thing about those games: "This isn't some little punk startup studio. These guys are pros, know what they're doing, and know more than you. So STFU, buy the game, and whine about it if it sucks later."
All of those games came from what should have been awesome pedigrees. Some of the rockstars of PC gaming have made some horrendous mistakes.

And Battlenet is NOTHING like IWNet based on 402's comments. Battlenet is run on their dedicated servers, lots of powerful servers. IW Net relies on clients to host, IW Net is just the matchmaking service/servers. They aren't hosting the games at all, XXXXSn1p3rXXXX1434(Because 1433 people stole his name first) will be hosting it from home with his $25 a month AT&T DSL at 3MB down 512Kb up. There is a huge difference. People have tried relying on listen servers on the PC recently, and it's never been pretty.

Their winning formula with making games doesn't extend to creating new tech and changing the entire way PC games are played.
The other systems that use this method have been horrible when I've experienced them. The waiting, the lag, the abusive hosts, the racist/homophobic voice chat... Does bringing Xbox Live to the PC seem like that great of an idea to you?
It might work on Live somewhat because it's a closed platform. What about hacking, though? Or glitching or racism or any of the other pain in the *** things people do? If there is no dedicated server, there is no admin except for the host. If the host is the one doing it, all you can do is leave. But as we've seen on Live, you stand a very good chance of jumping right back into that lobby again and again.

well said... :salute:

As far as id and Quake Wars goes...that had nothing to do with servers (remember, that is the issue here), that was just a broken game that nobody wanted to play. It was released in Q4 of '07, quite possibly the most FPS-heavy month of all time.

i would agree somewhat, but lets toss in FFOW and the lack of mod tools
look what that did to an awesome game :P

the game rocked but the late addition of Ded servers and no mod tools killed that game instantly :salute:

mind you that alot of todays developers came from modding, are they forgetting who took them to the dance in the first place?

what if all games stopped allowing mod tools, what would tommorrows developers be like?

[iQue]

Re: Bashandslash Twitter/Webcast Confirms Changes for PC

Flagship? Monolith? I would think that when Hellgate and FEAR 2 were released you didn't view them the same way you do Infinity Ward. Infinity Ward simply ranks higher on the list of gaming developers, they also rank higher on the list of those with successful titles.

As far as id and Quake Wars goes...that had nothing to do with servers (remember, that is the issue here), that was just a broken game that nobody wanted to play. It was released in Q4 of '07, quite possibly the most FPS-heavy month of all time.

And winning formula for making games doesn't mean they can change the way games are played? What did Nintendo do in the 1980s? Surely they were even smaller than Infinity Ward is back then. I just don't understand how you can judge the product before it's been released. I guess that's what happens when all we want to do is complain.

Thing is that they aren't actually just changing the online system of the game, they are actually making it worse. No dedicated servers is horrible news no matter how good the matchmaking or IW.net is.

VAC, steam support, great! But no dedicated servers means that no matter how great all the other stuff is the online experience is bound to get worse. No community servers. (Very likely no mods and custom content). Lag. Lag. Lag.

It's like getting enough money to buy whatever you want, but only if you agree to get kicked in the balls every 10 seconds for the rest of your life.

[[Expletive Deleted]]

Re: Bashandslash Twitter/Webcast Confirms Changes for PC

Flagship? Monolith? I would think that when Hellgate and FEAR 2 were released you didn't view them the same way you do Infinity Ward. Infinity Ward simply ranks higher on the list of gaming developers, they also rank higher on the list of those with successful titles.

As far as id and Quake Wars goes...that had nothing to do with servers (remember, that is the issue here), that was just a broken game that nobody wanted to play. It was released in Q4 of '07, quite possibly the most FPS-heavy month of all time.

And winning formula for making games doesn't mean they can change the way games are played? What did Nintendo do in the 1980s? Surely they were even smaller than Infinity Ward is back then. I just don't understand how you can judge the product before it's been released. I guess that's what happens when all we want to do is complain.

Quake Wars was an example of an "infallible" developer failing miserably.
Hell, no one thought Daikatana would be such a steaming turd, either.
My examples weren't so much about dedicated servers, more about blindly trusting developers.
And honestly, the creative guys behind Diablo II have as much credibility to me as IW. Really?

IW really should have announced this move earlier than three weeks before launch. They also should have had a real open beta to test this technology before demanding $60 for untested and unproven matchmaking. An internal beta of what, 100 people? That's enough to run this into the ground?

[ThQp]

Re: Bashandslash Twitter/Webcast Confirms Changes for PC

Again, where are your numbers coming from. 100 people? Doubtful. Look at what they do with the Battlefield series' semi-private betas. Much more than 100 people get in on that. Is it really reasonable to think they don't know the risk in this technology? Is it really reasonable to think they wouldn't test it to their fullest capacity to ensure it won't flop on them?

Hell, when On-Live was announced, everyone loved the idea and very little complaints were given over the technology. Do the folks behind On-Live know this is difficult to do? Of course, that's why they've been testing it. Companies who try to change these things aren't just putting an alpha version out to the community and call it the finished product. They're testing it repeatedly with large audiences to give as complete an experience as possible.

100 people? Really?

[iQue]

Re: Bashandslash Twitter/Webcast Confirms Changes for PC

Just a month ago IW said they weren't making any basic changes to the PC MP formula, and look where we are now

[imported_Will]

Re: Bashandslash Twitter/Webcast Confirms Changes for PC

****No vulgar language pics please, thank you**** - JoMaMaz

[SnakePL]

Re: Bashandslash Twitter/Webcast Confirms Changes for PC

The reason why I'm pissed is that they are pretty much making a straight port. That's why no dedi servers... They are cheap and greedy bunch of fellas, that's all I have to say.

They explain their decision through "integration". W T F
WHO ASKED FOR THIS?
If you asked 1000 CoD franchise PC fans if they want dedicated servers in MW2, they would all say HELL YES. If someone said otherwise, then they are not PC gamers or they are semi-retarded...

Setting up dedicated server support would cost money, and that's what matters the most to these people. Actually, that's the only thing that matters.

$60 goes to L4D2 or Borderlands.