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Final solution to BF 2 soloing: Let's all convert to Project Reality! :yay::laugh:Comment
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Playing for yourself and contributing to the team are not two, mutually exclusive things, ElFipso: while I derive more satisfaction from soloing and often don't specifically look out for my teammates, the actions I take still have a huge impact on our success. You can play for yourself and still do more for the team than someone who truly sets out to help...
As far as the soloing goes, I don't think people need to worry about it for much longer, seeing as an increasing number of servers includes "no soloing/seat-switching/hot-seating" rules.Comment
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Originally posted by Sloi
You're right, every kill a soloer does contributes to the team. That is correct. I just wanted to point out that Chris' intention when playing the game is not "to play in a team".
You know in RL (sorry to come with RL) at work there are ppl that are teamworkers and work together on a goal. And there are Non-teamworkers that work on their own goal. Both sides contribute to one bigger goal: the companies benefit!
But there are still two side a teamworking side and a "soloing" side.
Even though both sides contribute to the same superior goal and may even help each other in reaching their "inferior goal" they are still to seperate parts.
In BF2 this would be an infantry squad capping flags (Teamworking part) and the soloer taking out threatening vehicles (non teamworking part).
The soloer is playing alone. He benfits from other ppl spotting targets. These ppl benfit from him killing these targets. The interaction happening here can be described as Teamwork but it is definetly different from the Teamwork happening in the mentioned infantry squad.
Maybe it can be defined as "direct teamwork" what the squad does and as "indirect teamwork" what the soloer does?
Still the soloer refuses reamwork when not working together (in a team) with a gunner. Only to be applied when the pilot does not let anyone gun or even redlines the gunner! Even if you are e better killing machine alone in the chopper you are not in a team with a gunner. And I think this is the teamwork this thread is working towards.
There are different kinds of teamwork in BF2 - different levels.
Is the lone medic whore teamworking when he's only reviving to get a lot of points?
What's with the lone sniper?
Every kill/teampoint a player gets contributes to his team - but this doesn't mean your teamworking.
Maybe we can settle this whole discussion with agreeing that there are different kinds of Teamwork, some more and some less direct/intense/obvious??
FipZComment
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Personally I think one of the problems with this topic is everyone has conflicting ideas of what constitutes "teamwork" and we all have different ideas as to what's fun.
Like most people I play BF2 to have fun. My own enjoyment does come over almost everyone elses, however there are some things I'll do for "the team".
People do many many selfish things in the game because they rate their "enjoyment" over everyone else's, and 90% of the time they've found a nieche where they can get some cheap points.
Like Solo'ers. Like Jihad-jeepers. Like lone wolf medic whores. Like lone snipers.
Mostly these actions don't contribute to the feeling of playing as a team, but they can contribute to the sides overall victory.
There are some very competant people who use these styles of play, and generally they do help things out, mostly.
However Even if they use the commo rose, and they do do things like destroy enemy armour and heli's, they are mostly doing it for themselves, and mostly they don't care if the team wins or loses, so long as they, using internet vernicular, "pwn".
People get different fun from different things. Personally I enjoy playing in a squad that works well together, has complimentary kits and skills, and preferably a good humour about the game and isn't shy of talking crap on the VOIP. I also have more fun if the map is down to the last 2 tickets, I also prefer, generally, using the "less popular" weapons. One reason why my K: D isn't that heigh.
Others get it from 230-0 whitewashes.
Others get it from being an *** and cheating/hacking/glitching.
Others get it by doing everything to get the gold and screw everyone else.
Others get it from honestly helping the team out. LikeI said in another thread the guy who introduced me to BF2 was an original Medic whore. He plays as part of a squad and revives everyone, anywhere. He is a machine. He also has something like 2000% more heals/revives than kills.
Different folks different strokes.
What makes Heli solo pilots different from this is 1) they all claim gunners are crap, yet they as so good they can fly and gun at the same time. 2) they have the ability to TK someone in their vehicle, without damaging the vehicle or themselves in the process. Something a tank or APC can't do. 3) they are airborn. I can hop into and out of a tank or APC or even a Jihad Jeep at my own free will. You cannot do this to a heli. 4) they are also some of the first to ***** and moan and punish if you M95 eject them. 5) the heli's belong to THEM.
They are also monopolising one of the most powerful weapon systems in the game, and one of the most fun to use.
The phrase they use over and over again is "I'm not a taxi". Now I live in one of the places in the world where shooting from a taxi is actually common, but what I believe is attack heli pilots aren't taxi drivers. 99% of the time the passenger is actually trying to work for his transport, not get a free ride. The number of times I've seen Solo pilots not only TK their passengers, but then get shot down by the two person enemy chopper is in the hundreds.
And then they argue that they are team players. You are contributing to the team winning, but you are not playing as a team by any long shot.
EA screwed up when they made the tanks and APC's (and the mobile AA's) one person crewed.
Yes there are firing ports on an APC, and the .50 on a tank helps with air defence, but honestly, there is not one tank on the planet that allows one person to drive, gun and load. If the tanks required multi crews, then the planes and heli's could have the seats locked.
KBKComment
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I've already buggered off to PR and I'm thoroughly enjoying it. There is a choice.Comment
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Where did I say that? I said "my own personal fun" which means I mach those WASD keys to entertain myself. Entertaining myself doesnt mean I dont do conscious choices on the field to help others or to work towards an objective to help the team. I said I played the game to have fun. My fun.Originally posted by ElFipso
If you want to purposefully misinterpret what I said, then at least do so less obviously.
Theres no such thing as direct and indirect teamwork. Youre just stroking your ego thinking youre superior just because you dont know how to use a piece of hardware in the game. Theres micro and macro level teamwork and in their importance and input of conscious choices are the same. The teamwork level in BF2 infantry aspect is shallow at best, and is limited to running together, reviving each other and resupplying each other. Like I said, shallow at best.Comment
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Still you only care about YOUR OWN PERSONAL FUN/GAIN (so not for the gain of the team: read your own post please) which is egoism. I've never known an egoist working in a team!
If you don't think that there are different levels of teamwork your as ignorant as you are egoistic.
The reason why the teamwork level is "shallow" might be because of ppl like you? And it's not limited to runnning together, reviving each other and resupplying each other. But how could you know? There's much more if you manage to use the VOIP and actually do real teamwork. But a soloer will never get that and thus never understand the true meaning of teamwork.
And yes, I don't know how to use choppers/fly. Mainly because it sucks with only a keyboard (don't have a joystick) and secondly because I don't care about flying choppers. I'm happy with my basic knowledge of how to use flying vehicles. I even suck at gunning from a chopper.
FipZComment
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I have, plenty. Its those people who are smart enough to team up for mutual gain, not mutual fun.Originally posted by ElFipso
I just gave you 2 different levels of teamwork in broader aspect, by your definition, one is better than the other. By my definition, one is just more compact than the other. Guess which one of us expressed his opinion and not a fact?If you don't think that there are different levels of teamwork your as ignorant as you are egoistic.
Go ahead, prove it. What kind of teamwork in a squad of people who dont know each other, is there? Spotting? Everyone does that. Resupply, heal, revive? Everyone does that.The reason why the teamwork level is "shallow" might be because of ppl like you? And it's not limited to runnning together, reviving each other and resupplying each other. But how could you know? There's much more if you manage to use the VOIP and actually do real teamwork. But a soloer will never get that and thus never understand the true meaning of teamwork.
Also, take note, Im a jet pilot with only a few limited hours in a chopper. I also play games with a heavy teamwork aspect and I know perfectly well what teamwork is. Youre assuming Im a soloer just because I support soloing and am ridiculing you, who you have no idea what youre talking about.
So, you dont use the choppers, you dont know how to use them, but youre an expert in telling what is teamwork and whats not? Notice how each and every one of those who says soloing is not a teamplayer, is a person like you? Ignorant, opinionated, passionate in their hate against air and with ZERO experience in air aspect?And yes, I don't know how to use choppers/fly. Mainly because it sucks with only a keyboard (don't have a joystick) and secondly because I don't care about flying choppers. I'm happy with my basic knowledge of how to use flying vehicles. I even suck at gunning from a chopper.Comment
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Chris, one reason we have no experience in the air is because red liners and M95 ejector soloers prevent us logging time. I even had a guy shoot me with a SRAW multiple times on a server with fewer people than required to start a propper game. I just wanted to Log some real opponent hours and he wouldn't let me because the plane was his. It's assholes like that that made me move to urban only maps.Comment
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No disrespect KBK, but what youre saying is utterly retarded. You can go to any server with less than 15 people and youll get the chopper, reasonable ammount of ground targets and newbie jet pilots to keep you occupied.
Sorry, blaming pilots for your own mistakes isnt going to make you look good.Comment
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Seems we're all retarded, apart from you...Comment
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Now the topic is soloers who TK?
OK.
Let me tell you something. No matter how good a soloer is, if he red-lines me, he’s going down.
I’ll make sure of it. He’ll be sorry for the rest of that round.
Teamplay or not.
But this is a topic for another thread...
EDIT:
Exactly my thoughts. :laugh:Comment
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