Is a soloer a teamplayer?

[Batausu]

I think the main problem is the lack of chopper built-in intercom for the pilot and copilot (or any vehicle for that matter).
If we had a button to talk to the other occupant of the vehicle, things would have been a lot better.
Pilot:
- Hello mate, how are you?
Copilot:
- I'm fine, let's go kill some reds.
Teamwork would be natural, almost effortless for them.
If the copilot is a noob, he could say:
- I need some practice, could you be my pilot for a while?
Therefore, the pilot would know and be more careful. Not everybody is skilled with choppers. However, they can learn, can't they? Teaching a noob could be fun in itself.
- Ok, follow my lead.
Alternatively, the pilot could say:
- Maybe later, we are behind now. I'll go solo, if you don't mind…
In any case, the situation would be clearer for both. No need to red-line a noob, just talk to him. I am sure you can reach to an understanding…

[Dairuka]

Batausu, your logic relies on the good nature of your fellow players.

That is where fault in your logic lies.

[Chris_Redfield]

Does that make sense?

Youre operating on an assumption or belief that there is only one law and rule, a constitution in BF2. "First come first serve" wouldnt be a rule, but more akin to a description of behaviour of the masses. What I would use would be-

"Anything you allow yourself to do, goes."

Its internet, land of the free and home of the selfish bastards.

It's not our right to eject somebody from a helicopter just because they managed to steal the seat. Even if they do nothing with it. Even if theres no real way to truly enforce any rules against forced ejection, that still doesn't make it right, or mean that it's within our rights to do it.

Actually it is, from the second i doubleclick that fat BF2 icon, Im playing for my own personal fun, my own personal gain. The only thing I harm with my actions is the fun of other people. But in a game where there is a winner, and a loser, peoples fun gets affected and ruined on a constant basis, so in the end, theres not much difference.

Im not saying bad behaviour is "right", but its not "illegal", just morally or ethically wrong to some people.

[Dairuka]

Youre operating on an assumption or belief that there is only one law and rule, a constitution in BF2. "First come first serve" wouldnt be a rule, but more akin to a description of behaviour of the masses. What I would use would be-

"Anything you allow yourself to do, goes."

Its internet, land of the free and home of the selfish bastards.

We have to latch onto archaic laws, lest we fall victim to Anarchy itself. I guarantee you'd be team-killed a heck of a lot more if that ever happened. Team-mates would camp the helicopter pad in jeeps, waiting to cap you when you come back to repair, merely so they can take your helicopter.

This happens anyways, but I guarantee it happens a lot less, because most of us as a species, commonly accept the archaic law of, "First come, first serve."

Actually it is, from the second i doubleclick that fat BF2 icon, Im playing for my own personal fun, my own personal gain. The only thing I harm with my actions is the fun of other people. But in a game where there is a winner, and a loser, peoples fun gets affected and ruined on a constant basis, so in the end, theres not much difference.

You're starting to sound like dA! Illusion.

He used that very same argument when I confronted him about his cheating on X-Fire. Only his context revolved around cheating, not helicopter ownership.

Im not saying bad behaviour is "right", but its not "illegal", just morally or ethically wrong to some people.

It's still illegal in the sense that it breaks rules.

Laws and Rules are nothing more than a code of ethics made official.

EA has official rules. Breaking those rules makes those actions illegal in the eyes of EA, who own this game.

Just because the action of actual enforcement for those rules is pathetic at best, doesn't make them any less illegal.

[Gen.Vlade]

There were times when nothing you did on the internet could be considered illegal activity. All there is left now is the moral laws and values.

[Dairuka]

All that laws are, are morals and ethics anyways. Thats why laws are always constantly evolving based on the direction a society takes.

Whats the difference if we change or explore new frontiers? Laws will always take time to be set into motion and accepted as law. Once into motion, breaking said laws will be deemed illegal and punishment can be enforced as a result of said law-breaking. You can protest these laws, sure; it is our right to do so. Just don't be too surprised if you find yourself stonewalled if the law is just in the eyes of the society that created the law.

Look at the America's famous Wild Wild West era for a good example.

Now look at America today, and note the differences.

[Chris_Redfield]

We have to latch onto archaic laws, lest we fall victim to Anarchy itself. I guarantee you'd be team-killed a heck of a lot more if that ever happened. Team-mates would camp the helicopter pad in jeeps, waiting to cap you when you come back to repair, merely so they can take your helicopter.

Its alreay anarchy. Theres 3 things that regulate behaviour on the servers.
*Server rules and administrators
*Peoples own moral and ethical values
*The punish system enforced by the game

If a person plays and acts based on his own moral and ethical values, it can already be considered as a form of anarchy.

This happens anyways, but I guarantee it happens a lot less, because most of us as a species, commonly accept the archaic law of, "First come, first serve."

It happens all the time, and not just on helo strips. Its not massively widespread though.

You're starting to sound like dA! Illusion.
He used that very same argument when I confronted him about his cheating on X-Fire. Only his context revolved around cheating, not helicopter ownership.

The difference between me and Illuzzzzion is that what I deem "acceptable" under certain circumstances, is not what guides my action. Im a jetwhore, yet I have never used any trickery to get a plane (TK, griefing, whatnot). I flew choppers a little, yet have never TKd for it. Ive redlined some poor blokes, but I was in the pilots seat, not them. And lastly, I accept cheating as evil, yet I fail to see how it affects the fun of players any more than a guy with excellent skill level does, and I dont cheat.

It's still illegal in the sense that it breaks rules.

I dont really think that theres a rule regarding redlining in the EULA? Or TOS?

Again, "first come first served" doesnt always mean what it seems literally. I could bend it the same way and tell that when I got into the chopper first, into the pilots seat, I can do whatever I want with it, including teamkilling you.

[Dairuka]

The difference between me and Illuzzzzion is that what I deem "acceptable" under certain circumstances, is not what guides my action. Im a jetwhore, yet I have never used any trickery to get a plane (TK, griefing, whatnot). I flew choppers a little, yet have never TKd for it. Ive redlined some poor blokes, but I was in the pilots seat, not them. And lastly, I accept cheating as evil, yet I fail to see how it affects the fun of players any more than a guy with excellent skill level does, and I dont cheat.

You got me there.

I dont really think that theres a rule regarding redlining in the EULA? Or TOS?

Redlining is sadly an oversight. So it can simply be categorized as team-killing, even though it's clearly an exploit.

Again, "first come first served" doesnt always mean what it seems literally. I could bend it the same way and tell that when I got into the chopper first, into the pilots seat, I can do whatever I want with it, including teamkilling you.

Yes, you could do whatever you want with the chopper, since you indeed get to the helicopter first. However, teamkilling of course is against the rules.

[Chris_Redfield]

Yes, you could do whatever you want with the chopper, since you indeed get to the helicopter first. However, teamkilling of course is against the rules.

Im going to play Ally McBeal on your as5 and tell you this:

"Im not teamkilling people, Im relieving them of their duty due to their inefficiency. Technically, noone got killed, they just were no more."

:p

[Dairuka]

Im going to play Ally McBeal on your as5 and tell you this:

"Im not teamkilling people, Im relieving them of their duty due to their inefficiency. Technically, noone got killed, they just were no more."

:p

Thanks a lot. I was blissfully happy before, having forgotten that, that horrible show even existed. Now I'm going to have nightmares about Skeletor in a mini-skirt and dancing babies all over again. :cry:

[Chris_Redfield]

Thanks a lot. I was blissfully happy before, having forgotten that, that horrible show even existed. Now I'm going to have nightmares about Skeletor in a mini-skirt and dancing babies all over again. :cry:

You know, amongst the legends like "McGuyver", "A-Team", "Knight Rider", "M.A.S.H.", et cetera, every once in a while we get to see a show that is so stupid, so ridiculous and so much of a failure at comedy (or irony), like "Ally McBeal", that its making the general population lose a few points of IQ.

:shakehead

[Dairuka]

You know, amongst the legends like "McGuyver", "A-Team", "Knight Rider", "M.A.S.H.", et cetera, every once in a while we get to see a show that is so stupid, so ridiculous and so much of a failure at comedy (or irony), like "Ally McBeal", that its making the general population lose a few points of IQ.

:shakehead

I bet you watched it religiously.

[Chris_Redfield]

I bet you watched it religiously.

It was on national television every Sunday at 19:30, right before "Buffy the vampire slayer". I saw a few endings, and it was about 8-9 years ago :p, but the popularity it gained among young 13-15 year old girls who wanted to become lawyers (as did many of them), was huge...

[Dairuka]

I think we've effectively derailed and killed this thread.

My work is done here.

[Sloi sauce]

To Sloi: Dude. Weak.

Yeah. I was bored and that Cena sig was funny... :laugh:

My final thoughts: soloing takes the unknown out of your fun and team contributions. I think a meritocracy should be used to determine powerful vehicle allocation... apparently, that's not a very popular opinion. I respect that.

I won't ask anyone to play my way, but I also expect people not to force me into their styles either. That's all gentlemen, carry on...