Why many people are quitting BF2 for good -- it's not fun anymore

[Red Ghost]

Re: Why many people are quitting BF2 for good -- it's not fun anymore

I think a lot there is a clear divide of people here. There are the people that only fly planes, who clearly think there is nothing wrong. There are the misguided people like Futile who state things like "I reallly don't get what the big deal is. in the real world...", not realising this is an arcade game. The last kind of person, like "Boojie" understand that there is a bit of a balance issue with airpower (although I think this is really only planes).

I don't know about the rest of the people but it gets annoying when people get wrapped up too much in airpower and don't want a proper fight. Bit like Mashtur City with the BH, i'm sure people must enjoy fighting on the ground knowing that its an even fight and can go either way, but maybe not.

[SnuFFeh]

Re: Why many people are quitting BF2 for good -- it's not fun anymore

Agreed with first post. I noticed earlier I barely play BF2 anymore compared to how much I used to play. It certainly hasnt had a lifespan as long as its predecessor BF1942.

I am however, eagerly awaiting the release of FH2 (Forgotten Hope, originally a BF1942 expansion http://forgottenhope.bf1942files.com/index.php)

FH breathed an extra (at least) 4-5 months of playing BF1942 back into my life, so I pray FH2 will live up to its previous standard.

[maranello]

Re: Why many people are quitting BF2 for good -- it's not fun anymore

The point you're missing is that on a 64 player map, it is reasonable to expect 64 players to be able to enjoy the game and compete. All this talk about how jets are supposed to be more powerful misses the essential point: this is not a game intended to be enjoyed by 4 people up in the air.

If the airdales want to bomb the **** out of people on the ground they should stick to single player. The other 60 of us on that map would like to engage each other in combat. That said, city maps like Karkland are not as fun as the other maps could be without the air element. I think it's fair to say that the air element is another dimension that many of us want in the game. We want to be nervous about that helo coming in. We want to be up tight about a jet making a pass. But we dont want to be up against a vehicle that cant be taken down. (Insert the obvious "but you CAN take it down" statement here...if so, you're still missing the point).

An all ground BF2 would not be as fun. In the same vein, just because we have little boats out there to add another dimension, the entire game is not handicapped with the inclusion of those little boats. Air should be another dimension -- not the primary vehicle to run for precisely and only because it's invincible.

I get your point and i agree with you. All i am saying is, if you put the planes in the game, they will rule the battlefield, and you won't take them down easily. Now what's going to happen is, DICE will change some stuff, but then people will complain how planes become less important and how they are too vulnerable.

I don't get the point of stingers too. Nowhere in the world it is possible to take down a JSF or Mig with a little stinger rocket if the pilot is not so stupid. It's just not realistic. You can take them down with the USS Essex gun, or you can use the stingers or IGLA for choppers, that's all reasonable. Making planes more vulnerable, or making stingers more accurate is just going to make the game more arcade. I said it before, i say it again, if you put the planes in the game and if the players are playing a map with planes, they have to face with the consequences, that's why they are there, that's why there are 10 jeeps, 10 tanks in a battle but only 2 planes.

I mean i agree with you, it p!sses me off too to get bombed by that bomber plane in gulf of oman when i defeated 5 people and i am about to capture the flag, but when that happens, i either put up with it, or i play strike at karkand.

[r0uJe]

Re: Why many people are quitting BF2 for good -- it's not fun anymore

i've given up on BF2 after playing it for SO many hours! it's been more than a month now since i last played. before, there were only a few sergeant majors. i think majority of players now have reach this rank. good job!

i got excited when SF came out but with the performance issues? forget it.

[Boojie]

Re: Why many people are quitting BF2 for good -- it's not fun anymore

I get your point and i agree with you.

And I agree with you. Let's have a group hug. :p


So 10 min ago, I discovered a new tactic and I kinda like it. It was Oman. Me and another guy on my squad played AT and we just hung around a point just near the helo pad, but not at the helo pad. It was in interesting tactic...we just wait for the wounded helo to come back to rejuvenate itself. The helo normally passes over us on the way back (maybe 100 feet from the pad?) and we just lay into that wounded beast. Not only do we get a kill or two, but we cause the guys to lose their helo so the other guys predicably waiting at the pad can get their turn. And they do. We let them go off and massacre the ground troops, but on the return trip we rinse and repeat the justice served.

I've never seen so many guys get ****ed off at dying. They take it as a personal insult. How dare we take them down. You should have seen the comments. Me and another guy pretty much singlehandedly caused a lot of infighting among them. These guys would fight over the helo like it was a teenage girl.

It's back to the fight. This tactic wont work on Wake, but it might work on Songua. We shall see.

[Older-OMO]

Re: Why many people are quitting BF2 for good -- it's not fun anymore

The point you're missing is that on a 64 player map, it is reasonable to expect 64 players to be able to enjoy the game and compete. All this talk about how jets are supposed to be more powerful misses the essential point: this is not a game intended to be enjoyed by 4 people up in the air.

First, I agree that tweaks can be made to adjust balance issues. However, you and the other anti-plane commentators have over-generalized that this is a problem everywhere, that all other 60 players are unhappy because of the 4 pilots, and that that jets are the only source of bad gaming experience.

First, look at all the servers out there. If you get frustrated with a pilot, you are telling me there aren't alternative servers out there? I can't tell you how many times I have joined a server where the planes sat most or all of a round. There aren't as many good pilots as is implied by all of the anti-plane threads that have been started. I am an OK pilot and I have only run into 2-3 pilots in an unmentionable number of hours played that I have had an extremely difficult time shooting down. On the maps with planes that don't include bombers, it is even more rare to find a pilot that pwns an entire team. You can also play 16 player maps.

I bet the 60 other player would complain just as loud about BH, chopper and armor whores who rack up ridiculous kill rates against foot soldiers. Just take a look at the leader boards for the K/D ratios for some of these guys. I am sure the people that play against them probably feel that these folks have an unfair advantage and appear to be just as invincible as a jet.

Also, on a 64 player map, lets assume each pilot racks up 50 kills. On average, that would equate to 3-4 deaths per player. Is that a big deal? You are telling me that you haven't been killed 3-4 times in a round by the same tank, APC, grenade, rifle, etc? My guess is you are getting killed by jets on a regular basis because you are in a piece or armor and make an easy target for a plane. Ground troups are not the primary target for bombers or fighters.

Eliminate planes and guess what, attack choppers would be next. Then people would complain that the only thing that can take out attack choppers is the horrible AA or a lucky tank shot. Eliminate attack choppers and the armor would be next. People would complain that supply boxes and engineers make armor invincible (wait they already complain about this). Eventually, all that would be left would be non-jumping, assault class (without grenade launchers of course), with built in aimbots. No skills required, everybody wins right?

[Older-OMO]

Re: Why many people are quitting BF2 for good -- it's not fun anymore

Me and another guy on my squad played AT and we just hung around a point just near the helo pad, but not at the helo pad. It was in interesting tactic...we just wait for the wounded helo to come back to rejuvenate itself. The helo normally passes over us on the way back (maybe 100 feet from the pad?) and we just lay into that wounded beast. Not only do we get a kill or two, but we cause the guys to lose their helo so the other guys predicably waiting at the pad can get their turn. And they do. We let them go off and massacre the ground troops, but on the return trip we rinse and repeat the justice served.

Wow your true colors really shine from this post. Spawn camping the helo pad (you said you went after the guys on the pad after the chopper left). That is some fine and ethical game play. Griefing people just to **** them off is worse than a pilot racking up legitimate kills.

Justice served? I guess now you think that just being in a chopper is something that needs to be punished. Whats next?

[Boojie]

Re: Why many people are quitting BF2 for good -- it's not fun anymore

Wow your true colors really shine from this post. Spawn camping the helo pad (you said you went after the guys on the pad after the chopper left). That is some fine and ethical game play.

We were not at the helo pad. We were uphill on the path to the helo. I thought it was clear when I mentioned that we were maybe 100 ft away from the helo, but just to be clear, we were not camping.

I also thought I was clear in mentioning that we'd let the helo take off and massacre the ground troops, but that we'd catch him on the return trip and nail his ass then.

Does your definition of spawn camping include all territory, even territory not on the base but upstream from it?

Once again, any soldier that spawned at that point lived and got in his vehicle and did their thing. We weren't close enough to be effective at camping. We were effective in bringing down the helos due to the pattern of their return trip. They often came home over a certain point. We were at that point.

For the record, I dont defend spawn camping for the same reason I criticize the air balance. What fun is it to simply pick a guy off that hasn't entered the fight? Does that make me "better"? More skilled? Not at all. I come to fight.

[SquidNipples]

Re: Why many people are quitting BF2 for good -- it's not fun anymore

I just got the game a few weeks ago and I'm loving it. Got Special Forces too and I'm enjoying that quite thoroughly.

I won't claim to be some elite gaming god/guru at BF2 but I've played many FPS shooters over the years so here's my 2 cents:

Choppers are fine. For the most part anyway. They are fairly easy to kill with sustained fire from a Heavy Machine gun, Stinger turrets will kill them if they hold still long enough, and mobile AA works well if you use terrain to your advantage. A Support kit, and an Anti Tank kit working together can bring one down with some skill and luck. I do not believe Helicopters need to be changed.

Planes seem to be a different matter though. No matter how hard I've tried I've never been able to bring down a jet. Stingers just don't seem to do a damn thing against them. I've tried leading my shots, shooting at the plane when it's moving parallel to the path of the missile, they never get hit. I've always fired when I had a solid lock and after the target had dispensed flares. Ground based machine guns just don't fire fast enough to hit jets. Sure jets aren't too hard to bring down when you're in another jet, but there's usually 1 or 2 on a server at best, and the chances of me getting to fly them are somewhat slim.

From my flying experience, jets are notoriously easy to re-arm. Helicopters have to hover in one place or land on a helipad to re-arm/reppair. This requires a fair amount of skill/experience at piloting and leaves the Helicopter vulnerable to attack. Jets just have to fly low over the runway and a little slower than usual, which isn't hard to do.

I suggest the following changes to gameplay:
1. Increase the tracking capacity of surface to air missiles including stinger turrets, mobile AA, and AWACS on carriers. Damage might have to be adjusted to compensate for this. 2 or 3 missile hits seems like a fair number to bring down a plane.
2. Require Airplanes to land, or at least touch down in order to rearm/repair. This might require making it easier to control/land planes.
3. Increase the firing rate of mobile AA flak guns. This might require toning down the damage, but hitting a moving target is better than not hitting it at all.

[Boojie]

Re: Why many people are quitting BF2 for good -- it's not fun anymore

However, you and the other anti-plane commentators have over-generalized that this is a problem everywhere, that all other 60 players are unhappy because of the 4 pilots, and that that jets are the only source of bad gaming experience.

We are not anti-plane...we are anti-balance. While I can't suppose to speak for anyone, I think you're gonna have a long dig to unearth people here that dont want the planes under any circumstances. In your steadfast defense of the status quo, you put yourself in an indefensible position: "the planes/helos *should* get 50 kills easily...what's your problem?"

I love this part...

My guess is you are getting killed by jets on a regular basis because you are in a piece or armor and make an easy target for a plane. Ground troups are not the primary target for bombers or fighters.

I'm sorry. My bad. Why would I get in a tank or APC? I shouldn't do that. And I shouldn't run on foot. Hell, let me just spawn and hole up in a safe spot and not move.

Fun, fun, fun.

[Older-OMO]

Re: Why many people are quitting BF2 for good -- it's not fun anymore

I also thought I was clear in mentioning that we'd let the helo take off and massacre the ground troops, but that we'd catch him on the return trip and nail his ass then.

I interpret this to me you were killing the people who didn't make it into the chopper. If that was the case, then you were camping their helo pad. If not, than fine. So I guess you have moved on from planes to choppers.

[Older-OMO]

Re: Why many people are quitting BF2 for good -- it's not fun anymore

We are not anti-plane...we are anti-balance. While I can't suppose to speak for anyone, I think you're gonna have a long dig to unearth people here that dont want the planes under any circumstances. In your steadfast defense of the status quo, you put yourself in an indefensible position: "the planes/helos *should* get 50 kills easily...what's your problem?"

I love this part...



I'm sorry. My bad. Why would I get in a tank or APC? I shouldn't do that. And I shouldn't run on foot. Hell, let me just spawn and hole up in a safe spot and not move.

Fun, fun, fun.

Read the first lines of my post. I am not against tweaks to change the balance. I don't have a problem with any of the changes in the upcoming patch. However, even the status quo isn't as bad as you make it out to be. Thousand of people are having enough fun to keep playing. It can't be that unpleasant.

I NEVER said planes or helos should get 50 kills easily. Now you are getting delusional. The 50 kill thing was a worst case example of 2 good pilots. It sounds like you can't enjoy the game until you have the abiltiy to kill anything the game has to offer. Unfortunately there will always be better players than you. How are you going to balance that?

I edited out my first response which added the line/insult that you were getting killed because you wanted to be an armor whore, but got frustrated because the plane whore killed you before you could kill lots of infantry. I am sure you didn't get in a tank to go find other tanks. I guess I should have left it in since my intuition was correct.

[Boojie]

Re: Why many people are quitting BF2 for good -- it's not fun anymore

II don't know about the rest of the people but it gets annoying when people get wrapped up too much in airpower and don't want a proper fight. Bit like Mashtur City with the BH, i'm sure people must enjoy fighting on the ground knowing that its an even fight and can go either way, but maybe not.

That's it. You nailed it. Easy points vs. a proper fight. It's related to the bunny hopping. It's related to the dolphin diving. It's all tied together.

[alecs36]

Re: Why many people are quitting BF2 for good -- it's not fun anymore

Lol these kids never played Battlefield vietnam :laugh:

[Farks]

Re: Why many people are quitting BF2 for good -- it's not fun anymore

More effective AA might solve the "aircraft-is-overpowered" problem. But, insteed, the pilots will bail out before the planes/helos explode. That way - the guy in the AA won't get any score for his work.