[xXx]gh0st's view on Infantry Only (IO)

[Retuner]

Re: [xXx]gh0st's view on Infantry Only (IO)

Sid, as both one of the top pilots in Battlefield 2 and one of best medics too let me give you a spot of advice. Dying to airplanes in particular is completely the fault of the infantry should it happen to them. They were either in a vehicle not moving, camping a vehicle spawn point, standing on top of a just captured flag or any number of other preventable scenarios. Take it from me Sid - as both an experienced pilot and an experienced medic I almost never die to planes. I can honestly measure my total deaths a week to planes in the single digits (that includes playing plenty of airmaps on a server like Cain's Lair).

So if you're having difficulties avoiding death by pilot then I strongly recommend that rather than blaming the external you analyze and improve the internal.

Now when I say "IO mode will divide BF2" I'm speaking purely from past experiences. Let me give you a real world example. My favorite game of all time is Ultima Online. One of the first MMORPGs this game had an incredible look an incredible feel and what can only be described as an amazingly skilled PvP system. Most of all though Ultima Online was great because it mixed all sorts of different people, personalities and playstyles in to one vibrant community. Now the developer OSI decided to listen to the gripes of a few players that the game was too "hardcore" After all you could murder in this game (with certain penalties of course), steal from other players.. basically you name it you can do it.

So OSI said.. ok simple solution what we'll do is duplicate the complete land mass and make one part the normal Wild West style hardcore existence (called Felluca) and the other side will be carebear land (Carebear land being Trammel and the place that term originates) where you can't kill, attack, steal from or even stand in the path of other players. Seemed simple enough but the end result of this was it split the community. The hardcore murderous type players got bored with fighting other murderous type players in Felluca and the "carebear" crowd that decided to go Trammel because it made everything so much easier in regards to trade skills ect.. you'd be crazy not to go to that side to do these tasks. Well the more peaceful crowd ended up losing the very thing they enjoyed about the game (but didn't know that they enjoyed) when the risk associated with what they did evaporated.

End result of all of this way a less enjoyable experience for all and a very large drop in the amount of subscriptions. As a result the population became sparse and the game in one patch went from "my favorite game of all time" to the "my favorite game made one of my least favorite by the worst patch in the history of patches". Of course all of these horrible patches that ruined that game happened well after the game design genius Richard Garriot left OSI and lost creative control over the game - big shocker.

That's just one of many examples and it perfectly fits the current scenario we find ourselves in with Battlefield. We've go a drastic diversion from the original focus of this series in to something that will polarize and divide different types of players and will ultimately negatively effect both groups. Some people can't see the forest for the trees but seeing as I've been down this same road before it's all too clear to me.

Planewhoe can you just shut up..
maby I just love playing infrantry vs infrantry but I have no problem to take out a jet or tank either.

conclusion some people just love infrantry vs infrantry and not that they can't handle the armor or that stuff.

[Chris_Redfield]

Re: [xXx]gh0st's view on Infantry Only (IO)

Planewhoe can you just shut up..
maby I just love playing infrantry vs infrantry but I have no problem to take out a jet or tank either.

conclusion some people just love infrantry vs infrantry and not that they can't handle the armor or that stuff.

16 player maps. Awesome fun. Not much armor to deal with. Whats the problem?

[Retuner]

Re: [xXx]gh0st's view on Infantry Only (IO)

16 player maps. Awesome fun. Not much armor to deal with. Whats the problem?

omg I love infrantry vs infrantry how hard is that to understand for people like you :|:

jeesz and know I don't have any problem to take out armor or other stuff

[sidtherat]

Re: [xXx]gh0st's view on Infantry Only (IO)

whats wrong with 16p maps you ask? well.. nothing apart that played with 30 players they last about 5 minutes, due to very low ticket count.

and played with 16 players there is one armour per 7 infantry. it isnt any fun, unfortunatelly.. and most 16p maps are too big for 16p anyway.

but.. 16p maps are THE BEST what could happen to IO mode. [road rage 16p is one of the best maps ever]

as for the dieing to planes.. well, all your predictable scenarios cover in fact all that is enjoyable in this game - ie. fighting tank-tank battle [particulary non moving targets], capping flags [grayed out flags, newly captured ones] defending flags [spotted enemies, predictable locations] etc. all you say to do is not to do anything at all, and jets wont kill me. well.. i dont planecamp [it still comes into 'predictable spots'], so i'd better fight for some reliable AA defense. it is my end of the stick, and jets are yours. we agree to dissagree.

tell me, is there anything you are not teh skill3st? medic, jets [suprisingly, all the point farimng things ] - just asking of pure curiosity

btw. there are some special games for people like you - they are called flight simulators. some are even 'combat' ones. i can tell you, that these games can measure your skill very well. you ask us to play counterstrike - i ask you to play lock-on modern combat.

[Chris_Redfield]

Re: [xXx]gh0st's view on Infantry Only (IO)

omg I love infrantry vs infrantry how hard is that to understand for people like you :|:

jeesz and know I don't have any problem to take out armor or other stuff

You missed the quite obvius point. Armor presence in 16 player maps (apart from lets say Karkand) is minimal. So whats the problem in playing there? You get almost pure infantry vs infantry fight!

whats wrong with 16p maps you ask? well.. nothing apart that played with 30 players they last about 5 minutes, due to very low ticket count.

Who asked you to play a 64 player UT f*ckfest in a small BF2 map anyway? You know, the numbers can be set quite reasonably. For example, 12 vs 12 wouldnt hurt, or 10 vs 10 at that matter. Shongua Stalemate with only 2 APCs total can become quite tolerable.

and played with 16 players there is one armour per 7 infantry. it isnt any fun, unfortunatelly.. and most 16p maps are too big for 16p anyway.

No they are not. If you feel they are, a small increase in numbers can fix the situation.

but.. 16p maps are THE BEST what could happen to IO mode. [road rage 16p is one of the best maps ever]

Why do I get the feeling that 16 player IO maps with 32 players per side are to simulate Karkand Hotel fights ONLY?! Am I the only one getting this picture?

tell me, is there anything you are not teh skill3st? medic, jets [suprisingly, all the point farimng things ] - just asking of pure curiosity

PlaneWhore is quilty in all these charges a long time ago :laugh: , doesnt mean he cant be objective, which is is.

btw. there are some special games for people like you - they are called flight simulators. some are even 'combat' ones. i can tell you, that these games can measure your skill very well. you ask us to play counterstrike - i ask you to play lock-on modern combat.

WOW! I for one love the VARIETY! Not infantry only festivals! When I asked a BF2 player what game did he come from, he said Counter Strike, because BF2 offers the ability to choose weapons. Hes an armor whore and exceptional on infantry level. Sucks at jets and choppers, but accepts them and takes death from them with humour.

(When driving an APC from Con Site to Rock Fort in Oman, we got downed by a Su. His comment? "Feet it is...")

No, I dont play BF2 air aspect because I want to be Tom Cruise in Top Gun. I play because I like the variety, to play against other people in a mock-battlefield scene, with some simplicity in controls. I do play MSFS 2002 though.

[Bungalow_Bill]

Re: [xXx]gh0st's view on Infantry Only (IO)

as for the dieing to planes.. well, all your predictable scenarios cover in fact all that is enjoyable in this game - ie. fighting tank-tank battle [particulary non moving targets], capping flags [grayed out flags, newly captured ones] defending flags [spotted enemies, predictable locations] etc. all you say to do is not to do anything at all, and jets wont kill me. well.. i dont planecamp [it still comes into 'predictable spots'],

All that is enjoyable? Give me a break. I'm not saying "don't have a tank battle" I'm saying "when you do have a tank battle on an air map don't sit out in the middle of that field or on the road like a lump but instead head for some trees/houses and use them as cover and don't ever stop moving. Not only will these improve your defense against airplanes but it'll improve your defense against the other tank. Call it a win win. Also I'm not saying "don't stand at the flag" but rather "don't stand right on top of the flag!". It's common sense really or at least you'd think. If all that is too difficult for you to comprehend then you've always got the option of playing the other 50% of the maps without planes - or playing a smaller version of the air maps that does not include planes.

so i'd better fight for some reliable AA defense. it is my end of the stick, and jets are yours. we agree to dissagree.

While I'd admit the current implementation of S2A is less that perfect, it's still perfectly workable and when you do fire off a missile it's almost guaranteed to connect with the jet (flares or not). As self-defeating as it may sound I'm one of the few pilots petitioning DICE for better S2A missiles because unlike the IO mode advocates I don't have a selfish defeatist attitude and I won't run from a challenge no matter the source. Of course if you're like me an enjoy a challenge when DICE finally does manage to balance the planes you ought to try flying one for a change and instead of whining about pilots and failing to adapt instead attempt to shoot one down. Oh but I forgot that'd leave you completely dependant on your skill and as a result doomed to failure.

tell me, is there anything you are not teh skill3st? medic, jets [suprisingly, all the point farimng things ] - just asking of pure curiosity

I've always been attracted to vehicles I'll admit. The thing with vehicles is they're a great way to magnify a players overall skill. While I can do great as infantry due to my talent, put me in an airplane and it multiplies my *** kicking potential. And to answer your question - helicopters. I'd credit that to most top pilots being a little too deeply saturated with airplane piloting habits that don't translate over to helicopters. Don't count me out yet though because I'm working on it.

btw. there are some special games for people like you - they are called flight simulators. some are even 'combat' ones. i can tell you, that these games can measure your skill very well. you ask us to play counterstrike - i ask you to play lock-on modern combat.

Oh really.. so in addition to dogfighting other planes I can also kill real players playing infantry and sitting in tanks in lock on? Actually I have played that game and found it to be exceedingly boring. Not my cup of tea. I enjoy a dynamic game where tanks, helicopters, infantry and airplanes all interact together as one force. In other words - I bought Battlefield because that's exactly what I wanted - not because I wanted an infantry only shooter (or a plane only flight simulator for that matter). If you came in to Battlefield then you're most likely aware that vehicles are a cornerstone of this series.. which really begs the questions "Why did all you infantry fanboys buy this game in the first place?".

Don't worry Sid I'll save you the embarrassment and let you know I don't require you to attempt to respond to the unrespondable.

[$kelet0r]

Re: [xXx]gh0st's view on Infantry Only (IO)

As always I agree with Chris, planewhore and wolfgang
A shame DICE doesnt listen to people like this - intelligent, vociferous and passionate about what BF2 is and should be

[Retuner]

Re: [xXx]gh0st's view on Infantry Only (IO)

As always I agree with Chris, planewhore and wolfgang
A shame DICE doesnt listen to people like this - intelligent, vociferous and passionate about what BF2 is and should be

intelligent is a option .

the only thing is they don't love infrantry that's all

[Chris_Redfield]

Re: [xXx]gh0st's view on Infantry Only (IO)

intelligent is a option .

the only thing is they don't love infrantry that's all

Youre wrong here. I love infantry. I feel great while being on the land. And even though my KDR sucks, which means Im a bad player on land, it doesnt take the joy of chaotic hardcore action away from me. Being in a squad with great people (Heres a shoutout to all Americans, since Ive become to like to play with Americans the most) is pure awesomeness. Do I like jets more? Yes I do. Aviation is something I like by default, but the fact that I dont have to rely on anyone in air and all of my mistakes and acievements are my own, are certainly a bonus. Plus, in air, theres a much stronger "one vs one" atmosphere and things are more personal. Im a dogfighter, mostly, so I like fighting other jets, it is the best thing BF2 can offer for me. The fact that I mostly talki about jets doesnt mean I hate being on the ground. I love it. Note that I havent said comments like "infantry is easy", "infantry sucks" or whatnot.

EDIT: Skeletor, Im going to run for President of USA now, make sure you go to vote! LOL

[$kelet0r]

Re: [xXx]gh0st's view on Infantry Only (IO)

intelligent is a option .

the only thing is they don't love infrantry that's all

intelligence is a rarity - those who have it should be respected
they love infantry combat in BF2 probably more than you do returner - why?
because they play and love BF2 as it is and should be

When I first heard of IO mode I was CONVINCED that DICE would be designing something specially for the clans for hosting the servers that keep the game alive and run an infantry competition while simultaneously improving the core game for the public player
Instead DICE decides it makes good business sense to divide the community, piss off more customers, continue the horrific process of watering down the game even further and rewards when in the past it punished such behaviour.
Who the hell is in charge of DICE anyway? They have no clue what they are doing at all. They have the talent to make great games but they are completely devoid of any focus, vision or leadership. It is painful to watch such effort rot away.

[Chris_Redfield]

Re: [xXx]gh0st's view on Infantry Only (IO)

I know that its possible to make multiple jets spawn (naturally on unranked servers), multiple choppers and whatnot, without making it a custom map. So theres naturally an option to disable all vehicles? And by this basically a possibility to create a "vehicle lite" server (unranked)? Any server owners, please correct me.

Question is, why isnt this idea implemented right now? As an unranked form? Im sure with all these people here liking the idea so much, could influence some communities to create such server and keep it popular and crowded?

[TP.BigBoss]

Re: [xXx]gh0st's view on Infantry Only (IO)

have'nt we had this convo before, its just going over old ground, we all know what people think, everyones to there own.

[Retuner]

Re: [xXx]gh0st's view on Infantry Only (IO)

intelligence is a rarity - those who have it should be respected
they love infantry combat in BF2 probably more than you do returner - why?
because they play and love BF2 as it is and should be

When I first heard of IO mode I was CONVINCED that DICE would be designing something specially for the clans for hosting the servers that keep the game alive and run an infantry competition while simultaneously improving the core game for the public player
Instead DICE decides it makes good business sense to divide the community, piss off more customers, continue the horrific process of watering down the game even further and rewards when in the past it punished such behaviour.
Who the hell is in charge of DICE anyway? They have no clue what they are doing at all. They have the talent to make great games but they are completely devoid of any focus, vision or leadership. It is painful to watch such effort rot away.

http://www.totalbf2.com/forums/showthread.php?t=86286

in my post:

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

AND IF YOU MAKE BF2 INFRANTRY RANKEND DON"T MERGE IT WITH THE NORMAL RANKEND SYSTEEM BUT CREATE A STAND ALONE RANKEND INFRANTRY BFHQ

also contact some modders for a infrantry map pack(for rankend) (who maked the infrantry mods for bf1942 and vietnam)

Also that you may changes the flag ratio would be nice to in the IO gamemod
---------------------------------------------------

I know that its possible to make multiple jets spawn (naturally on unranked servers), multiple choppers and whatnot, without making it a custom map. So theres naturally an option to disable all vehicles? And by this basically a possibility to create a "vehicle lite" server (unranked)? Any server owners, please correct me.

Question is, why isnt this idea implemented right now? As an unranked form? Im sure with all these people here liking the idea so much, could influence some communities to create such server and keep it popular and crowded?

because there is no need for it and most clanners are the maker of the server side scirpts for infrantry because clanners love certain aspacts of the game.

It was fun&learning to shoot also atleast it was unrankend because knowing people playingstyle and there names many nice battles where played you earned each other respect.

and you heard many times gf ingame that stand for goodfight, I say that sometimes in public but most tht times no response of the players because they are to busy with there points for there next rank but old bf1942 players say it back more ofthen.

that what I miss and that what the rankend systeem has broken and gived a boost for there echo's even for me against pubs

bf1942 you killed people and healed each other or give them a helpend hand
with out getting teampoints but in bf2 they maked it easy to earn points for clanners because are already one of the best worked team together (you know them by the name pointwhores).

-----------------------------

if you want to implent it ask dice or start your own public community like clanners has his own community.

[sidtherat]

Re: [xXx]gh0st's view on Infantry Only (IO)

I know that its possible to make multiple jets spawn (naturally on unranked servers), multiple choppers and whatnot, without making it a custom map. So theres naturally an option to disable all vehicles? And by this basically a possibility to create a "vehicle lite" server (unranked)? Any server owners, please correct me.

it is possible, it is also very easy. why people dont to it very often? because it is unranked. same as air-fest maps, where pilots can challenge eachother and see who is better. there are also empty. because are unranked.

let us all bow to the mighty point

btw. talent.. yeah right

[Bungalow_Bill]

Re: [xXx]gh0st's view on Infantry Only (IO)

Unlimited airplanes is as shallow a gameplay mode as IO. I don't think the fact it is unranked has anything to do with it not being popular as it'd be rather slow way to accumulate points. However IO mode has no such problem with 5+ SPM is easy to keep for an average player on IO where as on a regular server they'd be down somewhere more like 3 SPM at best.