No Vehicle option details

[Dangerdog]

Re: No Vehicle option details

I just need to hear a compelling arguement as to why this mode NEEDS to be ranked?

It just doesn't make sense.

The fact that this mode is going to exist at all should be enough for most players...

It's basically a MOD.

The CORE, BASIC, and UNALTERED GAME should be ranked. That way, fairness and balance is NEVER a problem.

Why shouldn’t it be ranked? If you were to argue that it will be somehow used by people to pad their score I think you can get a higher kill to death ratio and score flying an airplane or driving a tank than someone walking around the map with a machine gun.

If the only thing that matters in Battlefield 2 is vehicles then why even bother to track anything else but deaths and kill with them? I currently see that Battlefield 2 is 80% about infantry combat, there’s only so many planes and tanks to go around.

Some official maps are pretty much focused on just infantry combat and are ranked, you might recognize these in the server browser with a 24/7 next to them and they’re usually full, should these be excluded from being ranked because they lack jets or even commander artillery (Iron Gator as an example)

The reason why this mode NEEDS to be ranked is because that’s the only way to track your player stats which is pretty much all you have left once you’ve unlocked all the weapons, people enjoy that aspect of Battlefield 2, even mods recognize this as evident with the efforts of Point of Existence 2 (see the front page for PoE2 update regarding player stat tracking)

You could also call Armored Fury a MOD, its focus is on Armored combat, should that be excluded from being ranked because it has too many tanks? I imagine if you set up a server with a small enough player count there would be a vehicle of some type or another for each player, presto you have the inverse of an Infantry Only type game, I wouldn’t have a problem with it being ranked. Again, Special Forces expansion, is that a MOD? None of the maps have jets; oops that’s not what Battlefield 2 is all about, that should be excluded too then?

I don’t see an Infantry Only mode an upset to fairness and balance, if anything things are even more balanced and fair, saying otherwise would be to say that one side has far superior weapons than the other, we could argue that point but I think DICE did a fairly good job making the infantry weapons balanced yet slightly different among the various teams.

[dandy]

Re: No Vehicle option details

Infantery mod need increased damage!!! More like PRMM style one shot one kill, this would make it much more teamplay oriented.

We allso need some kind of transport. boats, jeeps and heli (Only light helis like little bird and Huey)

[Talus]

Re: No Vehicle option details

Harmor, I would love to play on your Wake Island

Yes, there ARE maps where it seems like armor and aircraft 'ruin' the game. They should tweak those maps for sure. Wake is one of them.

Making a vehicle lite option would be a reasonable stop-gap until they can address the balance issue properly.

[$kelet0r]

Re: No Vehicle option details

To be fair - I'm fairly happy to have IO mode if it is the vehicle lite proposal being ranked
- if you consider yourself a real BF2 player, the points system means jack anyway. It is after all just a lure for casual players
- infantry combat already exists on Sharqi and Mashtuur and Karkand and they are ranked. IF DICE had designed all the maps with a consistent approach there wouldn't be an issue but having next to no combat vehicles on those maps kind of destroys the non ranked argument
- the existing maps are not going to be tweaked. It would take too much time and isn't likely to be done a year later
- It will keep the community together and avoid splitting
- DICE's promise that multiple game modes will be possible in a server rotation will mean that IO mode can be integrated into normal rotation.

[Bonsai]

Re: No Vehicle option details

IO or Vehicle Light (fingers crossed) will have to be ranked or nobody is going to want to play them.

[Dangerdog]

Re: No Vehicle option details

Infantery mod need increased damage!!! More like PRMM style one shot one kill, this would make it much more teamplay oriented.

We allso need some kind of transport. boats, jeeps and heli (Only light helis like little bird and Huey)

While I respect your enjoyment of the Project Reality Mod I completely disagree, save the reality tweaks for the mods. People want to play Infantry Only without having to adjust to different rules and balance tweaks between regular BF2 and an Infantry Only mode.

To be fair - I'm fairly happy to have IO mode if it is the vehicle lite proposal being ranked
- if you consider yourself a real BF2 player, the points system means jack anyway. It is after all just a lure for casual players
- infantry combat already exists on Sharqi and Mashtuur and Karkand and they are ranked. IF DICE had designed all the maps with a consistent approach there wouldn't be an issue but having next to no combat vehicles on those maps kind of destroys the non ranked argument
- the existing maps are not going to be tweaked. It would take too much time and isn't likely to be done a year later
- It will keep the community together and avoid splitting
- DICE's promise that multiple game modes will be possible in a server rotation will mean that IO mode can be integrated into normal rotation.

I don't think they'll take the time to balance vehicle placement on the maps either, way too much work, I'd love to be proven wrong though

With regard to having IO in rotatoin with regular BF2 unfortunately that won’t be possible with the way they implemented this game mode apparently.

Multiple game modes in a single map list was one of the fixes on our initial list. So it *should* be fixed.

However because the no vehicles option is a switch set at server launch and not a mape game mode it cant be used like this.

[Talus]

Re: No Vehicle option details

IO or Vehicle Light (fingers crossed) will have to be ranked or nobody is going to want to play them.

If people didn't want to play them, we wouldn't even be having this discussion.

People play MODS because they WANT to....not because they're ranked.

[Dangerdog]

Re: No Vehicle option details

If people didn't want to play them, we wouldn't even be having this discussion.

People play MODS because they WANT to....not because they're ranked.

Having all the unlocks already I don’t play ranked for points or increasing rank, tracking stats is sometimes interesting to look at but the real reason I enjoy playing ranked is that there’s consistency to the game, I don’t have to worry about not having a custom user made map that’s in rotation or that someone made alterations to the gameplay rules which are only apparent once you’ve joined a server, it’s alterations of these types which can be quite annoying for multiplayer games that give free reign over game servers.

Beyond that ranked servers also generally provide a better overall experience with regard to being setup to accommodate things like 64 players properly, I don’t relish the idea of connecting to a low ping non-ranked server only to find out that it’s being hosted off of someone’s DSL internet connection.

[Talus]

Re: No Vehicle option details

Right...I play ranked because I KNOW I am less likely to run into any 'funny business' with custom settings or rules and that the server is going to be of a certain quality.

[5TAK3D]

Re: No Vehicle option details

I'm utterly baffled at people's reactions to the addition of an infantry only OPTION. Emphasis on the important fact there.
Anyone would think half of you were being forced to only ever play the game this way or that it was destroying the basic game for everyone. It isn't. Why deprive people who want to play without jets/arty randomly killing them every few minutes of being able to do so? Again: It's an option. Why shouldn't it be ranked? The fact that people will get higher accuracy and general weapons scores as opposed to the Karkland alley whores? Well... so what?

You do not have to play it that way, though I for one am willing to give it a fair try because as has been mentioned, Wake seems like it'd be interesting to play this way for one. If you don't like it, fine. Don't play it. It's an additional option for people that adds some variety and new ways to play maps. Why not just get over it and let those of us who want to do so enjoy it? We aren't going to stop you playing your "classic" BF2 or ***** that you can use vehicles. Why try to prevent us playing this way? It doesn't affect you.

[Dangerdog]

Re: No Vehicle option details

The argument against it so far seems to be that people who pretty much only enjoy the jets/armor/arty random killing are afraid this might become too popular and they wouldn’t have the selection of servers to choose from, and like minded people would gravitate towards regular Battlefield servers and there would be even more contention for the limited vehicles that are in the game, thereby affecting their game.

[Red Devil]

Re: No Vehicle option details

So what's wrong with that? Then they can all hang out at the helipad like in 'Mine' and shoot each other. :laugh:

Seriously, all it takes is to look at the options when you click on a server name to see if it says, "Infantry Only 0" or "Infantry Only 1".

[Dangerdog]

Re: No Vehicle option details

I was just condensing down Planewhores tirade into the perils of adding Infantry Only to Battlefield 2 while cutting to the heart of his argument (see this post).

Personally I don’t see this as a detriment to the game but an asset, just like in BF2142 you’ll see both Titan and Conquest modes of play, both will be ranked, one could say that Titan focuses more on infantry combat because there are no flag caps and the only way you’ll actually win the game is for soldiers to destroy their enemy’s reactor inside the Titan.

[Shepherd007]

Re: No Vehicle option details

Here are the problems I have with IO:

First, DICE is intent on adding options, tapping resources that could be used instead to fix the bugs currently in place. By working on the bugs and current game play problems only, we'd have a patch sooner rather than later. I don't need yet another gameplay change; I need the red-tag bug fixed, the karkand hotel glitch eliminated, and several other problems remedied.

Second, everyone here purchased BF2 knowing vehicles are involved in the game. The maps are designed to play with vehicles, adding IO would eliminate the value of certain maps, or throw out the balance altogether. Who wants to play Gulf of Oman or Kubra Dam in IO? Why would I want to walk around those maps when I can drive? Karkand and Mashtuur City would easily be stalemates, as the infantry would have no jeeps to speed around choke points or have armor to help punch through them. Plus, Iron Gator is pretty much an IO map. If IO is so popular, why don't I see it on more map rotations? Instead of adding an IO option, make Road to Jalalabad like Iron Gator and leave it at that.

Finally, I don't want to have look through different settings or load a map to learn that said map is IO. I want to hop in a game and play, knowing that serverABC's Sharqi is the same as serverXYZ's Sharqi.
Besides, why make an IO option that actually goes against BF2's ROE? Why not make a Pistols and Knives option, or an Assault only option?

[Dangerdog]

Re: No Vehicle option details

First, I'm sure they have more than one person working on fixing the bugs, this is something that might have been handed off to an intern to work on for all we know.

Second, Nobody is forcing you to play IO just like nobody is forcing people to play on maps with jets in them or maybe too much armor for their tate, it’s optional, service is voluntary you’re not being drafted; the core game is still there and will be just as popular as ever.

I agree, even though there is a server variable which you could use to filter on using an external server browser like qtracker there should be a way to only bring up IO servers, perhaps under the pull-down menu option where you can choose Conquest or Co-op.

If IO ends up being viewed as an upset to the rank and award system I imagine it’ll remain unranked, that may be an unfortunate necessity given some peoples obscure views over the value placed on the rank system as it would forgo the ability to track stats.