For all plane whores.

[maranello]

Re: For all plane whores.

Mods - close?

I would but:

1. It's a very hot debate.
2. Old topics always became a flame war OR they went off topic.
3. Freedom of speech:hmm:

[jakswan]

Re: For all plane whores.

Planewhore give it up. Seems to me your biggest single issue is with getting shot down, you say dogfighting takes no skill but that's rubbish I already posted a 1.2 vid of some dogfighting, and it's not your 'look at this guy flying straight how easy it is to kill him' but with a few who actually try to evade.

Sometimes a lesser skilled pilot gets me at the right angle or the wrong place and bang I'm dead, never mind I'll get him 7/8 times in a round, it's only a game, what, is he supposed not to have any chance at all.

Never been so easy to get a plane, so I don't know where you get these flocks of people from.

I say again although you list a number of reasons why it's so wrong, you only really have one issue, you can be shot down.

[tsh2005]

Re: For all plane whores.

Funny but 1.2 Air to air/AA is so very good right now jets still own the sky not much ground as air... All you have to do is go after helis/transport helis/boats/jeeps and the one or two jets

It’s so easy now and because not many people fly I can almost always find something to hop into.. LOL last 3-4 games i played on different servers large number of people 50+ there was always a jet.. sometimes all air is at base.. doesnt happen 24/7 but much much more often then before

Last game I played on a large man server 50 or so people I had a score of 70/1 (something like that)... All I did was stay away from base/ spammed missiles at anything in the air which if one AA missed it would go after something else and hit... So I always got kills


Its kind of boring or it is boring I'm not sure... Some maps are harder I would guess but not the ones I play on... Oman/wake etc

Choppers/jets its all to easy to take down.. AA zig zags and everything but it always hits about 78% of the time or more


WAYYY To easy :laugh:

And ground AA.. I always figure if I have low health and are locked on just bail.. No point to try and evade the AA… Best thing to do is just switch views and scan the area

Its just to dam easy…. What else can I say?? I don’t even have to try when I aim.. I just never noticed this until I got bored today and started flying more

[maranello]

Re: For all plane whores.

My opinion:

If you are taking the aircraft in BF2 seriously, you have big problems. You shouldn't be so addicted to the aircraft in BF2. It is not meant to be realistic at all.

If you like flying planes, fine, I do too. But BF2 is not the game for that kind of gameplay! You guys need to relax, and play Falcon 4.0 AF OR LOMAC or smth. Those games will never make you whine or complain about the aircraft or aircraft physics. It is so much funner and better to fly the aircraft in those games. *ahem* simulations. If you think you are skillful, and BF2 is too easy for you, and it's too arcade, AND you want to deal with real good pilots, FINE! play those simulations, and come back here and let's see if you can still own them

On the other hand, if you are not that competitive, and if the aircraft is p!ssing you off now because of the patch, FINE! play infantry maps You guys think too seriously about this game. Open your eyes, it's just a game. I am not saying just jump in a server and mess around. Tactics, strats, teamplay, and so on ARE important in this game. But this is completely different, you are (some of you) trying to convince the other group that the planes in the game are too unrealistic whereas the other group is doing the opposite. Well it's neither! They never even thought about planes that much. Look at the cockpit of the plane for christ's sake.:laugh: It must've taken them 1 day to draw that cockpit. There isn't even any detail at all.

These vehicles in BF2 were added as "add-ons". They are not the core content of the game. They are not there to make the Battlefield 2 a Battlefield series game. They are there to make the game funner.

Just play city maps guys, calm down, relax, have fun.

[zacman13245]

Re: For all plane whores.

I fly because it is different than the regular point and shoot of a FPS. It makes it different and slightly more difficult

[tsh2005]

Re: For all plane whores.

dont think many people take BF2 seriously or think any of it is real.. but thats just me

[Chris_Redfield]

Re: For all plane whores.

Im nto even bothering. Look at the first post and tell me its not a fracking troll. No matter what you say from this point, its like ****ing in the wind.

Nowhere have I ever liked the attitude "i pwned you, retards in jets, youre all idiots and you die like fvcking n00bs hahahaha"- like this one! Jesus man, are you sure you came here for a conversation? Or do you like a verbal slap in the face and leave in shame?

Maranello, dont worry-

3. Freedom of speech:hmm:

Does not apply to forums with strickt rules. You can lock it up ANY time you feel it will go into a debate in order to prevent conflicts. I know moderation is hard sometimes and the risk of being called a "forum nazi" is sometimes great, but dont be TOO technical. Freedom of speach is a BS word anway.

[sidtherat]

Re: For all plane whores.

Dogfighting is flat out easier. All of the skill has been taken out of it, and the only things that matter are flare status, type of plane you are flying, and a host of other random variables that may or may not swing in your favor.

define the skill

a) missiles DO NOT always hit! in high ping games [50-100ms] most missiles fired in sharp turn are going to miss! most probably they will hit nearby target, but not the one they were fired in the first place - turning still helps, but of course it is not 100% effective as in pre-patch
b) skill is not only hitting someone with canon, if you allowed a newbie on your tail, and cant shake him - you obviously do not have enough skill - face it - missiles do not arm and lock instantly - you gave gim a time to do so. you should know that lock range is reduced, you no longer can pick shots from extreme range, and when you follow someone closely it is actualy harder to keep the lock if he maneuvers
c) this is HOMMING missile, this is MODERN game, this is not simulator

Ground AA versus planes is far too easy to use. No player imput is required at all. Why not go one step further and man all of the AA post with mindless robots? AA used to work in 1.12, but it required experience and technique, which is something most BF2 players do not have. Now in 1.2, even the most mentally handicapped individual can destroy the most skilled pilots. Not cool.

sorry to say, but this is complete bullcrap. 1.12 aa effective? it took skill? it was exactly the same skill factor included with 1.12 bonus - 2 missiles were enough, in 1.2 most times you require 3 to go! if you die from stationary AA then you realy, realy deserve it. times of killing infantry with your wingtips are over [i realy enjoyed this part of wake island games]

Now in 1.2, even the most mentally handicapped individual can destroy the most skilled pilots. Not cool.

quotted for bullcrap - skilled pilot DOES NOT fly low and slow enough for AA to lock on and reach the target.. plane at full speed can fly over the AA unscratched! only high enough, not at the grass level. the time AA has the lock you are over it, before missiles reach you, you are out of range. how it is possible that you dont know it? do i feel bias/hypocrysy? maybe old habits of flying low and slow, just to skillfuly place 5 bombs over a green square on your hud

The one huge difference however, is now a newbie actually defend themselves versus a veteran pilot. All it takes is two clicks of the missile button and they've taken out a grizzled veteran with absolutely no imput or intelligent thought required.

wow, so the SKILL is to kill someone that cant fight back? if you are so godly, kill him before he kills you, rape the airfield, kill him while he reloads, any problems?
you'd like to sound like god, but you cry like a baby

and for the fin: who ever said that flying should be easy? bombing the spawn point with a bomber reaaaaly takes the skill, isnt it? raping the carier?

flying is still fun, in fact it is much more fun for me now, than it was before, because many 'gods of the skies' do not fly anymore, and jets are AVAILABLE! they resigned because, they couldn f.. adapt to flying high, fast and with a bit of thinking and planning

and the best part - i wasnt tked for a plane in weeks now.. oh my.. i still cant believe it

[Bungalow_Bill]

Re: For all plane whores.

Thank you for making your bias and intentions apparent MrBenis, and now I shall respond.

Oh planewhore, here's a newsflash for you... this isnt a flight simulator.

Newsflash for your Benis, this isn't Counterstrike. I fly planes, I shoot guns, and I roll around in armor. Vehicles should be more powerful than infantry. Why can't everybody accept that simple fact? Vehicles and infantry interaction is the Battlefield series on defining characteristic and if you don't like there are literally hundreds of online FPS without vehicles.

Have you even tried using AA since 1.2? Or have you only been on the recieving end?

I've already made it clear I play as infantry. Thus it is logical to assume I have killed countless planes since the patch as infantry, and only because they are easy kills now. Not to mention, I haven't been killed once by a plane on the ground since the patch, and rarely was killed by planes when playing infantry in 1.12 as pilots prey on the weak and the ignorant. For the most part though, besides the complete lack of player interaction S2A missiles do not bother me all that much, and it's more the A2A missiles that bother me.

AA requires patience, timing and conservation of resources.

In 1.12 they did, yes I agree, but not in 1.2.

Contact and lock times are minimal at best, aim is required to ensure they maintain a lock (firing from the edge of the lock circle results in more failures than successful locks FYI)

Locking and firing AA missiles is by far the easiest thing to do in the game, no aiming is required (past putting your target in a massive crosshairs for a second). You're incorrect on your assumption that firing from the edge of the circle results in a miss. Since 1.2, I haven't missed a single missile and either it hits my enemy, or it hits a teammate, but it always hits something.

Don't question my integrity either: I was there when those 100 per round scores were happening. They happened often, and there was no defence.

You're a prime example of my theory in action. Name the names of the pilots and we'll see if they've got 200 scores in any map. Oh wait you can't remember now? Too bad. Proof, not hearsay.

But now I've got a functional weapon and you wanna remove it so you can continue to statpad the unfortunate other pilots who maybe missed out on a jet because they were too slow, mis-spawned or got tk'd in the process?

If I wanted to stat pad I'd whore armor or the medic instead, they worked great in 1.12, and they still work great in 1.2. The AA missiles in 1.12 were functional but adaquete technique and skill to be employed (I knew a few people who had it down it a science and could hit me with almost every shot from ground AA assuming I wasn't in a J-10). But I agree that AA missiles in 1.12 needed something a little more concrete than all of the undocumented techniques and methods used by experienced players get successful hits. I don't have a problem with ground forces having a functional AA launcher but I want it to require some imput, and I do want to force them to time it and aim it accurately and continue to aim it directly at me for the missiles to connect. When I'm flying around in my fighter and want to drop a bomb on that tank, I can't simply just click my bomb button and have it autohit my intended target. I've got to perfectly line up, consider my speed, the trajectory of the tank, my altitude, my speed and finally release the bomb at the exact moment so it can accurately hit a relatively small target.

Infact, I'd like the AA lock range to be increased, its too low, however thats a discussion for a different thread.

I have absolutely no problem with increasing the range as long as the skill required, and the player interaction is added.

PS. Having you use your text color made me weep.

[Crowned]

Re: For all plane whores.

tl;dr

[tsh2005]

Re: For all plane whores.

LOL sidtherat .. what you talking about lag?? look what i posted

2-3secs lock... ok :) and its not hard at all to follow someone you can see all views

you turn and that works for you? Just making a turn/roll whatever? I have got to see that please make a vid or something.. because last round i played people did all kinds of moves/rolls/turns/flares etc but ill i had to do was follow and wait for that 2-3sec lock

I find air to air to easy.. most helis/jets etc are easy targets for other flyers.. I guess this is why more jets/helis are always at spawn its just kind of boring.. fun for a little bit making some points but gets old i guess for me at least

[Bungalow_Bill]

Re: For all plane whores.

define the skill

1. Proficiency, facility, or dexterity that is acquired or developed through training or experience.
2. 1. An art, trade, or technique, particularly one requiring use of the hands or body.
   2. A developed talent or ability

a) missiles DO NOT always hit! in high ping games [50-100ms] most missiles fired in sharp turn are going to miss! most probably they will hit nearby target, but not the one they were fired in the first place

You must be doing something wrong. I haven't missed once since the patch. I consider a miss a flat out miss, of course sometimes the missiles track another target, but they'll still hit something.

- turning still helps,

No.

but of course it is not 100% effective as in pre-patch

If that was the case, everyone would've had my 100:1 KDR. How could this be possible when most people have a 4:1 KDR in a plane?

if you allowed a newbie on your tail, and cant shake him - you obviously do not have enough skill - face it - missiles do not arm and lock instantly - you gave gim a time to do so. you should know that lock range is reduced, you no longer can pick shots from extreme range, and when you follow someone closely it is actualy harder to keep the lock if he maneuvers

I'm sorry, but I make a turn, a plane is out of my view distance, and planes have many blind spots. Pilot gets behind me, my flares are down, and as long as they aren't completely incompetent I'm dead. Those are random variables, and I don't have access to a 360 degree monitor that allows me to see every square inch of sky surrounding my plane. View distance is a big factor, and a few feet on view distance can mean the difference between dying to a pilot, or killing one. Not skill.

c) this is HOMMING missile, this is MODERN game, this is not simulator

Don't bring reality in to this. These are heat seeking missiles, heat seeking missiles do not giving pilots a warning beep in the cockpit. This is an arcade shooter with vehicles, reality does not always = fun. Please never become a games designer.

sorry to say, but this is complete bullcrap. 1.12 aa effective? it took skill? it was exactly the same skill factor included with 1.12 bonus - 2 missiles were enough, in 1.2 most times you require 3 to go! if you die from stationary AA then you realy, realy deserve it. times of killing infantry with your wingtips are over

I must suck then because outside of the J-10 I'd constantly get hit by AA missiles. If people timed the missiles right they'd hit much more often, thus I say they require skill. Plus the average pilot KDR I'd estimate at around a 4:1-5:1, so tell me sidtherat, if AA isn't killing these pilots the thousands of times they've been killed then what is? Are you telling me that they are all crashing this frequently? Sorry, statistics are on my side, and so is reality.

skilled pilot DOES NOT fly low and slow enough for AA to lock on and reach the target.. plane at full speed can fly over the AA unscratched! only high enough, not at the grass level. the time AA has the lock you are over it, before missiles reach you, you are out of range.

Pilots have to go low to attack targets. Pilots cannot watch all targets in a 360 degree view. For example. I make a run on an enemy base, first thing I check (as always), is if the AA is manned or not. I confirm it is not manned at the second, so I fly over the target and drop a bomb on the apc. I'm now directly over the base and someone decides, hey, time to get in the AA launcher. They see me, they lock, they fire, and if my flares are down I die. That is a very simple example, but did I do anything wrong? Now take most maps, when 3 AAs often times can shoot at you at once, and then you can't fly anywhere without getting locked on to without being a completely submissive pilot always waiting for flares. The kind of pilots I outscore every round with my PKM.

wow, so the SKILL is to kill someone that cant fight back? if you are so godly, kill him before he kills you, rape the airfield, kill him while he reloads, any problems?

Clearly they can fight back because I'm shooting down all their aircraft. Are those pilots saying my team can't fight back? DICE shouldn't reward incompetence and lack of ability, but that is exactly what the 1.2 patch did.

and for the fin: who ever said that flying should be easy? bombing the spawn point with a bomber reaaaaly takes the skill, isnt it? raping the carier?

I don't fly bombers, they are too easy. If the Essex gun has been playing BF2 for more than 10 minutes it shouldn't be easy. Essex gun can kill a pilot in less than a second of cannon fire, and packs 8 very fast missiles. Couple that with no turning speed cap and an Essex can meet a plane head on, destroy it, and defend the carrier.

flying is still fun, in fact it is much more fun for me now, than it was before, because many 'gods of the skies' do not fly anymore, and jets are AVAILABLE!

LOL thanks for making my prediciton of the thread come true. You like flying now because you stand a chance against the "Gods of the skies" as you put it. Good for you, have a cookie. I see more people lining up to fly this patch because it's so easy.

[sidtherat]

Re: For all plane whores.

turning works for others, because many times i shot a missile it went completly in oposite direction, it happen mostly when me and my target are circling sharply upwards, maybe missiles are attracted to nearby flares dropped by other fliers but i have no clue about reasons

as you perfectly know, lag IS the factor, i have a sh.. connection and had many sh.. accidents because of it, maybe it is a factor when it comes to missiles and tracking system - the higher the ping, the lower the chance to kill

[anchlovi]

Re: For all plane whores.

Don't know what about you but flying now is much more fun and challenging... Fly high, dive down for bombing and disappear again, show real skills in dog fights and etc...

I like it much more now than before...

Never the less I'm not a WHORE, I'll never kill for a vehicle.

[tsh2005]

Re: For all plane whores.

When the AA doesnt hit its beacuse one or two things


Lag like you said, You locked on but fired right at that sec he flared, Fired at a point when you are going up or making quick turns.. Bug kind of like the AT bug when you fire but nothing happens probably something with lag again that 1.2 made, Another bug kind of like the Tv missle bug when the AA goes threw

Other then this most of the time it hits.. Not all AA but you have about 5 right? around 3 of those hit if you think of it that way.. at least last 4 games i played it was like this

I never had a missle go in the other direction.. This was only in 1.12.. 1.2 the missles will do what i said up above or spin around the jet/heli or just zig zag around it but never go in the other direction once locked

I kind of like the zig zagging bug.. fire at certain areas around the map makes the AA go all over the place hitting anything..dont need a lock :)