1.2 Death of Attack Helis

[TCO-Spleenage]

Re: 1.2 Death of Attack Helis

battlefield series of game always produced a bunch of egoistical pilots who think that they have the most teamwork and skills.

WRONG. planes are very easy to fly, I am flying them the very first day I downloaded the demo, and my skill level has been constant ever since, it's really a noob's weapon.

I'd call that a lie if i've ever heard one, unless you are stating you have flown simulators of other sorts for 3 years now.

[Paas]

Re: 1.2 Death of Attack Helis

I'd call that a lie if i've ever heard one, unless you are stating you have flown simulators of other sorts for 3 years now.

Planes aren't difficult to fly. Hell, I use the Mouse and Keyboard and Pre-Patch I was still able to outfly "Most" of the people I ran into online.

Most of my deaths where from my "nipping" my wing on a tree of somthing while getting low and fast, but rarely was I shot down.

{WP}Paas

[Roger Smith]

Re: 1.2 Death of Attack Helis

1.2 is a noob patch

you mean anti-noob right?

why did they need to nerf the attack helis like this

so the pilot and gunner require skill and teamwork to survive and win.

noobs who don't have a brain and thought they should be able to take an attack heli down by firing their G36C

um, am i missing something, g36cs dont have anything to do with the things you said make the attack heli nerfed in this version.

By suping up the AA to be noob friendly, point, 2 left clicks and your dead, also means now that planes are so deadly against helis as well. If a plane targets you now waits for flares to drop then there is no escape in an attack heli.

um, its called timing, drop your flares when you hear a solid tone, not a broken one. ground aa has a limited range, use this to your advantage. further more, a good jet pilot stays at almost top speed at most times, giving you no time to wait for flares to drop. i do agree that the cannon kills helis quicker, but if you have proper airsupport, you wont have that problem.

Guess what helis are suppose to kill tanks, not the other way around. Helis are suppose to kill ground pounders with their G36C's firing at them.

if you are ****ty enough of a pilot to get hit by a tank round or an at round, you deserve to go down.

If you use your brain you would find it was easy to take a heli down in 1.12 AA was effective against helis, especially if 2 sites were firing at you it almost always = death. .50 cals were extremely effective, especially if 2 were firing at you, if it didn't kill you it would make you run away.

to tell you the truth a good aa gunner in 1.12 is not much differnet than 1.2, i think its like a 1 missile differnece, ground aa has only 2 missiles so it adds up.


look dood, you are wrong on every level possible, i can still pilot the attack heli effectivly just fine unless a good jet pilot comes around and cannons me. but thats just haveing good airsupport. helicopters are not at the top of the food chain, so it should be expected that jets take them out. anyhow. i can survive against aa just fine, its all about knowing when to release flares, staying away from hostle ground aa, and hugeing terrain when the 50 cal lights you up to get away. yes the attack heli can be killed by the ground more easily now, but they still have a huge advantage over the ground, they choose when and where to fight. if you arent smart enough to survive in the attack heli in 1.2, give me the pilots seat you noob. in 1.2 an attack heli can still rape the enemy ground units with ease, you just have to know how to fly and when to fight/not, it takes good communication. its called battlefield for a reason, because everyone can kill and be killed, the patch is a godsend if you ask me, and i am proficient in the air, and on the ground, go play a rpg if you want what you have to be the rule, rather than what you can do with it.

[« R²» HKS]

Re: 1.2 Death of Attack Helis

None of you actually got the interesting point from that long post. In public servers- all being Rambos´n´**** expected to singlehandedly down an attack chopper so they whined their hearts out. Most of those who whine actually promote infantry level teamwork and adress it as one of the greatest aspect in the game. Then we have HKS coming in telling you EXACTLY how to down a chopper, and his method has always worked, it works everywhere. 2 soldiers teamed up and doing teamwork actually makes up for 5 solo gunners.

That is exactly my point. Thanks Chris for someone actually seeing it and comprehending it.

The average BF2 server is 64 Rambos running around. Our server is heavily teamwork focused. If you don't play as a team and use good teamwork you will die faster than you know what happened. You rarely come up against a lone wolf. Its a squad of 6 all communicating to each other over VOIP. 1 vs 6 = death for the rambo. Its totally different flying or ground pounding on our server compared to the average BF2 server. Its BF2 how its meant to be played, that is as a team!

That means people spot out the dangers to them including helis. Then you have 1 manning an AA and 1 or maybe 2 in the .50 cals. You can blow a heli before they can escape or before the heli could kill these threats.

AA was effective against helis in 1.12 However it required skill to use not just jump in, get lock and left click twice like it is now. I have downed so many helis I never saw them as a real threat because I could counter them using effective teamwork. Our squad would always down helis, no problems whatsoever. Its the gun hoe rambos that cried that they couldn't do it all by themselves.

I could also down planes with 1.12 AA. It required a lot of skill but it was possible. People had a go figured they couldn't do it 1st try then gave up. You had to wait for the right moment to fire. Now its merely 2 left clicks and their dead.

Planes have a reasonable chance of avoiding AA by flying high and dive bombing an AA site. Helis can't do that and don't have a "reasonable" chance of avoiding AA. That is my biggest beef with 1.2, a noob rambo can single handedly down an attack heli with either 2 left clicks using AA, or 2 AT rockets, or 1 tank shell or 1sec burst from a planes mg or a single .50cal before it overheats. That is not reasonable and is in no way balanced and has nothing to do with teamwork.

[Paas]

Re: 1.2 Death of Attack Helis

I could also down planes with 1.12 AA. It required a lot of skill but it was possible. People had a go figured they couldn't do it 1st try then gave up. You had to wait for the right moment to fire. Now its merely 2 left clicks and theire dead.

...Helis can't do that and don't have a "reasonable" chance of avoiding AA...

Oh my friggin' god! Hell people.. do ya' not read the crap after ya' type it? Is it all just blind anger and confusion!? What's the damn deal!?

Look. Capt.HKS, amigo, homey. The darn A.A. was "BROKEN" post 1.12. Broken mah' man, not working correctly. It didn't requite "a lot of skill" to down a jet, it required "a lot of luck" or "another jet". There are MULTIPLE reports of A.A. simply changing its mind while chasing an unflared jet. Yes, it used to just change it's friggin' mind at the drop of a hat. You know it, I know it, everyone knows it. Quit acting like it wasn't the freaking case... Jesus. This denial is confusing.

Now, onto the next one. "Heli's ... don't have a reasonable chance of avoiding A.A...."; wha!? You act is if there is a platform in EVERY location on the friggin' map. You know where Anti-Air is?! It's at the flags... you know those things your ground pounders are usually charging for. Yes, those. Stay away from them unless you're needed. It's not your job to apply a solid coat of "Rape" to the infantry. It's your job to make sure two forces don't rape your friendlies: Tanks/Other Helos. Do your job, quit trying to fly in like god's gift to modern warfare, and you will live longer. Don't expose your Helo unless it's needed. Don't patroll within' the locking distance of A.A.

It's really that simple... if you cannot survive in a post 1.2-patch, you really should just leave the Helo alone. I have no problem staying airborne for extended periods of time; neither does a vast majority of the Helo pilots I play with and against. What's your deal?

{WP}Paas

[Lugal317]

Re: 1.2 Death of Attack Helis

if you are ****ty enough of a pilot to get hit by a tank round or an at round, you deserve to go down.

Getting hit by a tank or AT doesn't mean you're a bad pilot. The increased power of the AA has now forced helicopters to fly very low, making them more suceptable to AT rockets, Tanks, APCs, FAVs, and sometimes GLs.

[Paas]

Re: 1.2 Death of Attack Helis

Getting hit by a tank or AT doesn't mean you're a bad pilot. The increased power of the AA has now forced helicopters to fly very low, making them more suceptable to AT rockets, Tanks, APCs, FAVs, and sometimes GLs.

...I don't see the problem here. Helo's have the advantage of terrian. So, flying low really doesn't hinder them at all. Especially if you have an extremely talented gunner.

{WP}Paas

[DeadMeat_03]

Re: 1.2 Death of Attack Helis

I haven't seen a huge difference in the effectiveness of the Helicopter when used by an experienced pilot. There are some maps that have a lower density AA and they don't seem to have a problem.

[Roger Smith]

Re: 1.2 Death of Attack Helis

The darn A.A. was "BROKEN" pre 1.2.

exactly

[Lugal317]

Re: 1.2 Death of Attack Helis

...I don't see the problem here. Helo's have the advantage of terrian. So, flying low really doesn't hinder them at all. Especially if you have an extremely talented gunner.

{WP}Paas

I didn't say it hindered them I said it made them more susceptable to those things.

You can't always see a tank around the next corner.

[[DC]M4guy624]

Re: 1.2 Death of Attack Helis

you all say waaaa waaa quit whining use more skill n00b... which is exactly what you should of done in the first place... I don't see tanks having to drive around TOW missile sites because its insta death... why should the heli's and jets have to avoid the missile sites like the plague. Anyone can rack up kills in a tank like a madman... its a 100% advantage over a grunt, no one complains because alot of infantry people have weapons that do a small amount of damage to it. People don't realize they have weapons against jets/heli's too... stingers (which bugs me... theres so many stingers and so much less TOW sites when the number of tanks per side greatly outnumber the number of aircraft), 50 cal (oh come on its not that hard to hit a jet w/ one... its called aiming ahead... it does a boatload of damage too).

Why should it require lots of work and skill to survive in a jet or heli when any idiot can take an APC or Tank and rack up kills. I want more TOW's and reduced armor on tanks and apcs... they kill me all the time its not fair waaaaaaaaaaaaaaa. I don't know what you were complaining about in the first place, i didn't get killed that much by jets or helis, and if i did its because i was sitting on an AA site lighting myself up to his radar and i deserved to die... just like how if you fire an AT rocket at a tank it swings around and kills you... so fine... leave the AA as it is but nerf everything else... lets make it really balanced.

Before you could dodge missiles... its a real life concept... instead of making the missiles homing beacons of doom they should have made them better (i mean missing a plane flying straight... that was BAD but this is absurd.) Oh well now I just target the AA sites whether i be on the ground or in the air... gives me some satisfaction that I may be gunning down one of the whiny n00bs trying to get a free kill that they couldn't get before due to lack of skill.

[Roger Smith]

Re: 1.2 Death of Attack Helis

1) Getting hit by a tank or AT doesn't mean you're a bad pilot. 2) The increased power of the AA has now forced helicopters to fly very low, making them more suceptable to AT rockets, Tanks, APCs, FAVs, and sometimes GLs.

1)um, ya it does, you have speed and terrain on your side.

2) its a support weapon, dont engage enemy units while enemy aa is in the area. its a balancing factor for having an extreamly effective anti armor and anti personal weapon. if you fly clandestine routes and always take care of aa before engging other units, you will be fine, i know i am.

[DeadMeat_03]

Re: 1.2 Death of Attack Helis

you all say waaaa waaa quit whining use more skill n00b... which is exactly what you should of done in the first place... I don't see tanks having to drive around TOW missile sites because its insta death... why should the heli's and jets have to avoid the missile sites like the plague. Anyone can rack up kills in a tank like a madman... its a 100% advantage over a grunt, no one complains because alot of infantry people have weapons that do a small amount of damage to it. People don't realize they have weapons against jets/heli's too... stingers (which bugs me... theres so many stingers and so much less TOW sites when the number of tanks per side greatly outnumber the number of aircraft), 50 cal (oh come on its not that hard to hit a jet w/ one... its called aiming ahead... it does a boatload of damage too).

Why should it require lots of work and skill to survive in a jet or heli when any idiot can take an APC or Tank and rack up kills. I want more TOW's and reduced armor on tanks and apcs... they kill me all the time its not fair waaaaaaaaaaaaaaa. I don't know what you were complaining about in the first place, i didn't get killed that much by jets or helis, and if i did its because i was sitting on an AA site lighting myself up to his radar and i deserved to die... just like how if you fire an AT rocket at a tank it swings around and kills you... so fine... leave the AA as it is but nerf everything else... lets make it really balanced.

Before you could dodge missiles... its a real life concept... instead of making the missiles homing beacons of doom they should have made them better (i mean missing a plane flying straight... that was BAD but this is absurd.) Oh well now I just target the AA sites whether i be on the ground or in the air... gives me some satisfaction that I may be gunning down one of the whiny n00bs trying to get a free kill that they couldn't get before due to lack of skill.

Ok, I'm a little confused. Are you for or against the 1.2 changes to AA??

[Lugal317]

Re: 1.2 Death of Attack Helis

1)um, ya it does, you have speed and terrain on your side.

You are an idiot.

[Paas]

Re: 1.2 Death of Attack Helis

you all say waaaa waaa quit whining use more skill n00b... which is exactly what you should of done in the first place... I don't see tanks having to drive around TOW missile sites because its insta death... why should the heli's and jets have to avoid the missile sites like the plague. Anyone can rack up kills in a tank like a madman... its a 100% advantage over a grunt, no one complains because alot of infantry people have weapons that do a small amount of damage to it. People don't realize they have weapons against jets/heli's too... stingers (which bugs me... theres so many stingers and so much less TOW sites when the number of tanks per side greatly outnumber the number of aircraft), 50 cal (oh come on its not that hard to hit a jet w/ one... its called aiming ahead... it does a boatload of damage too).

Why should it require lots of work and skill to survive in a jet or heli when any idiot can take an APC or Tank and rack up kills. I want more TOW's and reduced armor on tanks and apcs... they kill me all the time its not fair waaaaaaaaaaaaaaa. I don't know what you were complaining about in the first place, i didn't get killed that much by jets or helis, and if i did its because i was sitting on an AA site lighting myself up to his radar and i deserved to die... just like how if you fire an AT rocket at a tank it swings around and kills you... so fine... leave the AA as it is but nerf everything else... lets make it really balanced.

Before you could dodge missiles... its a real life concept... instead of making the missiles homing beacons of doom they should have made them better (i mean missing a plane flying straight... that was BAD but this is absurd.) Oh well now I just target the AA sites whether i be on the ground or in the air... gives me some satisfaction that I may be gunning down one of the whiny n00bs trying to get a free kill that they couldn't get before due to lack of skill.

You did a couple of things wrong here.

First, you didn't make any damn sense.

Second, you sighted reality as a motive for the actions of BattleField2 while obviously not taking into context the limitatios of the game; scope/scale being a major factor.

Third, ...you do know there is an "Anti-Tank" kit right. You know this? I assume you do. Ok. There is your extra "TOWs" right there. The fact that any character in the game can garner and Anti-Tank rocket and bring pain to armor. Now. Besides a single Anti-Air vehicle, and a bunch of static A.A. sites, what do you suppose ground pounders use against a jet? We don't have a "Stinger" class like some would love. Hell, we don't have anything but static A.A., and usually "ONE" Anti-Air vehicle.

...is this even getting through to you? I pray it is. If not, I just wasted my time.

Fourth, Missing a straight flying jet, that doesn't pop flares, with a stinger is "Absurd" ... this is mearly, " Closer to perfectly balanced". As it stood before the patch, a Jet had nothing to fear but another Jet. This is still mostly true, only a Jet now has to also fear Mobile A-A.

The arguments against the patch are getting repetitive. Especially consdering no one is offering any ideas as to what EA "should" do about the situation. I personally think the static A.A. should have it's standard engagement range back, or the Jets should lose their ability to tell them the A.A. is manned. One or the other. Stationary A.A. is all almost completely worthless vs. Jets.

...and quit siting skill all the damn time. If ya' had any of the skill ya' "claimed" to have. You would be up there with the post 1.2 flyboys wreaking the same havoc as you were before. With a tad bit more caution, and a smidge more objective.

{WP}Paas