Does a better Graphics Card give you and advantage?

[Jofaba]

Re: Does a better Graphics Card give you and advantage?

I guess maybe I misread the question. I figured he meant he was playing on low settings, but without peformance problems. I still think skill comes in over eye candy and effects as long as the game has solid peformance. W.C. Fields played billiards with an insanely curved cue stick and still whipped the table every time. And I know some of you guys have girlfriends that don't mind your curved... joystick. I have no idea where this post just went.

[MollyWhopper]

Re: Does a better Graphics Card give you and advantage?

-Less chances of bullet laggg.
-They are enjoying the game while your just ****ed off about your ****ty graphics.

Thanks for all the discussion. WrAth2110 does have a point here. Say that your a sniper and the "other" guy is a sniper. You have 40fps and the other guy has 60fps. If you shoot at his head and he moves the slightest bit you will not notice and missed, but he can see you move the slightest bit and nail you. I guess some of it has to do with your connection speed but I think that fps wins out most of the time.

[evogre3n]

Re: Does a better Graphics Card give you and advantage?

Thanks for all the discussion. WrAth2110 does have a point here. Say that your a sniper and the "other" guy is a sniper. You have 40fps and the other guy has 60fps. If you shoot at his head and he moves the slightest bit you will not notice and missed, but he can see you move the slightest bit and nail you. I guess some of it has to do with your connection speed but I think that fps wins out most of the time.

the kind of difference would only be noticed between 60fps and under 12fps.. between 40 and 60.. that cant happen, since your eye only catches 12 individual frames per second anyway, so there is no way that would affect anything

[=DNC=BongSquad]

Re: Does a better Graphics Card give you and advantage?

ermm.. you are all slightly wrong..

if your frame rate was locked to 40fps and DID NOT dip lower than that.. someone with 60-70fps wouldnt have any advantage... you only need 12fps to see animation... but thats only with a movie where there if blur, in a game where there are jagged edges, anything over 30 (as long as it CONSTANTLY stays that way) will be fine.

the kind of difference would only be noticed between 60fps and under 12fps.. between 40 and 60.. that cant happen, since your eye only catches 12 individual frames per second anyway, so there is no way that would affect anything

dude how can you say that?! The eye/brain works in so many different ways to perceive different types of event. You are over-simplifying this by pulling one or two simple statistics and applying it to everything. The 'magic' 30 fps the movie industry decided on is not some theoretical limit of our perception...it was just good enough.

People who play games at high fps will be better 'trained' to perceive when the fps drops from 60 to 40. It IS noticible. Period. If you play vsynced at 70Hz most of the time and it drops for a few seconds to 50, you will also notice. Conversly, if you ususally play at 30fps, you won't be as likely to notice a difference when experienceing smoother frame rates.


Whoever brought up that example of the snipers shooting each other as a reason for better fps is wrong. A higher resolution will let you snipe better if a person shifts slightly to the side. The effective speed of travel of thier character on your screen is very slow...hence fps plays a relatively slow role there.

When fps really matters is those fast-paced close-action encounters. If a person circle strafes around and around me in close circles, they move VERY fast across my screen. Having a high fps makes it easier to track their motion and follow them with your mouse.

[dirtylarryuk]

Re: Does a better Graphics Card give you and advantage?

Just curious if the guys running lower end cards usually get owned or do I suck! I do usually(Well often) suck but you can check my stats. It seems like if I am in CQB with a guy he usually wins. Does fps give you an advantage because where you aim verses where the guy usually is? Could that have something to do with the in-accuracy to the sniper rifle? Just wondering what you guys and ladies think!

ok, started the BF demo on a laptop in 800x600 and everything in low and sucked in june. Everything and everyone owned me. GPU was a mobile 1.4 and mobile 5200 with 64 megs video ram and 512 meg memory, and it sucks it all set on low settings.

Then bought BF2 in august and was running an AMD 2 gig with 512 ram and and 5500 FX with 256. Still at 800x600, still mainly owned by everyone and everything. Was better but not much.

Then took advice and got a faster CPU and MB and 1 GIG ram, now did a bit better. The new RAM stopped BF2 making digital pate of my harddisk. New CPU was a 2.4 AMD and Motherboard was AGP x4. Then thought adding a 6800 GT would help. The slow CPU meant i could run at 1280 in mainly low settings, i had a audigy card in the PC and 5.1 speakers but compared to joint op's the audio in BF2 never impressed me much. It wasn't very positional, just loud.

Then hard work got me my score I did ok but some players could just own me. I could never win a firefight with someplayers even when my PING was better.

Fast forward to yesturday, got an AMD 64 4000, XFX 7800 GTX and 2 GIG coarsir dual RAM pack and a Creative Xfi card and Asus An8 Nforce 4 motherboard. Shoved into machine spent a while trying to figure out the new BIOS etc find the XP install disk.

Then a did the new XP install, stuck battlefield then patch 1.02, then 1.03, then installed SF then patch 1.12. Nothing else. Fought with the nvidia firewall for an hour.

Turned all settings to MAX, af X16 AA X4. Then hooked upto 32 inch HDTV monitor, whacked Audio to ULTRA!

Now get 90 fps. No lag no slowdown at all.

Fook me is this the same game? HOLY COW got shot a bit looking at things and going "ohhh and ahhh and prettyyyyy"

AND WOW, BF2 does look better than HL2 bar the HDR stuff.

And totally owned every game i was in. I was hitting people with single shot on the medic m16 about half a mile away. Jumping bullets. Basically turned into Neo from the Matrix. I could not miss people, good lord I started using the pistol and still was owning, everyone kept trying to vote me off!!!!!! It was sick, I fealt guilty after a while.

The xfi sound is also SUPERB and 1000x better than a live or audigy. I could here EXACTLY where people where. Above below and behind etc. You can't sneak up behind me no more.....

100x better than I thought possible. Save your pennies (I did) get the KIT. Not only do you become a BF2 god, it looks and sounds amazing.!!!!!!!!!!!

The cost of the kit was less than a grand. I also have a zboard and looking at my stats as soon as I got used to the zboard my kills went up.

After running on crap equipment for so long my advice is GET THE NEW KIT:

A AMD 64 CPU 3500 OR BETTER

7800 GT 256 meg or better (the XFX GTX 512 ROCKS, HL2 stress test 199 FPS everything on high!!!!), the 6800 GT or below sucks in comparrision and arn't that much cheaper.

2 GIG RAM, no less than 1 gig, 512 SUCKS for bf2.

Throw away an audigy/live acrd, disable onboard sound. Get an X-fi card. erm WOW WOW WOW.

MB wise, after messing with abit and MSI and others, get ASUS. The AN8 is idiot proof. The idiot proof Bios and overclock are very good.

GET a big monitor many LCD 28's start from only 500 quid, great for films even better for games. The very best 19@ monitors suck for sniping compared to a 28 - 32. And before pople say the MS is no good sorry I'm running about as fast as kit as there is and I have no issues and no wierd monitor ghosting LCD's have caught up folks.

The morale is you DO need a decent CPU and GFX card and soundcard and to honest don't mess about trying to upgrade old S***, just bite the bullet and get good stuff and don't mess around.

The new stuff including the LCD cost less than most Gym memberships for one year.

[Regent]

Re: Does a better Graphics Card give you and advantage?

Okay, let me straighten this out:
Running a game at 100 - even with a crt, though not as bad - will cause terrible tearing and stuttering. What's the use of running 100fps when your monitor can only draw 60 of them?

Not too sure why you think a CRT can't render 100 fps....... :laugh:

Mine can do 120 fps at 1024x768. Tearing or stuttering has nothing to do with CRT vs. LCD, but with the ability of the GPU to keep up with the chosen settings. CRTs can render games at much higher frame rates than LCDs, especially at lower resolutions.

[BoloMarkXXX]

Re: Does a better Graphics Card give you and advantage?

Close Quarter Battle, CQB the player with better graphics has a big advantage after my upgrade I went from loosing 9 out of 10 to winning 9 out of 10, I can run circles aroung players with low end graphics now.

I used to use low lighting to see into dark places, then with my new vid card I wanted my eye candy. Most of my games are to dark with the settings that make my desktop look good. I use color profiles in NVidia drivers to alter GAMA & briteness settings for games now I can see in dark places and my game looks amazing. I have 3 color profiles I add to game profiles for various games & default for my desktop.

[dirtylarryuk]

Re: Does a better Graphics Card give you and advantage?

Close Quarter Battle, CQB the player with better graphics has a big advantage after my upgrade I went from loosing 9 out of 10 to winning 9 out of 10, I can run circles aroung players with low end graphics now.

I used to use low lighting to see into dark places, then with my new vid card I wanted my eye candy. Most of my games are to dark with the settings that make my desktop look good. I use color profiles in NVidia drivers to alter GAMA & briteness settings for games now I can see in dark places and my game looks amazing. I have 3 color profiles I add to game profiles for various games & default for my desktop.

DYNAMIC light on med or high gives huge advantages on SF dark maps or nilla BF2 and dark indoor enviroments you can see the flashes from a firefight. If you have Xfi then you can also hear people walking about or talking. I am amzed at the advantage this gives. I thought lighting on high would be a disadvantage but with dynamic lights and shadows its not.

Yes people running on low light can see you where you think your hidden in shadow. But as I can now hear them and see there shadow coming round the corner poor fookers havn't a chance. I also can now kill with the shockpaddles which is a real surprise.

You can also see shadows under tanks apcs, now I can see the spec ops coming while i am in armour.

[Tenshi]

Re: Does a better Graphics Card give you and advantage?

Framerate is a bit abstract since we play over the internet.

I mean, you want 100fps...thats 1/100 seconds per frame. With a ping of 60ms..thats 6/100 of a second per refresh anyway. Doesnt matter how fast your computer is refreshing if it isnt getting network data very fast.

At 60ms, youre only getting 16-17 fps

**there are advantages and disadvantages. On low spec you dont see smoke since the particle count is severely capped.

[Regent]

Re: Does a better Graphics Card give you and advantage?

Framerate is a bit abstract since we play over the internet.

I mean, you want 100fps...thats 1/100 seconds per frame. With a ping of 60ms..thats 6/100 of a second per refresh anyway. Doesnt matter how fast your computer is refreshing if it isnt getting network data very fast.

At 60ms, youre only getting 16-17 fps

The only thing abstract there is your logic. It doesn't matter if your pinging 4 or 400 to the server, you're still getting game updates (packets) from the server at the very same rate as everyone else. Have you actually ever read anything about gaming servers and networks, or are you just making this up as you go along?:laugh:

[FURRY BIRD]

Re: Does a better Graphics Card give you and advantage?

I think you're connection and Memory are more important in this case.

[boabynixon]

Re: Does a better Graphics Card give you and advantage?

since the human eye CANT distinguish anything over 30 FPS, then anything over is just for show to say what a good sytem i have but these people who say thay notice a change in lag between 60fps and 40 fps are plain experiencing a bottleneck somewhere and theyre sytem is slowing down but in no way could they spot that change in fps if theyre system was still running smooth (most will hear theyre GPU go nuts for a sec while the stutter is occuring) as i said the human eye cant detect it since it is still being delivered at such a fast rate.


edit: they put the "magic fps to 30" for a reason, the reason being that the human eye cannot tell the difference for any number above that and anything below will appear choppy/stutter.

edit: this is why games like GTA:Vice city are limited to 30FPS, as anything above is not needed also some flight sims (BoB2 springs to mind)

[Regent]

Re: Does a better Graphics Card give you and advantage?

since the human eye CANT distinguish anything over 30 FPS, then anything over is just for show to say what a good sytem i have but these people who say thay notice a change in lag between 60fps and 40 fps are plain experiencing a bottleneck somewhere and theyre sytem is slowing down but in no way could they spot that change in fps if theyre system was still running smooth (most will hear theyre GPU go nuts for a sec while the stutter is occuring) as i said the human eye cant detect it since it is still being delivered at such a fast rate.


edit: they put the "magic fps to 30" for a reason, the reason being that the human eye cannot tell the difference for any number above that and anything below will appear choppy/stutter.

edit: this is why games like GTA:Vice city are limited to 30FPS, as anything above is not needed also some flight sims (BoB2 springs to mind)

Try to have a clue before posting your opinion as fact. Here's just a couple articles, of hundreds available on the net regarding this topic, and they all say you're wrong:

http://www.100fps.com/how_many_frame...humans_see.htm

"Tests with Air force pilots have shown, that they could identify the plane on a flashed picture that was flashed only for 1/220th of a second."

http://amo.net/NT/02-21-01FPS.html

"NVIDIA a computer video card maker who recently purchased 3dFx another computer video card maker just finished a GPU (Graphics Processing Unit) for the XBOX from Microsoft. Increasing amounts of rendering capabilities and memory as well as more transistors and instructions per second equate to more frames per second in a Computer Video Game or on Computer Displays in general. There is no motion blur, so the transition from frame to frame is not as smooth as in movies, that is at 30 FPS. In example, NVIDIA/3dfx put out a demo that runs half the screen at 30 fps, and the other half at 60 fps. The results? - there is a definite difference between the two scenes; 60 fps looking much better and smoother than the 30 fps."

[boabynixon]

Re: Does a better Graphics Card give you and advantage?

Try to have a clue before posting your opinion as fact. Here's just a couple articles, of hundreds available on the net regarding this topic, and they all say you're wrong:"

Do you have a clue or were you just posting others opinion as fact, why has it been industry standard for a century.

2. airforce pilots are highly trained professionals and any test cannot be related to general public whatsoever!.

3. i did not say anything about picture quality at 30fps or 60 fps which most of your links discuss, so please be more civil or dont waste my time.

[Tenshi]

Re: Does a better Graphics Card give you and advantage?

The only thing abstract there is your logic. It doesn't matter if your pinging 4 or 400 to the server, you're still getting game updates (packets) from the server at the very same rate as everyone else. Have you actually ever read anything about gaming servers and networks, or are you just making this up as you go along?:laugh:

whats your point? Im not really an expert...i just think that the framerate your card can kick out is only part of the deal.

The whole 60fps is all we can see is bollox, definately. Games have loads of temporal aliasing, they may be showing 60 frames...but what information each of those frames contain is limited.