Proof of bullet drop in the game

[GT4Fan]

Re: Proof of bullet drop in the game

Just aim somewhere above the head on further targets, no big deal right?

[IVfluids]

Re: Proof of bullet drop in the game

In an idealized world without air resistance (which BF2 is for what I know) the mass,density and shape of a falling object is irrelevant, all objects fall as defined by s=0.5 * G * t^2. As you can see only the gravitational constant G and the time t since release are variables here, the mass is irrelevant.

I know it will still fall at the same rate, but if you put the same amount of force behind a 1lb lead weight and the same amount of force behind a bullet, the bullet will travel further from you than the brick will. They should hit the ground at the same time, but distances will be different, that was the reason I was asking

Now I will get sooooo flamed, so I won't check back here, hopefully. "Bulletdrop" is random, and doesn't always exist, if existing at all.

DICE: "There's no bulletdrop in the game, the engine doesn't support it", until stated otherwise, I believe them (and my personal experience) more than you

They have this up on a website or interview somewhere? Not that I don't believe you, I'd just like to read it.

Kind of the reason I asked my questions the way I did about the mass thingy, I'd just like to know for sure so that when the rare occasion does come up that I am sniping, I can have an easier time of it by knowing the right answer.

[Grafisk]

Re: Proof of bullet drop in the game

They have this up on a website or interview somewhere? Not that I don't believe you, I'd just like to read it.

That's the problem... It's in some interview that came in BF2's younger days (juni or july, perhaps even august). That's why I have a hard time finding it :S

[SK]

Re: Proof of bullet drop in the game

I know it will still fall at the same rate, but if you put the same amount of force behind a 1lb lead weight and the same amount of force behind a bullet, the bullet will travel further from you than the brick will. They should hit the ground at the same time, but distances will be different, that was the reason I was asking

The velocity of rounds in BF2 isn´t defined by the force you exert on a bullet though, but directly. So in BF2 you basically say both your brick and your bullet have a velocity of 1000 (m/s), which makes asking for mass irrelevant

@Grafisk:
No matter what you think DICE said, bullet drop is real (ingame real, that is) and even you can test it easily with all the data I posted.

[Grafisk]

Re: Proof of bullet drop in the game

The velocity of rounds in BF2 isn´t defined by the force you exert on a bullet though, but directly. So in BF2 you basically say both your brick and your bullet have a velocity of 1000 (m/s), which makes asking for mass irrelevant

@Grafisk:
No matter what you think DICE said, bullet drop is real (ingame real, that is) and even you can test it easily with all the data I posted.

*sigh* Yes, and I can also test easily, and prove that there is no bulletdrop. I've encountered "bulletdrop" (patch 1.02), but I belive it's the poor accuracy. I don't compensate for bulletdrop these days because I still hit targets in the head when the accuracy allows me too.

[SK]

Re: Proof of bullet drop in the game

Nope, you can't prove that there is no bullet drop (cause there is, that´s become pretty clear by now) , you just can prove that there are times where it doesn´t matter much (like generally shooting at ranges below 200-300 meters).

Btw: A quote from a DICE interview of june, 14th 2005:

valued-tom asked: Is it true there is a trajectory decay on bullets, and is there a maximum range the bullets can travel from the sniper rifle?
[DICE]Sanosuke answers: Yes. Bullets do not just fly in a straight line in BF2.

[Cluster]

Re: Proof of bullet drop in the game

So how do you do these tests? Surely trying this ingame would have your cd key banned???

I wanna test tho..

[Tenshi]

Re: Proof of bullet drop in the game

In an idealized world without air resistance (which BF2 is for what I know) the mass,density and shape of a falling object is irrelevant, all objects fall as defined by s=0.5 * G * t^2. As you can see only the gravitational constant G and the time t since release are variables here, the mass is irrelevant.

Is the shape of a plane irrelavent?

[SK]

Re: Proof of bullet drop in the game

I used the demo single player, so my CD key was pretty safe. If you use the retail version of BF2 it´s best to make backup copies of objects_server.zip before messing around with it.
To get a M24 showing you pure bullet drop using tracer rounds use the following instructions:
-Make a copy of your <Battlefield2 directory>\mods\bf2\objects_server.zip file
-extract \weapons\handheld\usrif_m24\usrif_m24.tweak from the objects_server.zip
-copy and paste the text quoted below into the file. Best is to search for "damage 95" and replace all lines up to including " ObjectTemplate.damage 95".
-copy the modified usrif_m24.tweak back into the objects_server.zip.
-start BF2 in single player mode (or a local server) and watch the bullet drop.

GeometryTemplate.setMaterialReflectionScale 0 0 0 0.4
GeometryTemplate.setMaterialReflectionScale 0 0 1 2
GeometryTemplate.setMaterialReflectionScale 1 0 0 0.25
GeometryTemplate.setMaterialReflectionScale 1 0 1 2
GeometryTemplate.setMaterialReflectionScale 1 1 0 1
GeometryTemplate.setMaterialReflectionScale 1 1 1 0.25
GeometryTemplate.compressVertexData 1
GeometryTemplate.maxTextureRepeat 16
ObjectTemplate.activeSafe GenericFireArm usrif_m24
ObjectTemplate.creator TDA-1:tda
ObjectTemplate.modifiedByUser nfe
ObjectTemplate.saveInSeparateFile 1
rem ---BeginComp:WeaponHud ---
ObjectTemplate.createComponent WeaponHud
ObjectTemplate.weaponHud.weaponIcon Ingame\Weapons\Icons\Hud\USRIF_M24.tga
ObjectTemplate.weaponHud.altWeaponIcon Ingame\Weapons\Icons\Hud\USRIF_M24_mini.tga
ObjectTemplate.weaponHud.selectIcon Ingame\Weapons\Icons\Hud\Selection\USRIF_M24.tga
ObjectTemplate.weaponHud.hudName "KILLMESSAGE_WEAPON_m24"
ObjectTemplate.weaponHud.guiIndex 0
ObjectTemplate.weaponHud.altGuiIndex 52
rem ---EndComp ---
rem ---BeginComp:SingleFireComp ---
ObjectTemplate.createComponent SingleFireComp
ObjectTemplate.fire.addFireRate 0
ObjectTemplate.fire.fireInCameraDof 1
ObjectTemplate.fire.busyUntilButtonRelease 1
rem ---EndComp ---
rem ---BeginCompefaultAmmoComp ---
ObjectTemplate.createComponent DefaultAmmoComp
ObjectTemplate.ammo.magSize 5
ObjectTemplate.ammo.nrOfMags 7
ObjectTemplate.ammo.reloadTime 6
rem ---EndComp ---
rem ---BeginComp:SoldierBasedRecoilComp ---
ObjectTemplate.createComponent SoldierBasedRecoilComp
ObjectTemplate.recoil.hasRecoilForce 0
ObjectTemplate.recoil.recoilForceUp CRD_UNIFORM/5.2/4/0
ObjectTemplate.recoil.recoilForceLeftRight CRD_UNIFORM/-1/1/0
ObjectTemplate.recoil.zoomModifier 0.25
ObjectTemplate.recoil.recoilGraphFrameCount 14
ObjectTemplate.recoil.recoilGraphExponent 7
ObjectTemplate.recoil.recoilGraphTotalMovement 0.1
rem ---EndComp ---
rem ---BeginComp:HelpHud ---
ObjectTemplate.createComponent HelpHud
ObjectTemplate.HelpHud.helpStringKey "HUD_HELP_WEAPON_HANDHELD_SNIPERRIFLE_CONTROLS_swi tchToScopeView"
ObjectTemplate.HelpHud.helpSoundKey "USRIF_M24"
rem ---EndComp ---
rem ---BeginComp:SoldierDeviationComp ---
ObjectTemplate.createComponent SoldierDeviationComp
ObjectTemplate.deviation.setFireDev 0.0 0 0.0
ObjectTemplate.deviation.minDev 0
ObjectTemplate.deviation.setTurnDev 0 0 0 0
ObjectTemplate.deviation.setSpeedDev 0 0.0 0.0 0
ObjectTemplate.deviation.setMiscDev 0.0 0.0 0.0
ObjectTemplate.deviation.devModStand 0
ObjectTemplate.deviation.devModCrouch 0.0
ObjectTemplate.deviation.devModLie 0.0
ObjectTemplate.deviation.devModZoom 0.00
rem ---EndComp ---
rem ---BeginCompefaultSoundComp ---
ObjectTemplate.createComponent DefaultSoundComp
rem ---EndComp ---
rem ---BeginCompefaultAnimationComp ---
ObjectTemplate.createComponent DefaultAnimationComp
ObjectTemplate.animation.useShiftAnimation 1
ObjectTemplate.animation.shiftDelay 1.8
rem ---EndComp ---
rem ---BeginCompefaultZoomComp ---
ObjectTemplate.createComponent DefaultZoomComp
ObjectTemplate.zoom.zoomDelay 0.125
ObjectTemplate.zoom.zoomLod 1
ObjectTemplate.zoom.addZoomFactor 0
ObjectTemplate.zoom.addZoomFactor 0.01
ObjectTemplate.zoom.changeFovDelay 0.08
ObjectTemplate.zoom.zoomOutAfterFire 1
ObjectTemplate.zoom.disableMuzzleWhenZoomed 1
rem ---EndComp ---
ObjectTemplate.geometry usrif_m24
ObjectTemplate.setCollisionMesh usrif_m24
ObjectTemplate.mapMaterial 0 Collision_Material 68
ObjectTemplate.floaterMod 0
ObjectTemplate.hasMobilePhysics 0
ObjectTemplate.hasCollisionPhysics 1
ObjectTemplate.physicsType Mesh
ObjectTemplate.aiTemplate usrif_m24AI
rem -------------------------------------
ObjectTemplate.addTemplate S_usrif_m24_Fire1P
ObjectTemplate.setPosition 0/0.0251192/0.617667
ObjectTemplate.addTemplate S_usrif_m24_Fire1P_Outdoor
ObjectTemplate.setPosition 0/0.0259557/0.620327
ObjectTemplate.addTemplate S_usrif_m24_Fire3P
ObjectTemplate.setPosition 0/0.0248084/0.616961
ObjectTemplate.addTemplate S_usrif_m24_BoltClick
ObjectTemplate.setPosition 0/0.0228307/-0.165919
ObjectTemplate.addTemplate S_usrif_m24_TriggerClick
ObjectTemplate.setPosition 0/-0.0405023/-0.183669
ObjectTemplate.addTemplate S_usrif_m24_SwitchFireRate
ObjectTemplate.addTemplate S_usrif_m24_Reload1P
ObjectTemplate.addTemplate S_usrif_m24_Reload3P
ObjectTemplate.addTemplate S_usrif_m24_Deploy1P
ObjectTemplate.addTemplate S_usrif_m24_Deploy3P
ObjectTemplate.addTemplate S_usrif_m24_Zoom
ObjectTemplate.setPosition 0/0.0284011/-0.141757
ObjectTemplate.addTemplate e_muzz_sniper
ObjectTemplate.setPosition 0/0.0271032/0.612798
ObjectTemplate.addTemplate e_shellejection_rifle
ObjectTemplate.setPosition -0.00302492/0.0299253/-0.0828321
ObjectTemplate.setRotation -3.4436/3.75679/1.22417
rem -------------------------------------
ObjectTemplate.animationSystem1P Objects/Weapons/Handheld/USRIF_M24/AnimationSystem1p.inc
ObjectTemplate.animationSystem3P Objects/Weapons/Handheld/USRIF_M24/AnimationSystem3p.inc
ObjectTemplate.projectileTemplate usrif_m24_Projectile
ObjectTemplate.velocity 1000
ObjectTemplate.itemIndex 3
ObjectTemplate.delayToUse 1.6

ObjectTemplate.create GenericProjectile usrif_m24_Projectile
ObjectTemplate.modifiedByUser nfe
ObjectTemplate.createNotInGrid 1
ObjectTemplate.createdInEditor 1
rem ---BeginCompefaultCollisionComp ---
ObjectTemplate.createComponent DefaultCollisionComp
rem ---EndComp ---
rem ---BeginCompefaultDetonationComp ---
ObjectTemplate.createComponent DefaultDetonationComp
rem ---EndComp ---
rem ---BeginCompefaultProjSoundComp ---
ObjectTemplate.createComponent DefaultProjSoundComp
rem ---EndComp ---
rem ---BeginCompefaultRicochetComp ---
ObjectTemplate.createComponent DefaultRicochetComp
rem ---EndComp ---
rem ---BeginCompefaultPenetrateComp ---
ObjectTemplate.createComponent DefaultPenetrateComp
ObjectTemplate.penetrate.allowSolidPenetration 1
ObjectTemplate.penetrate.allowLiquidPenetration 1
rem ---EndComp ---
ObjectTemplate.floaterMod 0
ObjectTemplate.hasMobilePhysics 1
ObjectTemplate.hasCollisionPhysics 1
ObjectTemplate.physicsType Point
ObjectTemplate.collisionGroups 8
ObjectTemplate.material 38
rem -------------------------------------
ObjectTemplate.addTemplate S_usrif_m24_Projectile_Looping
rem -------------------------------------
ObjectTemplate.timeToLive CRD_NONE/1/0/0
ObjectTemplate.material 38
ObjectTemplate.tracerScaler 30
ObjectTemplate.maxTracerScaler 30
ObjectTemplate.minTracerScaler 1
ObjectTemplate.tracerSizeModifier 5
ObjectTemplate.tracerTemplate p_tracer_g
ObjectTemplate.tracerInterval 1
ObjectTemplate.hasOnTimeEffect 1
ObjectTemplate.minDamage 1
ObjectTemplate.damage 95

/edit: To get the text without smilies messing it up go to post #44 here:
http://www.forumplanet.com/planetbat...id=1762498&p=4

[SK]

Re: Proof of bullet drop in the game

Is the shape of a plane irrelavent?

In BF2? I´m pretty sure any real time aerodynamics modelling on the actual 3D models of BF2´s planes would be too computationally expensive. So my guess is that yes, the shape (e.g. the 3D model you see) of BF2´s planes is no factor in their flying characteristics.

[homegrown]

Re: Proof of bullet drop in the game

to the creator of this thread:

if you are so savvy with all this code,
why dont you simply show us the variable for bullet drop, and then the value for the sniper rifle and some other rifles to compare?

Now that would prove something solid. I don't know the code so i'm still doubtfull of what you say. how is it you know all these variables but cannot show the bulletdrop modifier?

Plz do so

Moreover: if you only modify the speed variable , you will NOT have disabled random deviation.

Please make more accurate post. Althought it was a fine post, it needs perfecting.

[Tk-421]

Re: Proof of bullet drop in the game

*sigh*

(dead horse)

There is no such thing as "bullet drop". There is, however something called GRAVITY. ANY OBJECT in BF2 that has physics enabled, will be affected by gravity.

Here's your variables.

ObjectTemplate.hasMobilePhysics 1
ObjectTemplate.hasCollisionPhysics 1
ObjectTemplate.physicsType Point

[Tk-421]

Re: Proof of bullet drop in the game

*sigh*

(dead horse)

There is no such thing as "bullet drop". There is, however something called GRAVITY. ANY OBJECT in BF2 that has physics enabled, will be affected by gravity.

Here's your variables.

ObjectTemplate.hasMobilePhysics 1
ObjectTemplate.hasCollisionPhysics 1
ObjectTemplate.physicsType Point

--EDIT--

Oh yeah, there's also a deviation of X that increases your bullet's "cone" of possible directions EVERY time you fire.

[Grafisk]

Re: Proof of bullet drop in the game

Nope, you can't prove that there is no bullet drop (cause there is, that´s become pretty clear by now) , you just can prove that there are times where it doesn´t matter much (like generally shooting at ranges below 200-300 meters).

Btw: A quote from a DICE interview of june, 14th 2005:

It hasn't become very clear, if you didn't know, alot of people still don't believe in bulletdrop. Just 'cause some "bulletdrop lines" (or whatever) is implemented in the code it doesn't mean it's there in the real thing, right? I mean, the M82A1 isn't a part of BF2, yet, it's there.

I think that statement is older than the one I saw, so I'll be waiting for another, certain, statement (anyone knows if DICE is going to have a question-hour on IRC soon?). Until then, I hit targets at 300 m without adjusting my sight (with the M24 that is :P the others accuracy sucks so bad).

[SK]

Re: Proof of bullet drop in the game

to the creator of this thread:

if you are so savvy with all this code,
why dont you simply show us the variable for bullet drop, and then the value for the sniper rifle and some other rifles to compare?

There is no variable for bullet drop, the bullets are objects spawned in the world with a certain direction and velocity. They get affected by gravity like everything else, this is the reason why you don´t have "the bullet drop variable".
All objects are subject to the same gravity (probably 10m/s^2), so bullet drop for all guns is the same (depending on their velocity setting, 1000 m/s for all guns except support guns who have 500 m/s).

What I changed compared to the normal sniper rifle file is:
ObjectTemplate.recoil.hasRecoilForce 0
No recoil forces.

ObjectTemplate.deviation.setFireDev 0.0 0 0.0
ObjectTemplate.deviation.minDev 0
ObjectTemplate.deviation.setTurnDev 0 0 0 0
ObjectTemplate.deviation.setSpeedDev 0 0.0 0.0 0
ObjectTemplate.deviation.setMiscDev 0.0 0.0 0.0
ObjectTemplate.deviation.devModStand 0
ObjectTemplate.deviation.devModCrouch 0.0
ObjectTemplate.deviation.devModLie 0.0
ObjectTemplate.deviation.devModZoom 0.00
No deviation whatsoever, the random factor is eliminated.

ObjectTemplate.zoom.addZoomFactor 0.01
Much better Zoom to better be able to observe the shot.

ObjectTemplate.tracerScaler 30
ObjectTemplate.maxTracerScaler 30
ObjectTemplate.minTracerScaler 1
ObjectTemplate.tracerSizeModifier 5
ObjectTemplate.tracerTemplate p_tracer_g
ObjectTemplate.tracerInterval 1
Added tracer, so the round itself can be observed.

In conclusion you have a sniper rifle with no random modifiers, just the clean flight path of the round, arcing due to gravity. As presented before it drops about 60 ingame cm over 350 ingame meters.