shotgun range poll.

[iQue]

The auto shotty is just fine since it has a high ROF. The pump shotty doesn't have that, just a little extra damage. A slightly longer range is perfect imo.

[sogek1ng]

A slightly longer range is perfect imo.

That could be one of the only things they could do to help it.

[A4D|Mofoka]

Shotgun damage is not inconsistent, that is why they are called "scatter guns" and buck shot is no where near the equivalence of a 9mm bullet, it's a pellet that is not made of the same concentration of metal as a normal bullet is.

If anything, slugs should be introduced but honestly I have as with everyone else seen people run away after being shot with the 50 cal which you and I both know would remove a limb in real life but this is a game and the statistics you're looking for it absurd mainly because true at 6 feet the blast is very concentrated but my Mossberg 500 shooting shells of 3 1/2 has a spread pattern of 10 feet at 30 yards. But 6 feet should make it one hit weapon but if it did then matches would suck.

[=)BiT(= Evant3k]

Well shotguns are meant to be for CQB I don't see the point of them being sniper rifles (altho no scope sniper rifles work better then shotguns). I was never a supporter of changing gameplay so no the shotgun is great as it is now, I have the gold M1014 so I know how to use them.

[TheDesert_Fox]

Anyone who thinks shotties are fine has obviously never used one. I had the chance to a few weeks ago (freakin fun btw) and they will certainly hit things farther than this game says.

You can know how to use them, you can get massive killing sprees with them, whatever you say about how good you are wont cover up the fact that they aren't even near realistic anymore. Even if you think it's balanced, they need changed. It's like saying sniper rifles can't be fired in less than 10 foot range since that's not what they're meant for.

[Roger Smith]

amen.

[Chris_Redfield]

they aren't even near realistic anymore.

Jesus H. Christ

IQ level of this thread is dropping like Romeo 007.

[Roger Smith]

speaking against realism in a game like halo or team fortress 2 makes a lot of sense. speaking against the notion of realism in a game like cod4 hardcore is like holding up a large idiot sign. like it or not, realism is a real term and it has its place. realism is a term to describe a game, that is trying to emulate real life through a simulation. in a game where one bullet can kill more often then not, and bullets go through walls like a knife to butter, i honestly do not think that the notion of realism is so far fetched. when people say realistic, they are not trying to say that game = real life. they are trying to say game = simulation of real life. arguing against the notion of realism just seems a bit elitist and naive to me.

[Chris_Redfield]

Then how come I dont see you playing Project Reality, ArmA, SWAT4, Insurgency, Americas Army?

Considering that every last bit in COD4 normal gamemode has its place because of gameplay balance, this is the only thing that matters. I wouldnt have a problem when people complained about realism aspects, or lacks or inaccuracies in games which are clearly based on real life, in not only the appearance, but in their gameplay aspect aswell, but b!tching about lack of realism in COD4, which cleary is an arcade game, is pushing it.

Consider this. Every time someone moans about realistic inaccuracies in BF2 jet aspect, people snicker. Same here. Every time someone says "dose gunz arnt real, dey suk!", I cant help but shake my head.

If the game was "realistic", pretty much every weapon would kill you on sight, and shotguns would represent the UT rail cannons because of a tight grouping at almost all COD4 engagement ranges.

People who moan about weapons being weak (and alternatively, not real enough), have never faced someone who could potentially show them how bad the weapon can get with extra tweaking.

If you still want to prove a point, go have a game in Vacant against that dude who posted his video against going 6 clanners.

And no, COD4 is not a simulation of real life.

The amusing thing is, every time a "realism" buff comes along, he doesnt even play this game more than a few hours a week, and every last one of his idea comes from his own painted picture of how the game should be played in his opinion. And if those changes get implemented, and he gets "owned", the cries for nerfing start.

BF2 changes for a more "realistic" gameplay have undoubtedly resulted in one of the worst infantry games ever conceived.

Realistic games or semi-realistic games have their own niche and are unpopular for a reason. A UT player would trash a server with a "realistic shotgun" in a matter of minutes. You think its bad that a shotty is a niche gun for talented players? Watch what happens if everyone can use it just as good as an SMG/AR. Gameplay balance flies out of the window.

Im not an elitist, but I support A) the tremendous work IW has put into balancing all the weapons and B) as little changes as possible, based on the passionate, yet baseless posts of a few players.

If you want to prove that your changes will not break a game, mod the shotties, get a few buds and frag around. See what happens.

Best balance types and gameplay changes are ones made by people who check through all possible outcome. IW isnt DICE, and you can bet your behind that the reasons behind shotguns performing the way they perform today, is a solid one. If you have a history of Quake 3 or at least some UT, youd know how bad a 1 shot kill railgun would be in a game like COD4.

Dont be an idiot. You want the game to be as fun as it possibly can be for everyone. Examples of talented people trashing servers have been shown, and youre still complaining about game not catering to your incompetence.

[Roger Smith]

Then how come I dont see you playing Project Reality, ArmA, SWAT4, Insurgency, Americas Army?

because i am not playing those games this very second? I've played um, and i loved bits and peaces of all those games. sept swat4, haven't played that.

b!tching about lack of realism in COD4, which cleary is an arcade game, is pushing it.

cs is an arcade styled game, so is ut. this game in softcore could even be considered arcade as well. but as i have pointed out many times in this thread, i was speaking to this game in hardcore, which IS REALISTIC, and if you cant see that, you are blind.

If the game was "realistic", pretty much every weapon would kill you on sight, and shotguns would represent the UT rail cannons because of a tight grouping at almost all COD4 engagement ranges.

well pretty much all guns do kill on sight in hardcore, and yes shotguns would have the range, but absolutely no stopping power at that range. all getting shot from a shotgun a mile away will do is piss you off, at least using bird shot.

The amusing thing is, every time a "realism" buff comes along, he doesnt even play this game more than a few hours a week, and every last one of his idea comes from his own painted picture of how the game should be played in his opinion. And if those changes get implemented, and he gets "owned", the cries for nerfing start.

ya, i am sure you know all that for a fact and its not what you would like to believe. i played the **** out of that game, i am pro realism, and i am pro game-play as-well.

BF2 changes for a more "realistic" gameplay have undoubtedly resulted in one of the worst infantry games ever conceived.

um, no. thats not how it went down. you are replacing everything you don't like that got changed with the word realism. the developers were never trying to do anything for the sake of realism. infantry combat fails in that game because of the engine, and the core grenade/revive combat style.

Realistic games or semi-realistic games have their own niche and are unpopular for a reason. A UT player would trash a server with a "realistic shotgun" in a matter of minutes. You think its bad that a shotty is a niche gun for talented players? Watch what happens if everyone can use it just as good as an SMG/AR. Gameplay balance flies out of the window.

first off, no ut player would get anywhere in hardcore, until they stopped playing like it was ut. secondly, i was never asking for the shotgun to perform as at the ranges of smgs and assault rifles. i was asking for it to perform properly in the cqc environment. but you didn't pay that any attention did you. in fact, you haven't even argued once against what i was suggesting. you keep arguing against shotgun rail-guns but i never said thats what i wanted things to be like. oh and about bf2. my suggestions for that game were never simply for the sake of realism, neither is this.

Im not an elitist, but I support A) the tremendous work IW has put into balancing all the weapons and B) as little changes as possible, based on the passionate, yet baseless posts of a few players.

so why didn't you just say that in the first place rather than getting everything twisted. fact is, you just don't think games should get changed because dice ****ed you over so hard. (like bf2 was all that better before it got patched)

actually i am quite good with the shotgun in this game, given the right scenario. my gripe is that you have a very small window of opportunity to make your shot, when all the other guns have no range deficiencies at all. just because a weapon can be used well in a game, does not mean it is balanced.

so since you never actually have responded to my actual suggestion, let me spell it out for you again.

i am suggesting that shotgun buck not disappear, but have a massive damage/spread drop-off just a little bit farther than it does now, in hardcore.

i am not suggesting shotgun rail-guns.

i am not suggesting that this game is realistic in soft-core.

i am not suggesting this idea for the notion of realism.

i am not suggesting that the shotgun is useless as it is now.

i am not suggesting that infinity ward is a bunch of idiots that don't know what they are doing.

they do know what they are doing, and they did a heck of a job. but i do think when something could be better, it should be. you seem opposed to such a notion.

and yes like it or not, this game IS realistic in hardcore, no less then one of those other games you mentioned.

[Chris_Redfield]

because i am not playing those games this very second? I've played um, and i loved bits and peaces of all those games. sept swat4, haven't played that.

Then go and play those games, instead of trying to make COD4 into a realistic shooter that catered your slow behind even more.

this game in softcore could even be considered arcade as well. but as i have pointed out many times in this thread, i was speaking to this game in hardcore, which IS REALISTIC

No its not. Could you please point me out, except for bullet damage (which Im sure does not respond to terminal ballistics), which parts of COD4 are realistic?

, and if you cant see that, you are blind.

Sorry for not being mentally retarded enough to consider "high damage" to be the only criteria to make a game a "realistic shooter".

well pretty much all guns do kill on sight in hardcore, and yes shotguns would have the range, but absolutely no stopping power at that range. all getting shot from a shotgun a mile away will do is piss you off, at least using bird shot.

If youve been hunting, you can kill a deer, using buckshot, from 50 metres away. One shot kill. Almost all engagements in COD4 are held at about 30 metres. Some more, some less, but thats about the medium. You obviously want a one shot kill rail cannon.

um, no. thats not how it went down. you are replacing everything you don't like that got changed with the word realism. the developers were never trying to do anything for the sake of realism. infantry combat fails in that game because of the engine, and the core grenade/revive combat style.

Considering that things like dolphin diving and shooting while airbourne got patched, after numerous complaints in many forums, with the key words "not realistic", Id say youre wrong.

first off, no ut player would get anywhere in hardcore

They would get further than you. UT players virtue isnt movement and jumping. UT players virtue is exceptionally fast thinking, both defensive and offensive. Which in turn is backed up by superb aiming. A UT player would rape in COD4 after a just a few minutes of time. It would take days for a COD4 HC player to start raping in UT.

secondly, i was never asking for the shotgun to perform as at the ranges of smgs and assault rifles.

By comparing shotties to RL and "demanding" their perfomance to be increased while moaning about them not being up to par to their real life counterparts, you are, in fact, asking shotties to perform at the ranges of SMGs.

i was asking for it to perform properly in the cqc environment.

LOL. See above.

As for CQC, close quarters combat. A distance of a couple of metres. And imagine that, shotguns in COD4 do great in CQC.

in fact, you haven't even argued once against what i was suggesting.

Response nr 34.

you keep arguing against shotgun rail-guns but i never said thats what i wanted things to be like.

Sorry. Just because you cant see past the changes you want to be implemented, doesnt mean we share the same disability. Every change there is, should be calculated through. How its going to be potentially abused.

my suggestions for that game were never simply for the sake of realism, neither is this.

If it wouldnt be for realism, then surely you can adapt and actually use shotties, no? Surely you can understand shotguns position in the food chain. No?

fact is, you just don't think games should get changed because dice ****ed you over so hard. (like bf2 was all that better before it got patched)

Actually, as a matter of fact, BF2 was way better before the patching frenzy began. Not only is there a considerable FPS loss through 1.0-1.41, the gameplay speed and key input freedom got significantly limited. BF2 feels clunky and slow, as opposed to free and dynamic that it was before. But thats not the point. The point is that these changes were in place to stop people from abusing the games specific aspects. Almost nothing can be abused in COD4 today, except for the mounted LGMs. Increasing shotguns potential could, potentially, open up possibilities for abusing them.

actually i am quite good with the shotgun in this game, given the right scenario. my gripe is that you have a very small window of opportunity to make your shot, when all the other guns have no range deficiencies at all. just because a weapon can be used well in a game, does not mean it is balanced.

How many months would it take you to grasp the simple truth that this is exactly the point why shotguns are what they are today? Basically an opposing side of the spectrum from sniper rifles. Both weapons need some serious skill to be used effectively.

so since you never actually have responded to my actual suggestion, let me spell it out for you again.

Response nr 34.

i am suggesting that shotgun buck not disappear, but have a massive damage/spread drop-off just a little bit farther than it does now, in hardcore.

Response nr 34.

they do know what they are doing, and they did a heck of a job. but i do think when something could be better, it should be. you seem opposed to such a notion.

I dont think you know what better is. Otherwise you would have gone out of your way and started with detailed stats and finishing up with a proposal that deals in detail and in-game figures, what and how things need to be changed. When I made several posts proposing the idea of changing flare and missile dynamics, complete with figures and stats, I went out and tested it all out. A lot of the changes that I prposed, I recognise in POE2. (single shot flares, missile arm time post launch)

and yes like it or not, this game IS realistic in hardcore, no less then one of those other games you mentioned.

LOL. What a joke. Youre basically saying that the only thing separating SC from being a realistic game, is 66% health reduction? Give me a break. I would gladly ask for specific examples on what actually makes COD4 "realistic". So that I could debunk each and every one of them.

Dont be an elitist fool.

[TheDesert_Fox]

Jesus H. Christ

IQ level of this thread is dropping like Romeo 007.

Only once you got here.

You can't give a good reason why they should be so gimped so you resort to insults... gg.

[imported_Whiskey]

Do yourselves a favour...

Today, 05:07 PM
Chris_Redfield______________________Remove user from ignore list
This message is hidden because Chris_Redfield is on your ignore list.

Your stress levels will drop immensely.

[TheDesert_Fox]

Do yourselves a favour...

Your stress levels will drop immensely.

Awwww snap... now everyone either shares my opinion or doesn't exist at all!

[Chris_Redfield]

Only once you got here.

You can't give a good reason why they should be so gimped so you resort to insults... gg.

Actually I have given reasons why they should stay the way they are throughout this whole thread. But indeed, GG.

Do yourselves a favour...

Your stress levels will drop immensely.

The inability to support your argument and opinion leads to this.