shotgun range poll.

[Sloi sauce]

The shotguns are as crap as i though they were. There are plenty of weapons that offer other advantages, except the one very small market that the shotgun can work in.

Even something like Vacant. This is a seriously well designed CQB map. i absolutely love it. But firing from one side of a ROOM to the other, with the shotguns, can = no kill. Even with the target dead in your sights. This is garbage.

You're better off using your pistol.

Pretty much.

You can't hit a perfectly centered, immobile target from 10 meters! People defend that!?

Bahahahahahahahaha! GTFO here.

[Keyelite]

define 10 meters, do you have a screen shot and or video of this?

[Roger Smith]

i am making one tonight.

[Sloi sauce]

My numbers are estimates... but yes, it's definitely in the 10-15 meter range. Even if we assumed it reached 20 meters, it would still be completely inexcusable.

[Chris_Redfield]

Sloi, imagine this for a second.

Your wish gets granted, we get shotguns with lethal range of 50 metres. You join a random server, own some newbies, seem happy with a 5:1 KDR. Then, along comes Polly, a UT player, and completely devastates you, making your KDR 1:5. Hilarity ensures when you start posting posts about shotguns being overpowered.www

Its perfect right now, the philosophy, that is. You need to work hard, you need to have a high skillset, and you can only use it in limited circumstances. But when youve met all criterias, youre unstoppable. No, you dont need shotguns to become universal weapons.

[Roger Smith]

click the image to see a higher quality version

[Salad Snake]

Although it's pretty fine the way it is, I can always use shotguns in other games.

Which is pretty much admitting it's uselessness in this game.

The shotgun isn't. It's been screwed so badly into one small nieche that there is no point in taking it.

There actually isn't a role the shotgun does that another gun can't do, and do better.

This is pretty much my opinion of the shotgun. The auto might be different, but the pump's useless.

- They are not just point blank weapons

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=04ojLAxpH08&feature=related[/media]

Good lord those enemies have poor aim. On any regular pub that guy would be dead after the first, maybe second shottie round.

The worse one was after he killed that guy on the railing, then somehow managed to strafe out of fire the distance of the whole alley to that crate.

At that distance (>20meters), you should be able to lock on to a sprinting target (even running perpendicular to you) with your line of fire in under 2 seconds (I'd say normally I'd see about 1.3-.4 seconds before someone sprinting perpendicular would start getting hit). This is with ironsights btw, I imagine hip-firing would take a bit longer.

For this reason, it's very hard to get into shottie range. Even indoors sometimes it won't go the full length of the room. Sure you can zip in and out of walls or something, but if he's got deep impact, you're still screwed.

I would definitely like greater range for the shottie, at least the pump. I mean, I'd rather take a sniper rifle with me as a main weapon then a shottie. And definitely an SMG.

[iQue]

This is pretty much my opinion of the shotgun. The auto might be different, but the pump's useless.

Far from useless, but not on all maps. And as this whole thread is about, the range is ridiculous.

The semi-auto shotgun range is actually pretty fine to me since you can just spam four shots. It's pretty weird that IW rewards spamming shots with the semi-auto shotgun when the pump (that requires precise aiming more) has the same crappy range and just a little extra damage.

CoD4 must have the most nerfed shotguns of the most games ever made.

Good lord those enemies have poor aim. On any regular pub that guy would be dead after the first, maybe second shottie round.

I remember seeing that video on youtube right after the game was released

[Chris_Redfield]

I remember seeing that video on youtube right after the game was released

Psst, dont tell him that. He may think that its the best shotgunner and base his opinion on that.

Roger, that range is about the maximum lethal range, at about that range, I get a 1 shot kill.

[Sloi sauce]

click the image to see a higher quality version

That's f*cking ridiculous. Yes, very balanced!

Chris, I already made it clear that I want an increased range with the necessary adjustment for damage. They wouldn't be any more lethal than they already are: this way, however, my shots would actually connect, as opposed to disappearing.

[Keyelite]

click the image to see a higher quality version

What was your kit?

Also, try not zooming in. The point of a shotgun in real life is so you DON'T have to bring it to eye level all the time. Same concept applies in COD4

If you do not zoom in, you see the crosshair. If it turns red, it is an instant kill or near instant kill.

[Roger Smith]

Roger, that range is about the maximum lethal range, at about that range, I get a 1 shot kill.

and just one step back from that range, and you get no kill, and no damage is delivered.

What was your kit?

it was the first shotgun, unmodded, which is the entire point i am trying to make here.

Also, try not zooming in. The point of a shotgun in real life is so you DON'T have to bring it to eye level all the time. Same concept applies in COD4

what does that have to do with anything, the buck still disappears at that range with or without your iron sites.

If you do not zoom in, you see the crosshair. If it turns red, it is an instant kill or near instant kill.

this is hardcore my friend, no crosshair.

[Keyelite]

Why are we trying to use shotguns in hardcore again?

We can't just focus on one aspect of the game (e.g. hardcore) and consider things broken because of which. If you tweak all the weapons to hardcore, when people play soft core it will be unbalanced.

Bringing the weapon to eye level confuses you at which distance you are at. Also, i was assuming it was softcore, where shotguns are the best for.

Also I mean what perks did you have with that kit?

I understand that the shotgun bullets disappear after a certain range. But don't you think the developers have a reason to implement a system like this rather than having a damage system like you describe?

[Roger Smith]

Why are we trying to use shotguns in hardcore again?

every weapon should have a purpose in any game mode.

If you tweak all the weapons to hardcore, when people play soft core it will be unbalanced.

i am not talking about changing the game in any way for softcore. the original post said, this thread applies to hardcore.

Also, i was assuming it was softcore, where shotguns are the best for.

weapons should have a definite purpose in any game mode.

Also I mean what perks did you have with that kit?

no perks that i could have had, would effect buck magically disappearing.

But don't you think the developers have a reason to implement a system like this rather than having a damage system like you describe?

they may have a reason, i am just wondering if they could possibly be wrong on something. imagine that, a game developer not getting everything right.

[imported_Whiskey]

I'm not a "gun guru", but I respect the opinion of those who know their weapons and characteristics inside-out. I can understand how they'd be upset when things don't match up with their real-world equivalent.

Even though the word probably gets thrown around too much, "balance" is most likely the reason for the way shotties are set up in COD4. Again, the shotties (trench gun) was a HUGE complaint in COD2, due to the similar small-ish map sizes, and the power/range the weapons had. For the purposes of a multi-player game, I think they probably had to be nerfed a fair bit.

IW isn't perfect by any means, but I do think they put a lot of time and thought to weapon balance. Even so, there was the early COD4 example of the sniper rifles...they weren't "broken" per se, as lots of users figured out how to use them, but they operated differently than in the past and there were enough complaints that IW changed them. I think the COD2 shottie complaints were probably a big reason for the current COD4 shotgun settings.