Thanks for killing an unique part of the game!

[Shepherd007]

Re: Thanks for killing an unique part of the game!

No body will know except the bots, I doubt they will care though.

Shhh, don't tell the bots! We don't want them to post too!:laugh:

We basically have three versions of BF2:
1) The one you want
2) The one I want
3) The one DICE wants

Guess which one we get to play.:)

The only thing that puzzles me is why shouldn't the GL have the same damage characteristics as the grenade?

[imported_BlueScreen]

Re: Thanks for killing an unique part of the game!

Something I forgot to mention...

If you consider pronespamming/dolphin diving to be "ok", what about building glitches? How about hacks/cheats? I mean, you can do them all, so why not?

It's subjective. Where do you draw the line between "gameplay" and "exploit"? [...]

Come on, that's not that hard! I.e.:

1. Squad hopping isn't an exploit because it is done by using the menu and every other player in the game can do it too while no one is forced to do it.
2. Pronespamming & Dolphine diving is getting nearer to an 'exploit' although i can live with it so i don't care much
3. Building glitching is an exploit because the houses have no open door or windows so it's clear one shouldn't get in them
4. Cheats & Hacks are exploits because you use either 'secret' stuff or a 3rd party tool

Although i find it pretty clear i'm aware that this depends on ones personal point of view and the border isn't this accurately defined. IMHO an exploit / cheat is either using 'secret' or 3rd party stuff.

That's exactly why i say that all this stuff should be some server side setting so one could play with likeminded guys on a server one likes => this whole discussion would be obsolete.

[t_c]

Re: Thanks for killing an unique part of the game!

That impression exists for a reason...and there is something stopping a player from putting a 203 up their ass.

It's called getting killed because some lame ass player just exploited an animation that you can't target. There is no 'skill' (like the OP mentioned) in this tactic.

I have an idea, lets remove the crouch and prone key altogether! something the Americas Army dev team havnt thought of yet.

[DarkShot]

Re: Thanks for killing an unique part of the game!

as a professional gamer i know alot of gamers and alot of bf2 gamers in particular, and i have never heard of a case of anyone at least admitting to using macro's. in fact i wouldnt be suprised if that is just a myth used by noobs cause they cannot pronejump or they get pwned by it too often. my bet is, if anyone is macroing it is the noobs lol.

and i support the author of this thread btw. it was the damn noobs who ruined the game. with each patch all they did was make things easier for the noobs so they dont get pwned, all cosmetic/gameplay changes and not one major bug was ever fixed. so dont u think in all that time dice listened to teh whining community of noobs they couldve actually better spent that time putting together fixes for actual bugs.
yes i admit i dolphin dive alot. i pronejump regularly, i used to throw c4 like my life depended on it and tell me who hasnt spawn camped with armour on karkand? and you know what? i wouldnt mind if all of it was taken out of the game in the end so long as they gave us a bug free, crash free game in return. until that day comes, i will continue to pronejump across the battlefield, all the way over to your corpse, and teabag you noobs for ruining this game.


i miss blackwhoring days. oh noes! tehy are pwning us with a blackhawk whatever should we do???? how hard was it to ram a blackhawk ya noobs? oh no that would be too hardm instead you noobs complained to dice and they destroyed it. i hate noobs so much die.

[WarGimp]

Re: Thanks for killing an unique part of the game!

The only thing that puzzles me is why shouldn't the GL have the same damage characteristics as the grenade?

'Cause it's a smaller warhead and ment to be armour penetrating rather than fragmentation/Anti-personal?

I'd still like to see a more robust damage model for the GL. A high damage "kill zone" and a larger fragmentation area. I'll confess, I use to whore it up with the old GL on occasion. I felt a little cheesy doing it (let's face it, it was too damned easy to make kills with it). The newer version tho... it really is a bit on the worthless side.

Come on, that's not that hard!

It's called a rhetorical question.
:p

BTW, the term "Exploit" means not intended by the developers and gives a clear advantage or changes the way the game is played. Thus, squad hopping (not intended by Dice) was an exploit.

It was a useful exploit and since everyone could do it, it wasn't a cheat, but I personally agree with Dice's call to deep six it.

[Skwurl]

Re: Thanks for killing an unique part of the game!

as a professional gamer i know alot of gamers and alot of bf2 gamers in particular, and i have never heard of a case of anyone at least admitting to using macro's. in fact i wouldnt be suprised if that is just a myth used by noobs cause they cannot pronejump or they get pwned by it too often. my bet is, if anyone is macroing it is the noobs lol.

http://www.autohotkey.com/forum/topi...ighlight=prone
http://www.autohotkey.com/forum/topi...ighlight=prone
http://www.autohotkey.com/forum/topi...ighlight=prone

[t_c]

Re: Thanks for killing an unique part of the game!

http://www.autohotkey.com/forum/topi...ighlight=prone
http://www.autohotkey.com/forum/topi...ighlight=prone
http://www.autohotkey.com/forum/topi...ighlight=prone

noobs too stupid to realise to assign crouch and prone next to each other ?

While we have our disagreements on this issue, I do disagree with people trying to use programs/macros. Quite frankly I think punkbuster should pick up these programs or scripts on their cvar checks.

Before you state that im a hypocrite, let me say if you cant do it by hand... then tough ****, learn to deal with it or find ways to adapt (without the use of external programs).

[$kelet0r]

Re: Thanks for killing an unique part of the game!

Thanks.
:)

While I partly agree as a gamer, I've also done the design thing. It's not easy. I've come up with great ideas to help gameplay along and taken a hella lot of heat for it.

An example: I was working on a Persistant world mod for NeverWitner Nights and I desided that the resting system needed changing to make things more challenging (the game shipped with a built in ability to rest at any time and thus removed a LOT of challenge). I made some tweaks to limit how, where, and how often you could rest. My player base went NUTS! The amount of "This sucks! You wrecked the game!" type posts I took was rather dissapointing. A month later, people were loving it. To this day, that rest remians one of the core elements that keeps players playing.

The moral of the story; Even the best changes will generate hate, but that still doesn't mean it's a bad thing for the game.

I still wanna see old 'Hawk guns brought back 'n an auto GL mounted on the Skycow, tho.

The difference is that a month later, the same changes have been hated by the community here
If this not a reflection on a bad decision making process I don't know what is.
You idea made sense and worked. DICE's to date have not and do not.
You and I both know and agree on I'd say 90% of the things that should be in the game. Those ideas make sense to you and me and probably the majority. DICE do not see things the same way. Why else is there so much discontent about this game?
Their vision is not a centralised one and DOES NOT reflect what the customer wants.

[BioDiaperX]

Re: Thanks for killing an unique part of the game!

I agree 100% with the topic starter. This game was fine when it was left unpatched, but some whiney f**ktards had to speak up about "WAAAA he owned me with the grenade launcher!" "WAAAA the guns are too accurate!" "WAAAAA Balckhawks are to powerful!" Well guess what. You're wrong. The game is fine, the people complaining just can't take it. So along comes DICE and EA and takes all these complaints into consideration without even bothering to look at the effects. Make the grenade launcher less effective, good job, you just nerfed a great way to take down vehicles. Make guns less accurate, hooray for you you eliminated sniping with weapons other than the sniper rifle, kills that took skill to get. Nerf the Blachkawk guns, great now we're flying in a crate that has next to 0 tactical value. This game just caters to those who can't adapt, to those who just have no skill now. Now you add all these crashes and other crap like vehicle drops, oh well thats great but you know, in addition to nerfing every good feature in this game, you've succeeded in ruining it outright. I used to have a ton of fun playing, now I get so frustrated with all these unwanted changes that playing it just sucks for me. If 2142 is anything like this, don't count oon me buying it.

[t_c]

Re: Thanks for killing an unique part of the game!

Sig Test!

[BioDiaperX]

Re: Thanks for killing an unique part of the game!

I like it.:laugh:

[Skwurl]

Re: Thanks for killing an unique part of the game!

noobs too stupid to realise to assign crouch and prone next to each other ?

While we have our disagreements on this issue, I do disagree with people trying to use programs/macros. Quite frankly I think punkbuster should pick up these programs or scripts on their cvar checks.

Before you state that im a hypocrite, let me say if you cant do it by hand... then tough ****, learn to deal with it or find ways to adapt (without the use of external programs).

The point however is that people DO use macros to exploit the dolphin dolving. Whether people believe that or not is up to them, but I just provided 3 quick links that shows active BF2 players setting up scripts.

It's right there in front of you.

At the end of the day though, I don't think DiCE 'nerfed' anything by removing dolphin diving - script or manually. It was friggin lame.

[Shepherd007]

Re: Thanks for killing an unique part of the game!

'Cause it's a smaller warhead and ment to be armour penetrating rather than fragmentation/Anti-personal?

I'd still like to see a more robust damage model for the GL. A high damage "kill zone" and a larger fragmentation area. I'll confess, I use to whore it up with the old GL on occasion. I felt a little cheesy doing it (let's face it, it was too damned easy to make kills with it). The newer version tho... it really is a bit on the worthless side.

There are several types of 40mm rounds that it can handle. H-E, tear-gas, smoke, buckshot, etc. I would like to see the GL back closer to its original power. I think it would be cool to have the buckshot round instead of the smoke grenade too.

[disfigured]

Re: Thanks for killing an unique part of the game!

I'm for the nerfing for a reason that hasn't been mentioned here.

Estetics.

I fall victim only slightly more to proners and bunnyhoppers, then not. It's a slight advantage to my game style which is being more cautious and using cover.

Personally I don't like the way it looks. It kills the game immersion for me. There's nothing more stupid looking then people doing the Olympic triple jump as soon as you get a bead on them. Or just witnessing it as part of the battle, even if they are not evading my fire.

I didn't pay big dollars for the parts to build my latest machine, load BF2 play it at 1600x1200 and see Halo jumping and hopping. Am I elitist for mentioning my computer and resolution? Guilty as charged. So sue me, I have an excellent attorney, he's got no morals and stops at nothing, he's very good.

Is BF2 a realisitic game, no. But it mimics reaslism because it's themed with real characters, weapons and vehicles. There's an element of realism, visually.

So I say, nerf away. While Jets move to nearly stall speeds and that is totally unrealistic, they still look like jets. Tanks move and turn like tanks, or close to it anyway. There's no one of the face of the earth that was ever able to generate enough energy from a standing or crouching postion to begin to move themselves in fashion of a bunny hopper. It looks terrible in a game that is visually stunning. Get rid of it. I always like the climb feature in RogueSpear. Want to go over a short wall? Well then your going to be vunerable. Don't want to be vunerable, then go around the long way.

On a second more pratical note:

From a techincal standpoint I really think uberizing weapons or leaving them where they are is the move to make. It's simply not a good fit for the physics or the game's lay out.

Example: Should the NBA raise or lower the height of the rim? Players have gotten "mad skills" over the years. But they've also developed a few very reliable moves mainly the dunk. The game has become more one dimensional with less strategy and less diversity in the make up of teams. Would the answer be to lower the rim so or raise it? Of course it's raise the rim. In 1930 in Springfeild MA no one invisioned an O'neal, or Bryant or Jordan.

Same goes for DICE, and for most games, it's truely amazing what people we do and learn to make themselves better. But increasing the availablility of power and accuracy doesn't make a game with the scale of BF2 better. It simply makes it like every other game that came before it. The longer you played and harder you consentrated on refining that game the more effectiveness you'd have on the Battlefield. Personally I've been there and done that, and BF2 wasn't meant to be that game. Or it seems DICE thinks so, and I agree with them.

We have to work within what BF2 does best. Cone of Fire isn't even suited for the 1on1 Rambos. Your trying to fit square peg into a round hole. The randomeness forces other aspects of the game to be more effective, and more usefull to people. If the general community defeats the randomness by what ever means, liked or disliked, considered exploits or not, makes no difference, what is causes is that most of the game's intent has been effectively rendered null and void. Or it's headed that way.

Going further in the direction that allows this growing gap between individual skills and squad based tactics is the wrong direction. It certainly doesn't make any sense to do it, just so it won't be a blow to some one's ego. Which I see a lot of in the "no-nerfing" argument. "I own", "you don't have skills", "noob", get throw around a lot while trying to make their points.

I'm not suprised though, no matter how big a scale a game tries to be, no matter how much vehicle integration is introduced, or how much squad based, and other roles are programmed into it, some people are the happiest with spawing at the two closest spawns and duking it out death after death, then boasting about their bigtime K/D at the end of the round. It's just not that type of game, for me it doesn't even feel right in CQC. It's rather clunky and pot luckish.

Will BF2 ever be a game that reflects your devotion and a hard time put in on individual skills? No, not the extent of other games. Will it be less of this type of game with these changes .......yes. Sorry, check your ego at the door and play the game using the other aspects of it. It was never really intended to be that type of game to begin with, yes there were certain elements of that since it was a very watershed game that brought together many diffrent genre, styles and elements. But I personally like the game for all the other things it offers, and am against making it the mad button masher that some want every game to be, no matter what it started out as, or what's it's capable of.

And no I dont' get owned (even with only 200 hours), and no I'm not a casual gamer, and no I'm am very competitive. But my idea of competitiveness has gone beyond the twitch and flick , or the prone, and the duckdive. Believe me, if I did start to get "owned", I go get a G15 and assault class macro-prone, dolphin-flop your ass, right back at you . Personally I would rather use all the other things in the game to compete rather then just 1 class, 2 macros or moves, on only 3 maps, that are essentially the same anyway.

[DarkShot]

Re: Thanks for killing an unique part of the game!

Believe me, if I did start to get "owned", I go get a G15 and assault class macro-prone, dolphin-flop your ass, right back at you .

so you admit after i teabag you 10 times in a row you would throw your "estetics?" (i think you mean aesthetics, whatever that means) out the window and go prone jump revenge on my ass?
after all that fancy speech you wrote up you still one of us. embrace the darkside you must.