Are these hacks?

[scottmuecke]

Re: Are these hacks?

bunnyhopers and dolphin divers are just trying to make up for the lack of skill they have, do you think they would be doing it if they didn't have to? everytime i kill 1 of those retards i say "jumping round like an idiot didnt help, did it?" how bad would you feel if you knew you had an advantage and still got fcuked up?
does this include people who just go prone, coz that shouldn't count.

[LahLahSr]

Re: Are these hacks?

It's not about "realism" but about "belivability". A high degree of believability gives players a sense of immersion..you "feel" that you are actually there playing the part of a real soldier on a real battlefield.

Hardly anyone here has even the vaguest clue about what "realistic" means anyway - which is fortunate, since I wouldn't wish for anyone to be in a war anyway.

A lot of things in BF2 is designed to mimick real life - thre is gravity, trajectories, life and eath, reloading, plants, topography etc. etc. It doesn't take a post-secondary education to figure out that the developers tried to create a believable world for us to role-play the part of a soldier in.

So, in a couple of ways they failed. They created a game where the dynamics are exploitable. They put a lot of energy into creating game-weapons that look and act somewhat like their real-life counterparts. You have to aim and reload and your stance impacts accuracy/bullet spread.

So, is it fair to assume that they expected players to jump+prone+strafe as a part of their standard tactics? No, of course not..you'd have to be an idiot to think so. Is it fair to blame the developers for not testing and compensating for what is sooo preditable? yes, of course it is. How can any developer NOT try and limit the exploits? Their Quality Assurance/Testing/Design group are incompetent beyond belief for letting that one slip by. The whole game is designed around up-close combat..the weapons can't hit a barndoor at any range anyway. They also designed, for whatever harebrained reasons, the soldiers jump-height to be completely over-exaggerated as well. it doesn't take a genius to figure out that the immature majority of players out there would try and figure out the best way to get an edge...

Can we expect any kind of maturity, decency - indeed manners - out of the average BF2 player? Nah, I think we all know that the eAnonymity allows people to mouth off to their betters without fear of being slapped around. It's "revenge of the geeks"-time on the Internet.

So, the only way to effect the changes needed to make BF2 a game that doesn't have such arbitrary dynamics mixed in with more believable ones is to raise a stink about it so big that EA/DICE take notice. Sure, the divers/jumpers/macro-exploiters will try to defend their "right" to get this skill-less edge over everyone else..but that is to be expected. For them to use it to begin with it's quite clear that exploits are second nature and ethics a foreign word.

In short: DICE/EA - fix your software please. Make up for the obvious erros in design/quality assurance/test that allow these clear UNintended exploits.

Cheers :-)

[[MyIS]Spetsnaz]

Re: Are these hacks?

If DICE did not want people to do this they would do 3 things:

1) You cannot jump if your stamina is below 30%.
2) When jumping, your stamina drops 80%.
3) You cannot go prone while in mid-air.

They aren't doing this for a reason, right?

Here's the deal, it's part of the game. Yes, it would be nice if everyone ran around slowly and took 4 seconds to crouch and aim when they see you (giving you an easy kill), but that's not the case.

I am certain that if jumping+prone was to be removed (very easy to do so as outline above), there would be a similar thread complaining about something else with similar people saying that there's another "cheap" tactic out there.

The distinguishing trait between good players and bad players in PC gaming over the years has been their ability to adapt to the games little quirks. For instance, instead of shunning it off as an exploit (which it obviously is not), try to beat it.

If I can pick off froggers at 30 meters with an M24, you guys can do it too with automatic weapons. Just remember that they cannot shoot while in the air. Also, they need to adjust their aim for about half a second when they land. This gives you 2 options:

1) Attempt to predict their landing position and wait for it. Works great if you are a good shot w/ practice like me.
2) Use the free time while they are in the air to rush them or take cover.

I know that some game elements are frustrating, but welcome to the world of multiplayer gaming. The multi in multiplayer means some people will like things and others will hate them.

There's no reason to have animosity towards one another, especially when it comes to doing things in the game.

If something as silly/simple as pressing the jump key and quickly pressing the prone key while strafing is an exploit...

... well everything can technically be an exploit, no? These are fundamental gameplay mechanics people - nothing hard about it.

Oh, one final thing about macros... I've been accused of "macro hacking" countless times and only recently have figured out what that is by word of mouth. Don't jump the gun on macros -- some people have faster fingers and better keyboard configurations that you do :)

[Komet.nl]

Re: Are these hacks?

A techinique which im seeing more of lately is ppl repeatedly jumping in the air then to prone like a frog going crazy at an all night rave. It is very difficult to hit them and is also ridiculously unrealistic. One player just now mocked me for my inability to shoot him . I tried doing the same thing but it seems pretty much impossible to do it on my setup- not that I want to - but I hate people exploiting things to get an unfair advantage. This technique must be stopped.
My second moan is about aircraft. Now whilst avoiding being shot down whilst an enemy plane was on your tail has always been testing, for me it now seems impossible to avoid being shot down once the warning alarms are sounding. This is the case no matter what death defing manouvres are done. I had put it down to ppl being better flyers than me. However recently whilst playing Wake Island I saw somebody on my own team fly low over the airbase and vitually do a hairpit turn and speed off into the blue yonder with little pause . Looked more like a rally car cornering than a plane manouvering. Hack or game design error?

Think someone is getting owned
Sorry for that I have to say it's pretty stupid looking but it's often used in matches :) And if I see one person Dolphin Diving I'll do the exact same thing it's so easy but I wish they remove it it looks kinda dull but it sure helps.. It's really not hard to shoot them really not hard..

[imported_Predator]

Re: Are these hacks?

BF2 was never meant to be realistic????
I guess you are one of the guys who does this jumping trick. Just because you dont do it or dont want to do it doesnt mean you are a noob .The whole thing that makes bf2 good is its realism ,why not go and play some sci fi game where you can bounce around with glee

If you watched the BF2 developer interviews, the head dice guy CLEARLY STATES this game was ment to have an arcadish feel.

bunnyhopers and dolphin divers are just trying to make up for the lack of skill they have, do you think they would be doing it if they didn't have to? everytime i kill 1 of those retards i say "jumping round like an idiot didnt help, did it?" how bad would you feel if you knew you had an advantage and still got fcuked up?
does this include people who just go prone, coz that shouldn't count.

Dolphin diving and prone spaming do not make up for lack of skill, they EXPLOIT your lack of skill. Against good players these tactics do not work very well, but in pubs hardly anyone can hit you. All of the best players in the world use the tactics. Does that mean they lack skill? No. It means they are smart and know how to make themselves hard targets to hit. The fact that you cannot hit them is because YOU lack skill, not THEM.

[$quatell]

Re: Are these hacks?

The dolphin diving thing is a silly exploit that some people have turned into a programmed key macro. I feel your pain about the jets, the problem with them is that Air to Air Missiles have been given an enormous boost in terms of power and maneuverability since the 1.2 patch. It was once possible to evade even J-10s but now dogfighting has degenerated so much that even pathetic bomber pilots can shoot down fighters. I made a thread on the issue here http://www.totalbf2.com/forums/showthread.php?t=78074.

As for the guy doing a hairpin turn, he probably crashed into or wing tipped something like a palm tree. It happens sometimes and for some reason you can survive these encounters.

A macro? LOL!!! you nig nog all you do is press *prone crouch prone crouch prone crouch* over and over and over and over again, it is not an exploit and we don't use macros. just try it for yourself before you scream" omg hax!!111!!"

Lol, last time I played Karkand it was like some kind of freak cirus, all these idiots bunny hoping and dolphing diving fast then using the gl. Another reason I never play Karkand anymore.

You think karkand is bad? Play mashtur 16 please.

[Zlayer]

Re: Are these hacks?

Wow... bunnyhopping/dolphin diving is fine and is a perfectly legit tactic.

This game is hardly realistic or believable.

Stop ****ing crying about FEATURES. There are a rediculous amount of bugs in this game that need to be fixed; further nerfing dolphin diving, C4 chucking, and "noob toobing" just makes the game worse. DICE seems to cater to whiny bitches.

Dolphin diving and bunnyhopping are NOT exploits. They never have been and they never will be. If you don't like it, find a way to counter it. People try to make up for their own shortcomings in BF2 by complaining about dolphin diving and/or blaming their deaths on it. Leave the server, counter it, or do it yourself. "Adapt and overcome."

People can choose how to play the game the way they want. If you want to play realistically, pubbing isn't the best idea, plain and simple. Go join a realism clan or play PRMM if you want no bunnyhopping/dolphin diving, as it is truly the only avenue to avoid it.

Lastly, I propose that DICE just completely removes the "Shoot/Fire" function, as this seems to be the underlying issue of many complaints.

Dolphin diving and prone spaming do not make up for lack of skill, they EXPLOIT your lack of skill. Against good players these tactics do not work very well, but in pubs hardly anyone can hit you. All of the best players in the world use the tactics. Does that mean they lack skill? No. It means they are smart and know how to make themselves hard targets to hit. The fact that you cannot hit them is because YOU lack skill, not THEM.

^^^ Correct ^^^

[scottmuecke]

Re: Are these hacks?

Dolphin diving and prone spaming do not make up for lack of skill, they EXPLOIT your lack of skill. Against good players these tactics do not work very well, but in pubs hardly anyone can hit you. All of the best players in the world use the tactics. Does that mean they lack skill? No. It means they are smart and know how to make themselves hard targets to hit. The fact that you cannot hit them is because YOU lack skill, not THEM.[/QUOTE]

So u do it?. i can to, but i choose to fight like a man and dont go all out with jump-proning, and its not exploiting my lack of skill coz i got enough. every1 knows its harder to hit a moving target especially when they are prone spaming. Lets get this clear PRONE SPAMMING IS NOT A TACTIC its an exploit, whereas "flanking" is. If every1 did it could u imagine the gameplay it would really suk, EA hasnt done anything about it because it is only a small crappy amount of players that do it, u obviously are to crap to get kills the real way so u have to resort to crappy exploits like that.

[imported_The 13th Raptor]

Re: Are these hacks?

It's a feature when the developers intended it, otherwise its a bug, or an exploit. If the developers ment for people to jump trough the air while prone you would have seen it in the intro and gameplay video's released before the game was out.

Now as they are nerfing hopping/getting up, its a clear sign they did NOT intend it to be used like it is. The reason is obvious, it looks friggen rediculous, and turns gameplay into something rather.. laughable.

And sure, all the "good" competiive players do it, but that is because clans and competative folk always exploit everything to the max, it's no secret.

[Pluckyx24]

Re: Are these hacks?

I wouldn't consider the bunny hopping and dolphin diving a hack, but it can sure be annoying. Sometimes, you might see the "man humping floor" tactic.

[imported_The 13th Raptor]

Re: Are these hacks?

It's not a hack unless it involves altering code, people should get their terms right.

[Mekstizzle]

Re: Are these hacks?

It's a feature when the developers intended it, otherwise its a bug, or an exploit. If the developers ment for people to jump trough the air while prone you would have seen it in the intro and gameplay video's released before the game was out.

Now as they are nerfing hopping/getting up, its a clear sign they did NOT intend it to be used like it is. The reason is obvious, it looks friggen rediculous, and turns gameplay into something rather.. laughable.

And sure, all the "good" competiive players do it, but that is because clans and competative folk always exploit everything to the max, it's no secret.

They also can't accept the fact that they truely are crap and can't actually not-die without bunnyhopping etc..

Yes, to the people who say "what am i supposed to do stand there and get shot?" i'm talking about you. When you say that, you just remove all doubt of how good you actually are at the game and how intelligent you actually are.

[imported_The 13th Raptor]

Re: Are these hacks?

I dont honestly believe these people are crap, they are simply lazy. Who needs to use his brains, find alternative routes, and superior marksmanship when you can bash a few keys and be practically impervious to anything but shotguns and explosives? :)

[Shagrath]

Re: Are these hacks?

Please this is one of the most unrealistic, realistically modelled QUAKE games out there.

Cleric rezzing the dead in under 1 sec.

Enemy airfields magically reloading and fixing your plane WITHOUT LANDING...

Magic Boxes falling from sky that can heal you fix you, etc....

Squadmates spawning out of the squad leaders pooper ever 15 secs he is alive.

Red and Blue names appearing above your head.

Ability to sortie 60 times in 30 min game.

Game where a sniper rifle accurate to over 1/2 mile gets outgunned by an assualt rilfe at 300 yards.

But Realistically modelled for the kiddies.......


Game is more like military everquest then it is a simulation......

Yeah guys uninstall if the game makes you cry, we won't miss you.

[Doctor]

Re: Are these hacks?

So u do it?. i can to, but i choose to fight like a man and dont go all out with jump-proning, and its not exploiting my lack of skill coz i got enough. every1 knows its harder to hit a moving target especially when they are prone spaming. Lets get this clear PRONE SPAMMING IS NOT A TACTIC its an exploit, whereas "flanking" is. If every1 did it could u imagine the gameplay it would really suk, EA hasnt done anything about it because it is only a small crappy amount of players that do it, u obviously are to crap to get kills the real way so u have to resort to crappy exploits like that.

Fight like a man ??? this is a computer game we're talking about not some klingon warrior birth right you fruity nut. you don't get kills prone spaming its used when people are reloading or to get to cover I don't know any decent player that uses these tactics to get kills if you getting killed by spammers you simply just suck at the game bud. and people going on about finding diffrent routes etc. you guys must play on some complete crap servers cause on the servers I play on the commander is pretty much pointing you out 95% of the time commander mode pretty much ruined strats in BF