Cliffe On Balance

[Supersonic^]

Thortok2000 wrote..

The AK and M4 are the "uber-leet nub-killing wonderguns", the awp too, and I feel they should be nerfed in SOME way. I guess a price increase would do.

Oh while they're at it, why don't they nerf ALL the guns? :/



I really hope they dont make the AK that price. $3000 is ridiculous. $2700 is what it should be.

[/--Zen--/]

Thortok wins. Excellent post. I agree.

[lockhart]

Edited by [user="25310"] @ [time="1080665253"]

This is just one more example of the CS team not caring about the hardcore players. When you guys changed the money system, I felt the change was for the better, but there were a lot of really hardcore, really oldschool players who hated the changes. Hell, when you added the new guns there were some oldschool players who hated the changes. In fact, I was (and still am) someone who hated the jumping change. CS right now is fine, and if you're really set on testing these changes I really wish you would create a cvar to that would activate these changes to test them out; leave them off by default and then say "OK here's the cvar, everyone test it out and THEN give us feedback." I understand the argument against a 'pro mode' version of cs, but what about cl_pub 1? Is it really worth continually pushing the league players just to see how much they'll take?



Edit:

You know, as I look at the prices I see that they're not all that bad. I'm against the change for tradition's sake basically, but this is what I would like to see the changes made for: The complete elimination of saverounds. Change the loss money so that after the pistol round, the winning team can afford a m4/ak no helmet or a galil/famas helmet, and the losing team can buy MP5s with no helmet. Then if the MP5 team loses, make it so they can afford a galil/famas helmet while the other team can still buy m4/ak helm. After that, it's m4/ak all the way, with the only time someone saves is to be able to buy an AWP: make it a real high risk/high reward move. You might see this as decreasing strategy, but I see it as a change that gives everyone a chance to win every round instead of "OK lets suicide 4 guys over here and try and maybe get the bomb planted ok gogo."

This isn't what you guys are aiming for, but if the only reason you're changing the money is so that the lesser-used guns get used, well, thats a bad reason.

[bozer]

If it ain't broke don't fix it. If the game keeps changing, its going to become a diferent game. The Colt/AK/AWP have always been the best guns in CS, and I think it should remain that way.



The only money change I think that should be done, is also I think the best idea for a lot of things. Make the Shield cost as much as the AWP. Shield is the one thing that the AWP is useless against. Make them both the same price.

[0marTheZealot]

I like these changes. They look good with some tweaking.



But yea, I also agree that they should try to "un-nerf" the bad weapons.

[tibi08]

bozer wrote..

If it ain't broke don't fix it. If the game keeps changing, its going to become a diferent game. The Colt/AK/AWP have always been the best guns in CS, and I think it should remain that way.



The only money change I think that should be done, is also I think the best idea for a lot of things. Make the Shield cost as much as the AWP. Shield is the one thing that the AWP is useless against. Make them both the same price.

Counter-strike is evolving, stop being a nancy fag and accept that it's improved over the years and this is another step in it's evolution.

[Wintermute]

lockhart wrote..

This is just one more example of the CS team not caring about the hardcore players.

yeah, I mean if they cared about us they'd ask us what we think

...

[MrBoji]

terrible idea. kill yourself

[IC dead people]

228 compact: 550 (old price: 600) good change

Five Seven: 600 (op: 750) good change

Elites: 600 (op: 800) good change



m3 shotty: 1500 (op: 1700) never use so don't care



MP5: 1800 (op: 1500) WTF!!!!!!!!! no way!!!

P90: 1900 (op: 2350) good change

TMP: 1100 (op: 1250) good change

Mac10: 1200 (op: 1400) good change

UMP: 1400 (op: 1700) good change



IDF Defender[Galil]: 2500 (op: 2000) A lot of money for a GAli!!!

Clarion[FAMAS]: 2400 (op: 2250) wouldn't pay that for a Famas!!!

ak-47: 3000 (op: 2500) NO!! LEAVE MY PRECIOUS BE!!!

M4: 3200 (op: 3100) why?

Bullpup[AUG]: 3400 (op: 3500) good change

AWP: 5400 (op: 4750) GOOD CHANGE

Para: 4300 (op: 5750) EXCELENT CHANGE



So on the whole I agree but I wouldn't want the good to have to come with bad! can't we just have good changes and not mess up everybody's favourites?

[tspoon1066]

The changes don't seem that unreasonable.



But its kinda the wrong day for an april fools joke (unless they are building up to it)



Any chance of Wrestling Nation making another appearance on the 1st?



"OH YEAH!"

[Bigun]

Instead of compromising on what the two different groups of players (Pro/OldSchool vs Casual Pub'ers) want, why not just introduce a 'Pro mode' CS...



Sit down with people like the CPL, CAL-I and other serious leagues, as well as the Managers of the top clans and hammer out how they think CS needs to be changed at the Pro level of play, and create an official 'Pro Mode' CS.



Then mess around with the normal game to get it to be more 'noob-friendly' as some people call it.



Of course individual server admins should still be able to choose which one of the modes to run on their server.



As a side note - im no hardcore player, im more of a pub'er but I have played CS since the early days too.

[_Jinx_]

I'd say the m3, MP5, Famas, and Galil are all about $100 too much.



Other than that, the changes all look good except for the AWP change being too drastic. It'll never see the light of match play at that price. Having to save 3 rounds for an AWP is ridiculous. $5000 max, preferably $4800 IMO.

[bozer]

tibi08 wrote..

Counter-strike is evolving, stop being a nancy fag and accept that it's improved over the years and this is another step in it's evolution.

By your logic then we should start eating pizza with cheerios on it. I'm not being a "nancy fag". I like a lot of the changes CS has had over the years. I just think at some point maybe the changes to gameplay should end, and just "polishing off the bugs" should be worked on instead. If the hitbox's could be perfected, I'd be a happy boy.

[tibi08]

Bigun wrote..

Instead of compromising on what the two different groups of players (Pro/OldSchool vs Casual Pub'ers) want, why not just introduce a 'Pro mode' CS...



Sit down with people like the CPL, CAL-I and other serious leagues, as well as the Managers of the top clans and hammer out how they think CS needs to be changed at the Pro level of play, and create an official 'Pro Mode' CS.



Then mess around with the normal game to get it to be more 'noob-friendly' as some people call it.



Of course individual server admins should still be able to choose which one of the modes to run on their server.



As a side note - im no hardcore player, im more of a pub'er but I have played CS since the early days too.

I disagree - the whole great thing about CPL is you know they're playing exactly the same game as you.

bozer wrote..

By your logic then we should start eating pizza with cheerios on it. I'm not being a "nancy fag". I like a lot of the changes CS has had over the years. I just think at some point maybe the changes to gameplay should end, and just "polishing off the bugs" should be worked on instead. If the hitbox's could be perfected, I'd be a happy boy.

While I don't disagree, it was interesting that everyone bundled onto Steam to get the 1.6 beta versions when they could just use the 1.5 final. I think people want to be at the cutting edge, and now they are - there is no longer a final version as such.

[CheesyPeteza]

I like these changes. All the guns have their good points, its just nobody wants to spend a huge amount of money on for example a para, when you can get AK for half the price that does the same job.



I think they should reduce the prices a bit more actually. Sometimes you have to over balance things to make people use them, then fix them a bit later. I have learnt this from testing Natural-Selection.