calendar: december

[rizzuh]

Dangki wrote..

You say you're not an religious expert but then talk as if you are and that you know all this for a fact. Every you say about me and my opinions seem to apply to your own comments moreso.

History isn't religion. I'm not an expert on religion but apparently I know the history of at least two figures involved. Historically, Jesus and Muhammad both existed. This has nothing to do with religion.



No one here is an expert. My information comes from experts, yours comes from no one because you clearly haven't looked into it at all. I'm not saying this makes you stupid, but as an atheist you have no motivation to read up on Jesus. I didn't, either, until I saw the TV show and read up more on it. Hell, my school's history book had a chapter on it that they weren't allowed to teach.



Do you honestly think that the religions just sprang up without a figurehead? That a small group of men wrote the bible years after Jesus died and people just accepted it instantly as fact?



You clearly don't know what you're talking about. This isn't your own fault, but you're acting as if you're brilliant on the subject when you clearly believed that there was no evidence what-so-ever to prove the existence of the two people in question (that I don't want to type the names of again). Please do not be insulted, no one expects you to know everything in the world.



I'm glad that you're an atheist and all, but you should use history to support your case and not say history is questionable. This is in reference to you totally discounting multiple historical sources. Sources form history, history does not just last on its own momentum.

[icer-]

Edited by [user="21433"] @ [time="1039150714"]

rizzuh: did you get my e-mail? my computer crashed as I was in the process of sending it, so I'm not sure if it went through or not.

[Spoonman]

Simplex wrote..

I'm going to go out on a limb here and say "it will".

I was about to say... you're prediction was dead on. Perhaps you are a prophet...



:P

[Simplex]

Spoonman wrote..

I was about to say... you're prediction was dead on. Perhaps you are a prophet...

See, I'm an atheist. I love talking about religion. I know where that conversation goes. I also do a lot of anonymous surfing around random forums and read some of those threads. I see it every time.

[rizzuh]

A flamewar is a disorganized idiotic brawl with a bunch of myg0t-imitating idiots. A disagreement isn't always a flamewar!

N1ghtSt@lker wrote..

rizzuh: did you get my e-mail? my computer crashed as I was in the process of sending it, so I'm not sure if it went through or not.

I think so.

[Dangki]

Myths happen, legends happen. I'm not saying some guy made this Jesus thing up although maybe someone did. Maybe there was some 'Life of Brian' style guy who people followed around believing he was some kind of messiah and through chinese whispers this later became the Jesus we know of today. Maybe there were several people whom Jesus is based on.



There's historical things that say legends like King Arthur and Robin Hood existed but that doens't mean that they actually did. I'm sorry if you think I'm ignorant for disagreeing with something that you feel must be true.

[Simplex]

Edited by [user="3327"] @ [time="1039151444"]

rizzuh wrote..

A disagreement isn't always a flamewar!

OK, according to the dictionary you are correct, but is this really going anywhere? Do you think educating an unenlightened person was worth all this? The "no" answer would fit my own personal definition of flame war.

[rizzuh]

Jesus was told from birth that he was "the messiah." The three wisemen were also mentioned in most of the historical text and they were probably a significant influence. He didn't just think he was the son of god after birth.



This is boring. Where did you read that Jesus never existed?

Simplex, arguments rarely go anywhere. I wasted a lot of time. Thanks for making me feel suicidal.

[Simplex]

Edited by [user="3327"] @ [time="1039152194"]

Dangki wrote..

Myths happen, legends happen. I'm not saying some guy made this Jesus thing up although maybe someone did ... Maybe there were several people whom Jesus is based on ... There's historical things that say legends like King Arthur and Robin Hood existed but that doens't mean that they actually did.

#46 Which is why I suspected he meant to say 'infer'. We can't prove (like a mathematical proof) that they did exist. But that's the general consensus's best guest. And by general consensus, I mean those scholarly folk.

[Dangki]

Why should I believe there was some guy who was born around 0A.D. and there were 3 wise men who told him he was the messiah? Where are the historical artefacts where it proves all this? What are they? Tell me if you believe it so much instead of just saying I'm an ignorant idiot.

[Simplex]

rizzuh wrote..

Simplex, arguments rarely go anywhere. I wasted a lot of time. Thanks for making me feel suicidal.

SWEET! Now I can go to bed and have a peaceful night's rest. Ahhh...



But argument's usually do go places. However, this was mostly a viewpoint discussion, where the 'true' answer is not only unknown, but could go either way.

[Dangki]

Well if he means infer instead of prove then why's he so pissed off that I disagree with this erm.. inferment?

[Simplex]

Dangki wrote..

Well if he means infer instead of prove then why's he so pissed off that I disagree with this erm.. inferment?

Am I the only one who can use the internet to look up terms?



infer - To conclude from evidence or premises.



It is not rock solid proof. But given all the evidence, if we had to answer the question "Did Jesus Christ actually live?" my magic 8-ball of reasoning tells me "all signs point to yes". You are saying a rock hard solid no. He is saying "Everyone in the scientific community says he did". Sure, he could be wrong, but there's more evidence that says you're wrong. And to tell the truth, you've shown yourself pretty ignorant on this topic thereby ruining your credibility. Why'd he go ape shit? I dunno.

[Dangki]

I'm not saying a solid no. I just don't believe there was some guy called Jesus who was told he was the messiah and then ended up being crucified. Maybe there was some guy who Jesus was based on maybe it was all made up. I don't know.

What have I said anyway that showed me to be ignorant on this topic?

[Simplex]

Dangki wrote..

What the hell are (Christian) and (Canadian) supposed to mean?

eh?

Dangki wrote..

Technically Christmas and New Years day are both Christs birthday. Those crazy Christians.



Surely around that time and what with Jesus and his folks being Jewish they would've used the Jewish Adam and Eve calender thing?

The celebration of the new year is the oldest of all holidays. It was first observed in ancient Babylon about 4000 years ago. In the years around 2000 BC, the Babylonian New Year began with the first New Moon (actually the first visible cresent) after the Vernal Equinox (first day of spring).



And that 2nd paragraph is just dumb.

Dangki wrote..

Well then that must prove that Hercules, Budha, Muhhamed and all the other Prophets existed too.

No. Illogical assumption.

Dangki wrote..

Who wrote these historical documents then, Christian and Islamic monks?

This is ignorance. (Please do not confuse with rude) Go do your homework. google is only 6 letters and a click away.

Dangki wrote..

I didn't say Hercules was a prophet. I compare him to the others because he was the son of 'the' God Zeus with a mortal mother (exactly like Jesus) who came down and helped people out with many of his stories being very similair to ones later told about Jesus and Buddha.

Buddah, not a 'son of god'. Again, do your homework.

Dangki wrote..

There's historical things that say legends like King Arthur and Robin Hood existed but that doens't mean that they actually did. I'm sorry if you think I'm ignorant for disagreeing with something that you feel must be true.

Again, different kind of historical writings. Homework.

Dangki wrote..

Why should I believe there was some guy who was born around 0A.D. and there were 3 wise men who told him he was the messiah? Where are the historical artefacts where it proves all this? What are they?

Page 462, Numbers 7-18. Due by next monday.



And on a related note, I don't want to read anymore of this. I will never open this topic again and hope this conversation gets lost somewhere in the archives.



Goodnight!



~Simplex