To Steam or not to Steam?

[$pazmatazz]

[pr] wrote..

spaz: excellent post (#10) totally agree.

Thank you.

[Patrick_Bateman69]

kareeser wrote..

Patrick_Bateman69... in response to your post above about how there's a pause b/w the game client and the game server, I'll just pretend that you're paranoid.

I hope so. I was pretty clear that I was basing my judgment on the reviews of others, as I have not tried it myself. People are saying it's really slow when joining, so I'm speculating. Isn't that what msg boards are all about? :)

Gnu wrote..

Because Steam isn't going through the same WON servers that we use now for Half-Life, and the authentication servers are flooded.



Could also be trying to contact the Friends server at the same time

It's things like that which I assume are happening here, which do not happen when joining with the in-game browser or with Gamespy. Thus, the root of my complaint.



So, is Valve trying to replace WON? With the bad judgment they demonstrated with the first flood, I don't think they're up to the challenge.



I like WON. It works. They've been doing this for years and know what they're doing. If Valve is trying to step up and take over this, just to be able to get their foot in there and collect stupid statistical information at the expense of making us wait all day to join a server, that's pretty sad.



Please let me be wrong when it's final!

[-:Nighthawk:-]

Edited by [user="26841"] @ [time="1043396733"]

PieWarrior wrote..

I wall of 2 or 3 shields is impregnable unless you get hit a lot (Hint hint stay crouched).

I'm still not quite sure of all the aspects of the riot shield. On 1.6b servers, there's been a lot of speculation as to whether you can shoot through the window, whether certain guns can penetrate it, whether it takes damage, whether there's hitbox issues, and the like.



What we have observed are situations where people with, say, a deagle have blown people away THROUGH their deployed shield, with no visible parts of their body on the sides (watching people do this in 1st person view). Other times, though, it seems like 3 people can fire entire clips at the shield, awp it, and it just bounces around. It's odd, and I'm not sure what makes each situation happen.

Gnu wrote..

Because Steam isn't going through the same WON servers that we use now for Half-Life, and the authentication servers are flooded.

Okay, there's a slight problem here. I've seen less than 100 servers for CS1.6b so far. And many of those are empty. So... the amount of players actually actively testing CS1.6b is quite low. As such, I'm finding it hard to believe that any authentication servers would be flooded.



Not to mention, Steam authenticates you when you initially sign in with your email and password. Of course this wouldn't be going through WON at the moment (did any of us have to enter a cd-key to beta-test CS?), but I doubt that WON will be scrapped. Anyway, I haven't really seen any notable change in the server connection times, but that's just my perception.



Now random disconnections... that's another matter... > It's beta though, so you've got to expect a few problems.

CubicVirtuoso wrote..

As I said before, Steam was Valve's way of seeing what thier limits were with the Half-Life community. They think that they own the Half-Life community when the Half-Life community owns itself.

If the CS community owned itself, then there would be a huge amount of CS1.3 servers, and 1.4 would have never gotten popular. VALVe defines where the game will go, and the community follows. The other aspects we may control, like the fansites and customations and such. But VALVe does, in my opinion, control where the game will go, and the community gladly follows (albeit often with a lot of bitching from some).

The bottom line is that CS 1.6 should of just been released as a normal run of the day patch and let Steam work out its bandwidth issues.

Unless I'm mistaken, I was under the impression that CS1.6 will be released as a "normal run of the day patch" when it's out of the Beta stage. CS1.7 will be totally integrated with Steam, from the most recent information we have, but 1.6 should (if all remains as we've been told) be released as a normal patch, for those who wish to download it that way.



Regardless, while I may disagree with many of your opinions and how you stated them, I do want to thank you for being very mature about the whole thing. The CS community can be very unforgiving in its criticism (myself included, as you've certainly seen), but it's nice to see that you aren't taking that too personally. :)



[Added, forgot to quote this one earlier]

bartlisa wrote...

As for the background stuff, it remains to be seen. The control they are giving themselves comes with responsibility. Its a slippery slope and at the bottom is the mal-ware that comes with Kazaa.

True, and I can see where you're coming from. Granted, I currently have faith that they'll maintain a high standard for themselves when it comes to such things. However, I can definitely see how the technology could be abused, with a bit of modification, and some really poor decisions. Especially considering the addictive appeal that CS has in the lives of so many people. Let's all hope that VALVe will keep high standards, eh? :)

[CoolBurn]

So, is Valve trying to replace WON? With the bad judgment they demonstrated with the first flood, I don't think they're up to the challenge.



I like WON. It works. They've been doing this for years and know what they're doing. If Valve is trying to step up and take over this, just to be able to get their foot in there and collect stupid statistical information at the expense of making us wait all day to join a server, that's pretty sad.



Please let me be wrong when it's final!

When I saw an article about the Steam beta, I assumed it would be positive. I had tried out the old version of Steam about 3 months ago just to see what was in store. Man, I was completely disappointed. A memory hog of a program...it just completely removed my desire to play. Thus I have refused to tryout the new betas.



One point that everyone doesn't realize is that Sierra, NOT Valve, currently control how patches are released. Sierra is responsible for the WON system of IDs as well. So the answer is YES, Valve is trying to replace WON by using Steam. By using Steam they don't have to go thru Sierra anymore (for updates or use WON). This is what the author probably meant when they said they were trying to reclaim the Half Life community (really meaning the CS community). I heard rumors that 1.6 will still be released as an exe patch (at least I hope). If not then I will be moving on to another game (bf1942) and their mods.



Oh and one last thing, cheating is still rampant in the CS community. It amazes me the number of people that have been banned from a server where I am an admin. To facilitate catching cheaters, the server runs HLTV and records demos. I've watched 3 demos in the last week where a player is walking forward, hears no sounds and whips around 180 degrees (in one snap motion) to headshot someone. I've watched several players just stare at walls and track people across the map. I read the release notes and none of the changes/additions have ANYTHING to do with anti-cheats. VAC is the only thing (besides HLGuard) that would deter cheats and they are too busy with Steam to update it.



Its obvious to me that some of the people here don't know enough to make the correct assessments about what is going on with Valve, the cheats, and Steam.

[kaxman]

The thing about cheats is that a lot of people seem to pub randomly, and they seem to be seeing more cheaters, whereas other people play in the same select few servers, where they know almost everyone who plays there, and therefore see fewer cheaters.



That's just my experience with the whole thing, anyway.



One thing I can say for sure: The cheating nowadays is nothing compared to when it was rampant back in 1.3...

[Mr. Poophead]

[Ghengis]

Edited by [user="54146"] @ [time="1043404808"]

CoolBurn wrote..

Oh and one last thing, cheating is still rampant in the CS community. It amazes me the number of people that have been banned from a server where I am an admin. To facilitate catching cheaters, the server runs HLTV and records demos. I've watched 3 demos in the last week where a player is walking forward, hears no sounds and whips around 180 degrees (in one snap motion) to headshot someone. I've watched several players just stare at walls and track people across the map. I read the release notes and none of the changes/additions have ANYTHING to do with anti-cheats. VAC is the only thing (besides HLGuard) that would deter cheats and they are too busy with Steam to update it.

Its obvious to me that some of the people here don't know enough to make the correct assessments about what is going on with Valve, the cheats, and Steam.

Totally agree mate, even the wwcl cfg checker, I have seen people actively bypass it when in th game, merely by typing in a simple alias!

kaxman wrote..

The thing about cheats is that a lot of people seem to pub randomly, and they seem to be seeing more cheaters, whereas other people play in the same select few servers, where they know almost everyone who plays there, and therefore see fewer cheaters.



That's just my experience with the whole thing, anyway.



One thing I can say for sure: The cheating nowadays is nothing compared to when it was rampant back in 1.3...

i am so glad that i wasnt around that sorry stage. I totally agree with you. The servers I regularly play on, are by and large cheat free and enjoyable experiences. I know players that can go 30+ ad less than ten kills, and I owuldnt feel particularly worried that they were cheating. (Though you can bet theyre probably gay w p peeps ;P) On the plus side as a group of players on a server, usually a clan were friendly with, get a feel for for each others styles of play, all the dying early gives me plenty of time to wacth other peoples styles to try and learn.:P



Sound is way important, and perhaps HLTV and constant demoing is the way forward, without seeming to be anti any particular country or anything, I find when visitng French and german, particularly german servers, Not only do they have the frag mentality of dm players, They tend to succeed thru vast amounts of ultrakill headshots and the like.



EG Azzie on an unamed se4rver, the admin of said server, fell off bridge as it was being rushed by cts, and WHILE FALLING killed two cts, followed by one in the BUILDING, to turn and finish of the rest of the team, one of which was me standing on the ramp thing, and people further behind me at the ct double doors. And that was like a single clip! And of course, The cts mention that is suspicious and A chorus of german, U n00bs come from the t side! I guess you never know, If it wasnt a cheat, that has to be an all time amazing moment, whihc I should choose to be proud to have participated in, even as the victim!



Ive no doubt that the ulötimate future preventionof hacking cack ing etc will involve more and more applications such as steam, as connectivity increases. I wonder how long it will be before we get fibre optic net connections, and we can look at a 1gb connection, /me drools. In some ways it could be better. Cos it may be cheaper in the long run to RENT applications from the software providers on a usage basis. So that you only pay while youplay! It would work out more expensive than present titels andrelease methods now for games!, But for 'real' applications and tools such as Photoshop etc.. It could be very usefull, ratehr than lame 310 day expiry demos. And whilst I knwo yes cracks etc are out there, the guy who made it deserves his cash really at teh end of the day!

As a business the first thing i would do , would be to look at maximising profits, common sense. Adware and all that horrible stuff may well appear in the future, but unfortunatley, The motivations of a business are totally different fromt he gaming worlds motivations

Anyway

PEACE!

[Ho Hum (Ma$h3d)]

Well in regards to shooting through the window of the riot shield in 1.6b I can confirm that you can. Purely from the fact that I was playing my first game of the day - bought a riot shield - shield up corridor choke point in de_dust and bang - head shot.



I disconnected at that point and went back to 1.5. I hope they change the fact that the window can be shot through but whats the point - the only thing you can therefore hit is the head. I'd rather take minimal damage through the shield rather than have all my body almost unhittable.

[CabalSoljea]

My two cents;



-my brother cheats.



end.

[paragon_au]

Fucking hell, Vavle did release it, offically. I got my link to the file FROM THE OFFICAL STEAM WEBSITE (http://www.steampowered.com).

They had it up on their site, but not for long because someone with a brain at vavle must have realised that they are going to need more that a 500mbit connection. So thus they removed it.

[PieWarrior]

i Think that steam is faster at connecting without WON ids, with one it takes about 45 seconds or more to connect with steam my comp has speed up to 30 seconds or less. VALVe is a developer, Sierra is a publisher. Steam is a very useful program, Without a publisher patches can be more frequent, other games can be 'Subscribed' to so other publishers could probably rent space on steam to sell thier games at lower prices (Don't have to pay for boxes, cds, jewel cases, Manuals, Shelf space, Replacing inventory, or Running out of the product) And which one of you likes high game prices? IF you do, I hate you.



"Boom, Lag, Boom, Luck, Boom, On the phone"

-Anthem of the complaining League player

[stooopid]

Edited by [user="18916"] @ [time="1043421221"]

I wish I had time to read this because Steam is p00p, and I've been ragging it from day 0. Word.



Honestly... we all raged when it wasn't being released and wasn't being released and now that it is we're raging that it doesn't work... so who gives a crap... i'll just wait till June or whatever...



-stooop

CabalSoljea™ wrote..

My two cents;



-my brother cheats.



end.

OMG... show me how... I'm so sick of camping...

[DeathsDisguise]

whats with the long messages it hurts my head. i can't even talk to someone that long let alone type it



Still having fun with Beta 7.1

muhahahaha

[blake87]

Well, Im glad that all you guys are having fun playing cs 1.6, but im still not being able to install steam correctly, it always updated it, then when it trys to update the platform.dll to version 2, that takes about 1 and 1/2 minutes, it says ERROR: Unable to uncompress data, CAN SOMEONE PLEASE HELP ME!, cause my friends are telling me how cool it is, and I am sitting here at my computer trying to get damn steam to install, not download, not update cs 1.5 to 1.6, but to INSTALL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[B.C.Croaker]

Edited by [user="88148"] @ [time="1043437694"]

Very Ignorant Article.

Steam will come to pass it will be the main stream app for getting software from valve. Not only that but it will allow companies like valve to make more money meaning better games. bottom line is this. The wright brothers didn't fly on thier first try but we still explore space. Give valve a break. Time will prove them out and the more money they make from steam the better itll get over the years.



Small note: my steam has worked perfect from day one.