Best way to (re)balance support -

[DrJambo]

Well, all but the small minded minority must surely know deep down that the support kit when accompanied with one of the two unlocks is massively skewed compared to the other kits and particularly assault.

So, what's the best way for DICE to sort out the problem? After all they over-buffed the support unlocks in the first place. Quite why they didn't streamline them more with the regular support guns is anyone's guess.

Anyway vote away and make your voice heard.

Just for the record here's my post-1.2 weapon stats:

Assault Rifle 27:23:26 1,300 1,036 1.25 22%
AT/AA 26:05:25 739 980 0.75 50%
Carbines 15:03:31 376 461 0.82 28%
Defibrillator 00:47:57 2 45 0.04 72%
Explosives 03:28:01 261 203 1.29 48%
Grenade 01:11:58 116 65 1.78 28%
Grenade Launcher 13:43:31 707 504 1.40 60%
Knife 00:57:18 101 44 2.30 30%
Lt Machine Gun 14:40:23 941 627 1.50 21%
Pistol 01:07:09 89 77 1.16 23%
Shotgun 23:29:20 1,012 838 1.21 13%
Sniper Rifle 18:54:25 655 378 1.73 44%

Of note are the bold entries. The lmgs stats include about 6 hours of support play under 1.12 in which I had an accuracy of 18 % and a k:d ratio of 0.80. The turn around is drastic, no? And the lmg stats are still on the rise! Soon the accuracy will overtake assault as the k:d ratio already has.

I bet there's others with even more conclusive proof in their stats. Please feel free to post them here.

[Revoluti0n]

Re: Best way to (re)balance support -

The other kits were already "souped up". The sniper kit got tweaked, the AA was tweaked, a lot of things were changed. I sincerely hope that the start focusing on performance issues rather than things that can be dealth with by selecting a quality server.

[Thirdeyez]

Re: Best way to (re)balance support -

I picked 3...dedicated support.
I still get killed, and just like any other kit its possible to knwo be effectvie at any range.
Tho..snipers, no contest..they shoudlnt even touch CQC...AT guys, they got rockets, ashame about the shotguns..but I have ate plently and I mean plenty of AT rockets while I was prone..And engy's are just a damn shame, they got shotguns and an explosive they get to lay down and hope someone actually drives over it..90% useless usless they got a tank/apc.

[claevade]

Re: Best way to (re)balance support -

Although I am a dedicated Medic, I don't have any problems with the Support Class facing me.

[markan dorka]

Re: Best way to (re)balance support -

I voted "other" - tweaking accuracy to 0.3 is good start, but then it'd be just more or less an assault rifle. I've seen other interesting ideas as well, but I don't think they're going to implement extra code to tweak proning timings, deploying bipods and whatnot, so here's a suggestion that mostly revolves around just tweaking the values.

Basically accuracy should be around assault rifle levels (because that's the bread and butter gun of the game - I have a hunch that maps, ranges etc. are designed around that in mind), maybe a bit better when prone, lot less when standing, somewhat less when crouched

So .. make the min dev accuracy something like 0.25 or 0.3. Change modifiers to something like 3.5/2.5/1.0. Give them 0.8 zoom modifier (like other guns have .. it's kinda silly to have 0.8 prone modifier and 1.0 zoom modifier - unless there's some logical reason to this that I just don't get :P)

After that's done, decrease the "deviation added / shot" around 0.05 to 0.1 depending on the guns - much less than assault rifles.

That'd hopefully lead to support being used to compensate for "lack" of accuracy (it'd still be one of the more accurate auto weapons) with consistent volume of fire. It'd eliminate support sniping because it'd be harder to land consistent hits on long range, but the gun would still have advantage to other kits when already prone, because you can score more hits/second due to way smaller accuracy penalty on auto / bursts.

[Mystiqq]

Re: Best way to (re)balance support -

- Decrease max nades to 2.
- Zoom mode delay should take at least 3 times as long with support weapons.
- PKM damage NEEDS to be decreased. 150 drop in ROF does not justify 15 points increase in damage.

Another thing is the support role in big maps. As everyone knows, the maximum ammo on vehicles is "a lot" and i think Dice should do something about it. Vehicles should rely on friendly support guys to give em ammo. Extremely good example is the AA tank which has very few missiles and requires a support OR a supply crate (very rarely happens).

As it is now, the "max ammo" count on armors is pretty much a joke, especially with tanks. APCs missile count is a-ok but not the main cannon.

[Thirdeyez]

Re: Best way to (re)balance support -

9 times out of 10 youll only notice a support domination on Urban CQC maps..
we dont have explosives, ability to have fire fights not in prone, long range sniping ability, repair ability..
No one ask for ammo on any map besides Urban CQC maps..luckily..no one plays support on these maps anyways hehe.

[DrJambo]

Re: Best way to (re)balance support -

9 times out of 10 youll only notice a support domination on Urban CQC maps..
we dont have explosives, ability to have fire fights not in prone, long range sniping ability, repair ability..
No one ask for ammo on any map besides Urban CQC maps..luckily..no one plays support on these maps anyways hehe.

But that's just it - why should support be dominating on urban CQC maps? In effect, haven't DICE just replaced one abhorration (noobtoob) with another (PKM/MG36)? I do agree that support's less useful on non-city maps, but the same holds true for the assault kit and they don't even have the ability to get easy ammo points.

[Berrern]

Re: Best way to (re)balance support -

I voted Other..

My suggestion would be to make the Support class less mobile/flexible, like:
- Less accuracy when crouching/standing, this will force them to go prone over distance.
- Should be a time delay from going prone to having a tight crosshair. This way they can't hit Prone and waste you immediately, but have to wait a second for their sights to settle. The Support class shouldn't be a run-and-gun class, they should be forced to lie down and give support.

[EvilP]

Re: Best way to (re)balance support -

What about an inablility to zoom while standing?

I think support weapons are actually fun now, so I think a different approach in balancing is the key if balancing is actually required.

[Beerman]

Re: Best way to (re)balance support -

I just like playing, I dont killed by PKMS that much so I do care. The way I look at it is they have the lay down for accuracy my assault dont. So you guys can go support all ya want I dont care, I just enjoying having a beer and playing.

[DrJambo]

Re: Best way to (re)balance support -

But, the PKM and MG36 actually have a better accuracy that the assault rifles while standing just as long as you're standing still and not strafing.

[Dirk001]

Re: Best way to (re)balance support -

I do remember when playin support before the patch that it s*cked big time. And now after the release of 1.20 I play support about 80% of the time. My k/d-ratio is over 2.00. Something that would never be possible for me to reach with the old acc.

[SQUiB]

Re: Best way to (re)balance support -

.. it's kinda silly to have 0.8 prone modifier and 1.0 zoom modifier - unless there's some logical reason to this that I just don't get :P)

Yeah it means that you have to go prone to get an accuracy boost rather than just having to use the sights. It would be kind of stupid if using the sights on a LMG while standing gave better accuracy than not using them.

[FlyingEgg]

Re: Best way to (re)balance support -

Make the Support class less mobile/flexible, like:
- Less accuracy when crouching/standing, this will force them to go prone over distance.
- Should be a time delay from going prone to having a tight crosshair. This way they can't hit Prone and waste you immediately, but have to wait a second for their sights to settle. The Support class shouldn't be a run-and-gun class, they should be forced to lie down and give support.

Here here. Let the support players have their accuracy and their capacity for devestation, but decrease their verstatility to put interest back into the Assualt kit.