Limit Flag Capture Ability to Infantry

[=HzC=Heinz]

elimiating a chopper's ability to hover and cap a flag is a great idea. I would not go as far as preventing ground vehicles from capping flags. love to see that happen though, it would discourage alot of present-day chopper/point whoring by 4 or 5 guys lucky enough to get into the chopper.

[Wreck0]

The problem with not being able to cap flags when in vehicles is you hop out to cap the flag and the enemy then hops in to take the vehicle kill you and stop you taking the flag. I am really talking about APC's and Tanks on this.
I am sure many of us have had something like this happen anyway from time to time but forcing players to get out of a tank or APC to cap would just make it happen all the time or worse have the armor driver not bother capping the flag and just spawn camp.

But I think the idea is that one guy with an APC shouldn't go capture a flag on his own, but would rather actually have to bring along some infantrymen, hence playing the support role that the OP wants it to play. I mean, the APC has passenger seats after all.

[AT39]

I've mentioned this in an earlier thread aobut the Blackhawk capping. I think a wonderful implementation of the new zipline/grappling hooks would work wonderfully on the transpoert choppers. The passengers could drop down to ground level, and when teh flag is capped, use to grappling hooks to get back up to the chopper.

[Odinpalen]

I wonder if changing it so you would need three people to cap a flag would help? But then what happens when only 2 or 1 people are left alive with no respawn?

Comments?

[ArmyOfOne*]

If any vehicle can take a spawn point but a helo, then thats just plain stupid. Also making it take 4 times as long as a two man infantry team is again stupid. I think everything is fine how it is, but if they take vehicle capping away they better take it away from everyone. it is easier to cap points in a tank then a BH by far. If points werent capturable by helos, then barely anyone would fly them, eliminating alot of teamwork. Whats the pilots incentive to fly a transport chopper if the only points he gets are kill assists and the occasional driver ability assist.....none.

[Odinpalen]

The point is for him to transport troops quicker to areas they may want to go. Now that is a stupid question. Why do we have real pilots in real life, for points? gesus get a life, stop posting dumb $hit. Smaller flag triggers would make mines alot easier cause you could just lay mines by the flag and stop the armor.

Black hawks capping is fine, just make it so you cant repair the bh in the air. You can killl a bh pilot with one at shot to the window, and nobody can take his spot cause his body is stuck in the seat. Of course only noobs don't know this stuff.

[C11.Nemisis]

so your saying only infantry can cap bases? what about ppl in a jet or btr would the have to exit to cap the base? what if when they exit and enemy jumps in and kills them all with their transport

[imported_Dr.D]

Base rape!

[Paas]

Ow, and all the guys saying that helicaptures should be deleted, ...

This is just a quickie to you saying that you NEVER said ANYTHING about Helicopters being delted.

Just, hitting you with a little bit of fact.

Have fun with it.

{WP}Paas

P.S. - ...and I know you DID NOT use the Merit of EA/Dice to argue your claims... that's a double edged AXE if I have ever seen one.

[tehpwnerofnoobs]

Ok, the MEC is putting up a fierce defense on Karkand. The marine team (noobs) are jyst dying mindlessly going for the hopeless hotel. You manage to flank them in an APC, and you say you shouldn't be allowed to capture rear flags? Good idea, but a tad extreme. An option would perhaps be increase the capping time, or simply reduce the points given to both 1 for captures and assists alike. Remove the ability to cap outright and spawn camping would become the sole objective of armor.

[Saureco]

It seems that a number of participants are missing the point entirely. Here are some of the arguments that I've seen so far:

1. "If the attacking team has to get out of their tank and you can defend from the safety of yours, where is the balance?"

Duh, kill the defending tank, then capture.

2. "If a helo can't hovercap, where is the balance?"

Just because at least one guy has to get out and capture doesn't mean the helo is impotent. Heavy helos have two side guns of varying damage (lets not digress into that argument here) and at least 2 seats on each side that an AT player can occupy. To call a heavy helo vulnerable only applies if the flag is being camped by an anti-air tank. Attack helos are twice as deadly, but what's the point of having someone get out. An attack helo with half its crew is actually more than 50% ineffective.

3. "I see no point in eliminating the vehicle cap."

Then you've never had your whole stockpile of bases speed-raped by a full helo/APC/boat/group bicycle.

4. "Why are we asking for changes? BF2 is fine as it is."

What BF2 are you playing?

[Paas]

Man, a lot of people are either A.) Not understanding what's said here; or B.) Putting their own spin on plain English. Let me break it down for the masses so we can all be on the same page.

Yes, I'm suggesting that ONLY infantry can capture a flag. As in, they have to be on foot and they have to be in the flag cap zone. Vehicles would have no say in the actual flag capture-indicator, instead, they would be limited to a supporting role.

Vehicles aren't supposed to be the backbone of the an Army, they are supposed to be the supporting weapons of infantry. BF2 doesn't depict this at all, so, it makes squad play a little pointless because vehicles have individual influence geared at advancement vs. support.

For example; a Cobra attack chopper shouldn't be flying from flag to flag and hovering around it, no, he should be clearing the surroundings for enemy infantry when they encounter Armor.

APCs shouldn't be manned by a single individual and just pull into a base and capture a flag, instead, it should be the unit transport and defense once a givin' squad reaches a flag... giving heavy support against other infantry and small-vehicles, and basically a Armored Anti-Tanker for when tanks approuch.

Tanks... well,hell, they are tanks. They should be " Tanking " enemy small arms fire while in a supporting role for a squad; limiting the effectiveness of OpFor infantry.

See, the few examples I have just givin' are the basis of how vehicles SHOULD and WOULD operate if they were forced into a support fashion. No, I'm not saying a Tank cannot be the tip of a spear, but, damnit, in order to throw a spear you need a shaft... which should be the Infantry.

I hope this clears up any confusion. And as for ya' fellas' who are so bitter that you can't bring anything productive to this thread. Please, for the sake of sanity, go post elsewhere. Thank you.

{WP}Paas

[Paas]

Ok, the MEC is putting up a fierce defense on Karkand. The marine team (noobs) are jyst dying mindlessly going for the hopeless hotel. You manage to flank them in an APC, and you say you shouldn't be allowed to capture rear flags? Good idea, but a tad extreme. An option would perhaps be increase the capping time, or simply reduce the points given to both 1 for captures and assists alike. Remove the ability to cap outright and spawn camping would become the sole objective of armor.

No, I'm not saying YOU shouldn't be able to cap the flag; I'm just saying you shouldn't be able to do it from the safety of your APC.

First of all, this is a squad based game, you shouldn't have flanked alone (Having individuals in your APC isn't going to change your percentages of flanking the enemy) you should have some Squad/Teamates with you. Heck, you should have maybe Helo support or another Tank, or maybe even a small vehicle with Engineer/Medic/Anti-Tank combination in support. Or heck! Your teamates inside could actually use the MG's on the side of the APCs.

But truely, this is what I think everyone is afraid of; being REQUIRED to have the support of your team to be effective, as it should be... Well, gunna' have to get over that. Nothing I can say to help.

As for this notion of vehicle spawn camping dynamics changing, um... People. Cmon' now. Use logic. What does a Tank or APC do CURRENTLY when they roll into a Capture Point in pursuit of a flag? They camp that givin' spawn point! It's their purpose, they are supposed to make the OpFor's life hell by providing fire/support that's not defeatable by small Arms (Although, there are PLENTY of Anti-Tank rockets scattered around this game, I don't see the issue). But, point being, vehicles spawn camp now... they would spawn camp with the change, and frankly. THEY SHOULD SPAWN CAMP.

I think this just points out a flaw in BF2's overall design, you need to spawn out a BIT farther from the flag, to give a squad a chance to formulate some type of counter-attack.

{WP}Paas

[Odinpalen]

I think the vehicle cap is fine, I mean its about ownage on a specific area of a map. Who owns that territory, like a football game. The only thing I dont like is a peice of armor can cap a flag at a safe distance. If the armor had to be confined to being next to the flag to cap it, instead of 30 feet away. Hard to lay mines over such a large distance to stop it. Unless you could re arm engineers with more mines, but as it is engineers can only lay so many mines before they start to dissapear.

[Dearmad]

How about it takes more than one person to capture a flag? That would be an intersting option, I think.