The Truth Behind the Lack of Good Gunners

[gerrynicol]

Re: The Truth Behind the Lack of Good Gunners

I have been in the gunners seat a couple of times now, didn't enjoy it. I was useless with the tv, guns were ok, I have "tried" to fly lol but tbh just cannot be bothered. I like ground pounding and occasionally I bring the chopper whores down with 'ole bessie



That being said if I was going to learn and fly I would appreciate it if whenever I got in the gunners seat I was not bombarded with "get out"(or whatever it is) for 5 mins and refusing to leave until I do so

As someone else said in game is different, everyone needs "real" practice.

[Dairuka]

Re: The Truth Behind the Lack of Good Gunners

That being said if I was going to learn and fly I would appreciate it if whenever I got in the gunners seat I was not bombarded with "get out"(or whatever it is) for 5 mins and refusing to leave until I do so

This happened to me also. It happened mostly on full large servers.

It stopped happening once I started playing regularly on underpopulated servers.

I would also suggest that you play on stages like Daqing Oilfields, Kubra Dam and Dalian Plant. There are more than 2 helicopters in these stages, which means less competition for them for when you're learning.

Just squad up with the person who is piloting for you on these maps. Talk with them over VOIP, and ask them for pointers while you're gunning for them. Most will appreciate the effort, and will allow you to gun for them even if you guys get shot down a couple times. If not, you'll probably get abandoned/redlined after the first one or two deaths.

If you notice a person solo'ing, but hes the leader of the squad. Join his squad, and ask him in VOIP if he wants a gunner. 99% of the time the answer will be yes. Solo'ers normally play as lonewolves to avoid people spawning on them, so if a solo'er has a squad, this means hes looking for a gunner.

Until you become very good at gunning, I'd suggest you steer clear of stages like Wake 2007, and Sharqui Penninsula. These are frequented helicopter whore maps. You're guaranteed to run into the undesirables who give solo'ing a bad name on these stages.

[SniperFM]

Re: The Truth Behind the Lack of Good Gunners

Sniper I think I flew you around for a whole round before, I think it was you anyways, showed you a few things and within 5-10 minutes you were doin pretty good........like I said "if that was you"

Yes..it was me!..like i said..i try to be a fast learner and with "patient" pilots like you that offer advice, we all get better!

Thanks for that game mate..i learnt alot and i think i'm getting there now!

SniperFM

[eddyeddyd]

Re: The Truth Behind the Lack of Good Gunners

ignorance is and always has been bliss

[|-TC-| NZSAS-Trooper]

Re: The Truth Behind the Lack of Good Gunners

omg!! I thaught it was just me!

[WNx Makka99]

Re: The Truth Behind the Lack of Good Gunners

man u smell like mustard

[ACE_FIN1972]

Re: The Truth Behind the Lack of Good Gunners

They can practice. The same way I practiced. Underpopulated servers, Single Player Mods and Unranked servers. Why are you people making a big deal about this, when there are blatantly obvious alternatives?

Yep, you can practise to a certain level with Single Player. Underpopulated you mean those where are too few player for game to start. Those are good but still u need the pilot and some moving target for your practise.

Indeed, every player is playing for fun. We all compete, and we all love to work as a team. However, when one player disturbs this cycle, we all become frustrated at this new gaping hole in the game, where fun used to be. This is a situation that is rectified by leaving the useless gunner in the helicopter to fend for himself (Or ruin another pilot's day), or by doing one of the more demonic remedies.

That vehicle still carries 32 Hydras and its really effective against armored targets even without gunner + that gunner of yours may get lucky.

The only problem is that everybody wants to be a gunner for a helicopter, because they believe it to be easy points for little effort. These are the same people who machine gun a tank and wonder why it's not blowing up, because the only helicopter experience they have is Sharqui whoring. This lack of experience is commonplace among the majority of gunners.

If I got ****ty gunner who is not willing to take advise, I fly like there is no gunner, using Hydras.

While most of us will give a gunner a chance before judging, you can't expect us to teach them all. Even the ones who are unwilling to learn? Thats where the fun dies down, and the need for my aforementioned remedies becomes most alluring.

No, I try to communicate first, if I don't get any reply and he sucks, like in previous, I use Hydras.

You don't piss off a team. You piss off one person.

Redlining is an underhanded tactic that I don't support.

Yeah, but most of the soloers here, wants to fly exclusively, dumping who ever get on board. I can understand curing the situation in case of one idiot ruing the game of whole team, but killing each and every team mate entering the cockpit is just stupid.

Thats assuming he joins your squad, reads the team chat, or communicates with you in VOIP. That is a requirement for somebody to be a gunner with me, thats why I always make a squad when I solo, so that somebody can Join My Squad and spawn on me.

So you don't solo? Okay that is nice to notice, you do give a chance whom ever :)

Congratulations. I've had many success stories myself in my meager 50 hours of experience, but I could tell you 200 horror stories about pathetic gunners, mentally inept pilots, and the TV-missle that fired like a RPG for every 1 success story that I've had.

Thanks, I've had my share of those also and in the beginning I guess I was one causing those, but hey, I learned

You speak as if many people who support solo'ing have never tried.

Most certainly they all have tried, they were beginners once. In some corner they lost their patience and now they are in the "Dark side"

The fact of the matter is. There are hundreds of thousands of people who play BF2. Most of them are newbies in a sense of the word. Are you honestly going to teach every single one that jumps into your helicopter, forcing you to suffer 1:20 K/D ratios on an hourly basis, while your team constantly gets itself baseraped by the enemy helicopter simply because those foolish individuals who jump into your gunner seat still haven't even grasped the basics of right clicking to bring up the TV-missle screen? :|:

No, like I said I use Hydras or take a jet or go on foot...there are options.

I give advice all the time. I'm very open about my methods, and my secrets, but I'm not playing BF2 to teach other people the absolute basics in game when they should already know the basics. Thats not fun for me.

I understand what you mean, and I agree that flying with some one who can't do a shi _t is no fun. I choose not to fly:)

[Dairuka]

Re: The Truth Behind the Lack of Good Gunners

Yep, you can practise to a certain level with Single Player. Underpopulated you mean those where are too few player for game to start. Those are good but still u need the pilot and some moving target for your practise.

A certain level? You can TV to your hearts content hitting moving targets. Sure you won't go up against barrel rolling helicopters, but you'll learn plenty.

That vehicle still carries 32 Hydras and its really effective against armored targets even without gunner + that gunner of yours may get lucky.

If I got ****ty gunner who is not willing to take advise, I fly like there is no gunner, using Hydras.

How is that any better than solo'ing? You're just solo'ing at half effectiveness.

The gunner doesn't learn anything if you don't give him a chance. Remember?

No, I try to communicate first, if I don't get any reply and he sucks, like in previous, I use Hydras.

I'm beginning to wonder if you proof read this post before you made it. You're a great guy, but you've debated yourself into a corner here. It's my respect for you thats keeping me from attacking this obvious contradiction.

Yeah, but most of the soloers here, wants to fly exclusively, dumping who ever get on board. I can understand curing the situation in case of one idiot ruing the game of whole team, but killing each and every team mate entering the cockpit is just stupid.

I'm sorry to say, but what is the difference between what we do, and what you do? Is it because you're giving that bad gunner some free driver kill assist points? I'm sorry but you're not doing him any favors, and you're definitally not doing the next poor pilot who gets stuck with this horrific gunner any favors.

It's better to discourage bad gunners from freeloading.

So you don't solo? Okay that is nice to notice, you do give a chance whom ever :)

I solo, I support solo'ing, I support communicating, I support those who give advice.

I do not support wasting fourty minutes of my time teaching a complete moron the absolute basics of helicopter gunning...

I guess that point strayed from my original point though. My original point was to say that I understand the reasoning why solo'ers do what they do. The chances of running into a horrible gunner at random greatly outweigh the miniscule chance of running into a good gunner at random.

Most certainly they all have tried, they were beginners once. In some corner they lost their patience and now they are in the "Dark side"

Quite honestly, the Dark Side is more of a Grey Side. There is no evil intent involved in wanting a helicopter to yourself. Not picking up that person spamming his "I need a ride" button isn't against any laws.

Unless of course, you intentionally eject your gunner, no matter how bad they are.

No, like I said I use Hydras or take a jet or go on foot...there are options.

Yes, and one of those options is to solo. It's the same option offered to bomber jets, tanks, transport helicopters, transport vehicles, APC's, and Mobile Anti-Aircraft.

The only reason people get miffed at solo helicopter players, is because that player is not earning the person who is grounded when he wants to gun any points. If the Tank top-side gunner seat earned points as fast as a Helicopter Gunner seat, people would be screaming about tank solo'ers too. So really this is not about teamwork at all, but about points.

Sure earning easy points is fun, but most of us don't play this game to make it fun for other people. We usually play this game to make it fun for ourselves and it's not selfish to admit that. It's not our job to cater to a stranger when they're not part of your community. (ie: Clan, Friends, Forums like TBF2. I know I'd gladly help any regular poster from this forum on a whim.)

Playing the, 'what if it was you' card doesn't really hold up in this arguement, because we've all been there, and we all found ways around the tediousness of the more selfish helicopter players. We found different maps with less point whores (Dalian and Daqing are the best). We learned through alternative methods. (SP64, SPBotChanger, Underpopulated Servers, Empty Servers.)

I shouldn't have to teach somebody who could just as easily teach themselves if they bothered to try. To me this equates to some MMORPG moron screaming, "How do I attack enemies!?" in server chat after he skipped the tutorial, and completely ignored the instruction booklet that came with his game.

I understand what you mean, and I agree that flying with some one who can't do a shi _t is no fun. I choose not to fly:)

Likewise.

[Sloi sauce]

Re: The Truth Behind the Lack of Good Gunners

I shouldn't have to teach somebody who could just as easily teach themselves if they bothered to try. To me this equates to some MMORPG moron screaming, "How do I attack enemies!?" in server chat after he skipped the tutorial, and completely ignored the instruction booklet that came with his game.

Agreed.

It's insulting to people who've spent a long time making instructional videos and guides to help others learn the trade. In fact, I've personally spent over 200 hours flying people around (not gunning or soloing, FLYING) only to see the effort go unrewarded or, even worst, completely wasted.

When I checked my numbers earlier this week, I realized how unselfish I actually was: now it's my turn to enjoy myself... and you'll excuse me for writing this, but practically every pilot I've flown with has been lacking in one important way or another. Rather than experience frustration, I proverbially "do it right the first time" myself.

I'm certain others have gone through these exact steps... why do you think we have so many soloers now, as opposed to one year ago? With this technique, it's no longer necessary to suffer a bad pilot or gunner.

[Mo0by]

Re: The Truth Behind the Lack of Good Gunners

I usually stay out of all this pointless cr*p about soloing.


However I was redlined twice last night for no apparent reason.


You people are b@stards.


(redliners...)

[ACE_FIN1972]

Re: The Truth Behind the Lack of Good Gunners

Okay I think I didn't specify my point of view about this soloing issue well enough...

What I hate about soloing is those players TKing other players for the vehicle. M95 or redlining or what ever is the thing that makes me mad. I haven't killed anyone of my team for the vehicle ever, except those who have on purpose TKed me first.

I have nothing against trying to select your gunner to be as good as you can get, it's mutual interest of course, but I don't kill em for getting into the copter. As I said if I get a pilot not able to fly (that's something I can't teach, I guess no one can but the person himself) I'll step outside and try something else. If I get poor gunner I'll just try to be as effective as I can.

What you said about someone hopeless yelling to be picked up, you are right, no obligation to serve as a taxi, and me either I don't pick him up, instead I'll try to seek somebody better.

If people are as good as Sloi is, maybe it's okay for them to fly solo, but it doesnt justify teamkilling. At least I, get really mad when being killed for the vehicle. I actually could spend the whole round retaliating

[Dairuka]

Re: The Truth Behind the Lack of Good Gunners

This is the last thing I'm going to say on the subject, since I know I've already gotten through to you.

Solo'ers do not equal Redliners, Teamkillers and Jerks in general. Those of you who consider them one in the same are the ones with the wrong way of thinking.

Everytime I've been redlined out of a gunner seat, it's so the pilot who just got me killed can pick up a clanmate of his so they can ride off into the sunset to die together. I suppose it's romantic in a way; Two homoerotic lovers doing anything they can to stay together right up until the very end. The USMC sure is getting soft to let them in it though.

[XmetallicaXguitarstX]

Re: The Truth Behind the Lack of Good Gunners

It seems like dairuka knows what he's talking about.


Also, if a pilot takes you for a run, and then you die.. or he goes back to the carrier/airfield... if he spams get out... well take a hint ffs.

You guys should NOT be using full 64 player servers, or even full 32 player servers to try to "learn" on. Find like a 25/32 or something like that. Chances are you will get the vehicle you want, and you will have no trouble finding people... why? Because since there aren't that many people they will all be getting into other vehicles so you will have things to kill.. just whatever you do, if you can't fly or gun in a chopper but want to learn, don't go into a packed server and take the chopper from someone that is waiting and could do alot better..

Most of the time rank DOES reflect someones abilities believe it or not.. Whenever I am with a gunner in a server specifically trying to get into a chopper, I will always see some corporal or someone get in, take off, and 20 seconds later he's back at the pad with an M95...

[pubnubs_suck]

Re: The Truth Behind the Lack of Good Gunners

i TK and redline nubs and i'm proud of it. now commence flaming, it entertains me.

[ACE_FIN1972]

Re: The Truth Behind the Lack of Good Gunners

...Solo'ers do not equal Redliners, Teamkillers and Jerks in general. Those of you who consider them one in the same are the ones with the wrong way of thinking...

Agree, lets put the end for our little debate, but I'm still wondering how one can solo in server full of gunner candidates without a teamkill...

Also, if a pilot takes you for a run, and then you die.. or he goes back to the carrier/airfield... if he spams get out... well take a hint ffs.

^^QFT!! Just wish there would be more people with a brain in the field.