The Truth About CAL

[Chodda]

Re: The Truth About CAL

Chodda added to "need to kill" list.

<3 my team, msq, won last night. 20ID vs. x6 was a great match too... best matches I've seen in awhile... twl really can't compete when it comes to the level of competition CAL introduces to the game, that’s why its so good. People cal CAL players hacks and say they use lame tactics... well that’s what happens when you get beat, not offense ;D you wouldn't call someone a cheap tactic player/hack unless they were owning you, now if that same person was in your pub clan or on your team, you'd love em wouldn't you?... basically a double edged sword.. Unfortunately a lot of self indulged people like to open their mouths, give CAL a bad rep... there’s actually a lot of good talent in CAL and a lot of good people. Pub players spend their time playing in servers working on their stats, CAL players work on strategies and practice for matches by scriming a lot... different people play the game differently, basically this thread is the clash of those two groups... unfortunately CAL would rape any pub team put together and a lot of people are upset over that fact =/

[jihadicus]

Re: The Truth About CAL

Guys, I just ate a Garden Chicken Salad with ranch dressing! It was delicious!

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Thanks,

[20ID]Ji-had
20ID Team Manager

[imported_Predator]

Re: The Truth About CAL

Elder you are right on except macros. Almost all top teams used those before 1.4 but not anymore.
PlaneWhore. I don't care how uber player you are. There must be a reason you are not on any good clan roster. You not good enough or (end) no one will tolerate your stupidity. Your ego is way too big for anyone to handle this.
I trust Elder about his story. I know what he can do in the air. He is legit and you are phony. He took you out with bomber and you pussed out to dogfight
him again.

You are quite wrong. The whole "OMG MACROS!!11!!" fad surfaced because CAL players figured out how to pronespam. This was when the player would bounce off of the ground moving to one side as they fired. The movement required very fast hand movements on the keyboard and a lot of practice refining the timing. It soon became assumed my the majority of pubbers that anyone who pronespammed was using macros which was most certainly not the case. Practically all CAL teams pronespamed, very few of them used macros.

[Dairuka]

Re: The Truth About CAL

Guys, I just ate a Garden Chicken Salad with ranch dressing! It was delicious!

Corporate Tool. :laugh:

[Nadokings]

Re: The Truth About CAL

most people in cal hack or use some tweaks(such as macros)

my friends clan leader got cought hacking in a cal match, he ran something that would show him the names of the enemies and he also ran aimbot, my friend left the clan of course and is making a new chopper only clan, Im joining him and well compete in TWL and kick *** the right way with no ****ing hacks or macros

Gee, some people like you really must know what there talking about because they have participated in cal before.
Ya bud you are completely wrong and stupid.
For the loosers and morons who have hacked in cal or who have thought of doing it, get caught, ratted out, or just simply get vac'd cuz there hacks suck.
I know over 60 people who are in cal right now.
In fact, my freind in RL just played his CAL-O match to get into CAL-IM for CS:S. this match was against the best CAL-O team in there conference called Hostile. People who actually try to do good and compete dont use hacks, i for one played several seasons in cal, several seasons in 1.6 and cs:s.

[imported_HisChadness]

Re: The Truth About CAL

Eh wrong ... you are only allowed unlocks on ranked servers. A clan-match server is by definition not ranked. Hence the rule no unlocks, because you dont have the option of using them anyways.

No, you are wrong. Unlocks were allowed in unranked servers up until patch 1.3 for BF2. When patch 1.3 was released unlocks were no longer available on unranked servers. As of the 1.4 patch, unlocks are once again available on unranked servers to those that have earned them. So please know what you are talking about before you try and refute my statement. Thanks.

Elder you are right on except macros. Almost all top teams used those before 1.4 but not anymore.

Is that all you do? I remember every single rant board we had on the 12v12 ladder with your bad team and every other bad team on that ladder. All you did was cry macros. Find something else to explain your below average abilities as a player and as a team.

[Chris_Redfield]

Re: The Truth About CAL

<3 my team, msq, won last night. 20ID vs. x6 was a great match too... best matches I've seen in awhile... twl really can't compete when it comes to the level of competition CAL introduces to the game, that’s why its so good. People cal CAL players hacks and say they use lame tactics... well that’s what happens when you get beat, not offense ;D you wouldn't call someone a cheap tactic player/hack unless they were owning you, now if that same person was in your pub clan or on your team, you'd love em wouldn't you?... basically a double edged sword.. Unfortunately a lot of self indulged people like to open their mouths, give CAL a bad rep... there’s actually a lot of good talent in CAL and a lot of good people. Pub players spend their time playing in servers working on their stats, CAL players work on strategies and practice for matches by scriming a lot... different people play the game differently, basically this thread is the clash of those two groups... unfortunately CAL would rape any pub team put together and a lot of people are upset over that fact =/

The thng is, nobody likes a bragger. Nobody likes a bad loser either, but they dont really hurt nobody elses rep other than themselves. What Ive found is, best of the best are actually modest people. And people who like to leech rep from those people, are the "proud to be CAL, not a pubnub" people.

Hell, I find it funny that those people even use the word "Pub nub" as they started out from the same spot.



Elder, something to analyze for you.

[Bungalow_Bill]

Re: The Truth About CAL

It is true that what separates CAL players from pubbers and top tier CAL teams from the lesser ones is teamwork and strategy, however you cannot have this teamwork without the people on your team first mastering their own individual skills. You have to be able to rely on people to have the talent to do what it is that the strat requires them to. Teamwork isn't just about making the best strats, it's about who can execute them the best due to their communication, coordination, and especially individual talent. A great strat is no help at all if the individual members on your team don't have the skill and talent to execute it properly.

My ultimate point being that overall this is a negative aspect to the gameplay. Map specific techniques have absolutely nothing to do with skill and everything to do with tedious. I'll give a specific example: On Sharqi Pennisula the single most powerful vehicle in terms of raw firepower is the Mi-28. However with a very simple pixel shoot (though admittedly more difficult that 99% of pixel shots) you can take the Mi-28 out 10 seconds in to the start of a round and keep it destroyed for the entire game simply by launching a TOW missile from the Hotel every minute or so. And how did these players learn to do this? Well they sat in Sharqi on a tiny locked server experimenting for hours. I find that sort of systematic dismantling of gameplay mechanics to be rather boring. I've always been of the opinion that these sort of exploits take away from the gameplay and take away from the overall enjoyment of competitive play. If it was simply about skill and teamwork it'd be much more interesting to me personally.

I do not doubt this for a minute. One of the myth's about CAL is that all CAL players are of equal skill level, people assume because they have beaten one person from CAL they could beat them all.

I can assure you I am not of that opinion. I have played against Team3d many times (of CounterStrike fame) among others and I am highly impressed with the skill of a select few members of certain clans while the vast majority aren't even a blip on my radar. The same can be said of more casual gamers. Casual is not synonymous with n00b. In fact some of the best players I've ever played with and against (both skill and teamwork wise) have had no clan affiliation whatsoever. I actually find these players to be much more adaptable and flexible when it comes to actual real gameplay.

You find the gameplay in CAL rather shallow? That's weird because I thought it was the exact opposite. When I go into a pub server, it's the same thing, every single time. There is never anything new and it's as if the battle is scripted, nothing ever changes, it's the same old boring crap. In CAL however there are always new tactics and strategies being made which can greatly alter the match and make it much more exciting.

You call it exiciting I call it tedious. Again launching a tank shell from across Zatar Wetlands at a particular pixel to destroy the Mig at the beginning of the round should not be confused as skill. When I play in a public server everything is varies. The quality and class makeup of my team varies, as does that of the enemies. My commander may be great and dropping me assets I need or maybe they're not so great and I've got to compensate for that. I cannot depend on any one factor other than myself and that's what makes that sort of gameplay interesting for me. I've got to rise to the challenge of supporting a crappy team or leading the charge to help a losing team retake critical flags and beat the enemy back. You just won't find that in CAL matches.

This is very untrue and based on mere speculation. In my experience very little players in CAL ever used macros and hacked.

Keep lying to yourself and maybe you'll start to believe it. Almost every single player in CAL uses these things to varying degrees. I'd guesstimate about 95% to CAL players (both O and M) use optimal video settings such as jacking lighting to low to make spotting players in shadows easier. That of course is only the tip of the iceberg and like it or not that sort of "competitive advantage" quickly spreads in to macroing utilities and other sorts of exploits and cheats. If they can get away with it, the majority of CAL players will cheat to gain the edge over their opponents. Look at the Olympics, it's a dirty little secret but nearly every single Olympic athlete uses undetectable steriods to varying degrees to gain and edge over the competition. Unlike CAL though cheating in the Olympics has real consquences and yet still people do it. The only CAL players that you can be assured don't cheat are those you are playing against in a *real* local LAN competition where they can't hide behind the internet.

I can tell you that I always see a lot more questionable and suspicious behaviour in pub servers and in TWL matches than I ever have in a CAL match,

And I can tell you I get accused of cheating every single day I play and yet I don't.

I find it extremely funny though that many pub players consider tactics like bunny hopping and dolphin diving cheap.

When did I ever say that? I'm all for these evasive maneuevers and it's one of the big reasons I dislike 2142 infantry combat. However a distinct line needs to be drawn between evasive maneuvers like DD and BHing and blatent gameplay exploitation of poor coding such such as hitbox manipulating through rapid prone/crouching (made even more powerful by the use of macros).

The only reason EA removed it last patch was because so many pubbers whined about it.

Removed what exactly? You can still do all of those things. You can still dolphin dive. You can still bunny hop. You can still drop to a prone and immediately stand without delay. The only thing you cannot do is rapidly spam crouch and prone to the same effect you could before the patch. Obviously you are behind the curve Elder but if you're arguing about the removal of the aforementioned then it just serves to highlight your stupidity.

Like I said before all the so called "cheap tactics" used in competition are used just as often in public servers. CAL players are simply the ones recognized doing it because they find them first and execute them the best.

Of course they're used in pubs. The primary difference being the drive to compete and win is so much stronger in ranked competitive play that is forces many to base their gameplay solely off this "cheap tactics". And no I don't include things like bunny hopping and dolphin diving. I'm talking about pixel shooting, I'm talking about using macros, I'm talking about cranking down your visual settings, I'm talking about spamming crouch while in a mounted gun/turret so you can shoot at your enemy but they can't shoot back at you. CAL should be about teamwork and player skill and while they do play an important part it's not nearly important enough and maybe of the cheap tactics mentioned above are often times far more important then being able to pull of that headshot 10 milliseconds faster than your opponent.

It isn't so much the fault of CAL at this point but the types of games they've choosed to play competitively. Counterstrike is a MUCH better game for real skill based competitive play. Quake 3 is a MUCH better game for real skill based competitive play. I could go on and on but this post is already far too long so I'll just stop while I'm ahead.

Planewhore seems to talk the talk quite a bit. BUt looking at his stats (stats dont mean everything but when you talk like Planewhore i'd think your stats would be stunning), he doesn't seem uber. Watching one of his MAshtuur tankwhoring videos, he just spawncamps a base to make his KDR rise. His jet KDR was probably done raping a certain large vehicle with a certain almost invincible vehicle. His rifle KDR is good, but Planewhore tell me you could rock:

http://www.bf2s.com/player/58338627/

http://www.bf2s.com/player/76782074/

http://www.bf2s.com/player/69665404/

Am I supposed to be impressed by IO whores who teamstack? Because I'm not. Even with all of that though I consider those statistics to be inferior to my own. I don't take rifle KDR as the ultimate benchmark of player skill. Truth be told I've never played for statistics though. My statistics are the product of normal gameplay. If I really wanted to I could get my rifle KDR to 7:1 simply by going on a small IO server, hanging back with a squad of medics and never putting myself in any dangerous situations. With how I play now almost all of my deaths while playing medic are the result of me playing on a 64 player server and charging up alone and pitting myself against 3 or 4 enemies at once. It's an easy way to die but it's a great way to have fun. Statistics have always been a poor benchmark for player skill because they are easy to influence by optimal circumstance and I stick by that statement. I'm proud to say though all of my statistics and gameplay have been under the most adverse circumstances and I wouldn't have it any other way because if I'm not being challenged I'm not having fun or being entertained.

[Chris_Redfield]

Re: The Truth About CAL

Clan scrims and competitive games are a whole different nature from public play. Elder is correct, every single public match is exactly the same as the last one. In fact, if I could, I would macro my jet for 30 seconds to perform a certain task on its own and I would get at least one kill. There is no comparision between a highly organized game and a public casual fragfest. The first of these two relies on strategy, tactics, exploiting scenery (and yes, pixel shooting is one thing, but Im talking about maneuvering the forces to your teams advantage).. And a very important aspect of strategy and tactics is utilizing the element of surprise.

Granted, there will be will be a pattern in every map for each team eventually. But because strategy can actually be utilized, there will always be surprises. One important aspect of creating strategy is the anticipated enemy movement.

Man I could go on. Public play and competitive play are two totally different things. But they serve totally different purposes. I have a little bro who is pretty good at CS1.6, and he has played it for 2 years. He has never thought about joining a clan, even though it should be the right time. He plays for fun, no obligations. He can quit and start whenever he wants and nobody will ever look at him with a wrong look. Same goes for me. I remember the fun scrims for a SWAT4 clan I was in, but I also remember the obligations. In fact I was the guy behind creating strategies and map opening moves, aswell as equipment and weaponry analyzation (sp?).

Just a sample of a simple strat for VIP mode.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v636/Member_of_STARS/f6c0989c.jpg

In BF2 I have only enjoyed a pack of good friends Ive met and casual squad level fragging with them. Lately, when I stopped playing BF2 and started doing research on competitive play, Ive started to think about joining a clan. Truth to be told, I may be OK in jets, but on ground my skill level would just be insufficient, so I would pass.

As for Battlefield 2 being bad for competitive play. No, its not. The sheer ammount of strategy that needs to be applied is what makes the game perfect for competitive play.

[Bungalow_Bill]

Re: The Truth About CAL

Elder you are right on except macros. Almost all top teams used those before 1.4 but not anymore.
PlaneWhore. I don't care how uber player you are. There must be a reason you are not on any good clan roster. You not good enough or (end) no one will tolerate your stupidity. Your ego is way too big for anyone to handle this.
I trust Elder about his story. I know what he can do in the air. He is legit and you are phony. He took you out with bomber and you pussed out to dogfight
him again.

The only reason I'm not in a BF2 clan rooster is I choose not to be. Battlefield 2 is a very poor game for competitive play but a great game to hop on for a few rounds a day and frag some people. If I really wanted to participate in competitive gameplay I can guarantee it WOULDN'T be in Battlefield 2 but rather a much more skillful game like CounterStrike or the multitude of other FPS that require much more skill. And like it or not Elder might say he has shot me down but yet he can't generate a single screenshot of this momentous occasion. I have shot him down multiple times.. would you like to see the screenshots? Fact is I have flown against Elder and many of the other supposedly elite CAL pilots and I have never been shot down. Colony is a better pilot than all of them and he's a pub nub! I enjoy challenging situations and while Elder is better than your average pub nub pilot he certainly isn't even close to being on my level as an aviator. Though I'd most certainly like to think now that they've dumbed down dogfighting with the 1.4 patch Elder would love the chance to get behind my F-35B with a J-10 and drop two missiles on me for a guaranteed kill.

[imported_HisChadness]

Re: The Truth About CAL

The only reason I'm not in a BF2 clan rooster is I choose not to be. Battlefield 2 is a very poor game for competitive play but a great game to hop on for a few rounds a day and frag some people. If I really wanted to participate in competitive gameplay I can guarantee it WOULDN'T be in Battlefield 2 but rather a much more skillful game like CounterStrike or the multitude of other FPS that require much more skill. And like it or not Elder might say he has shot me down but yet he can't generate a single screenshot of this momentous occasion. I have shot him down multiple times.. would you like to see the screenshots? Fact is I have flown against Elder and many of the other supposedly elite CAL pilots and I have never been shot down. Colony is a better pilot than all of them and he's a pub nub! I enjoy challenging situations and while Elder is better than your average pub nub pilot he certainly isn't even close to being on my level as an aviator. Though I'd most certainly like to think now that they've dumbed down dogfighting with the 1.4 patch Elder would love the chance to get behind my F-35B with a J-10 and drop two missiles on me for a guaranteed kill.

You must have the biggest ego for a pubber ever. Why don't you accept Elder's challenge for a 1v1 dog fight. Hell, I'm sure he'd be happy to dog fight you canons only. You throw all this garbage around like you are god's gift to BF2, when all you do is base rape pubbers in a jet or tank. The CAL community knows how good its pilots are and until you pull screen shots out of your ***, or you 1v1 Elder or someone on his level and show us the proof of you owning. The only thing you are doing is blowing smoke up everyones ***. Time to put your money where your mouth is, so to speak.

[Bungalow_Bill]

Re: The Truth About CAL

Why don't you accept Elder's challenge for a 1v1 dog fight.

What part of "I already shot down Elder multiple times with proof" don't you get?

[jihadicus]

Re: The Truth About CAL

Let's not forget that most competetive play doesn't use planes either.

[Jemme101]

Re: The Truth About CAL

What part of "I already shot down Elder multiple times with proof" don't you get?

Its the same part I think about were he keeps on pushing his unlocks on unranked servers thing. It is the part which also fails at logic and common knowledge.

[Skauboy]

Re: The Truth About CAL

It's amazing how much you know about CAL players in BF2 PlaneWhore. Especially since you have never competed in CAL. You can sit here and toss around the "macroing", "tweaking", "pixeling", and whatever else you would like. Once again as said in my previous post everyone is entitled to an opinion. However, don't be surprised that people that actually participate in CAL are arguing with your logic. Don't be surprised other people who haven't participated in CAL are agreeing and siding with CAL players.

I know with as much as you like to argue as I can see from these recent posts its hard to admit your wrong or may be wrong. Who likes to? The fact remains you are trying to give your ultimate knowledge on a topic you have no experience in and a league you have not competed in. It's like a baseball player trying to tell you that 95% of the football community uses steroids. Who cares what he has to say? He doesn't compete within that area. His opinion is his own but it holds no substance. Much like your opinion about CAL holds very little substance.

I have played in the BF series of CAL almost every season since the release of 42. I think I may have missed 2 in actual CAL but still competed elsewhere at the time. However, I still was an active part of the community and was still scrimming and gaming. I have never once used a macro, tweak, hack, or whatever else you would like to call it. I have pixeled if you consider that cheap and was one of the very first players to use it in a match situation.

However, the discipline needed to sit in a spot and shoot at a target and keep it down, and perhaps never getting a kill and just finishing 0-0 or even 0-3 if they come blow you up.............can be very rewarding. If your team wins because you had the discipline to do what is best for the team........ I'll take you over the guy who needs to be Rambo and have a high score. High scores mean nothing at the end of the game. You can go 25-2 in a match. If those tickets are not in your favor no one remembers what you did! Even if they are in your favor. The guy who went 2-2 but those two kills saved a cap on a crucial flag because he stayed where he was supposed to the whole round. He could be considered the hero.

This game is very team based and very individually talent based as well. You wouldn't ask your heli pilot to play an infantry map and sit your star infantry. People accel in different aspects of the game. You have to decide who to put where and who could handle a situation best. Should we leave our best infantry to defend the back flag? Is it worth it or can we put our #5 guy back there in a good spot and have him defend it? Do we really want to lose our advantage up front? Do we want to push with the tank or do we think they will be looking for that and go AT? Should we cause a diversion at one flag and get a squad set up on another? Who should we make the squad leader? Can they stay alive by themselves long enough until the other people spawn?

We ask questions that are based for the good of the team. You ask questions based on the good of yourself. Do "I" have to save a crappy team? Does my commander drop "me" assets? "I" can only depend on "myself." So next time you want to give an opinion based on a league of "team" gameplay make sure you are qualified to do so. Clearly with all the "I's" and "me's" its hard for people to respect your opinion on a team based league. Clearly you are entitled to it, but you may want to become a little more knowledgable in the area before you expect people to respect your opinion.