Altered scoring for vehicles

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  • Kattspya

    #1

    Altered scoring for vehicles

    There is alot of frustration in the BF2 community especially on this board but other places aswell. In fact there is gripe about unbalanced weapons on any game forum. However I believe that it's much worse in the BF2 community.

    Most team based games have gripe about one team being better than the other but this isn't really the case in BF2. Most of the gripe is against vehicles and in particular jet's. I suspect that most of this animosity is because vehicles gives you the chance to get the highest score on the server. Those who like to play on the ground feel like they are getting a bad deal because they can't match the points of a skilled tank driver or pilot. I wonder if this could be solved by altering the scoring fundamentally. It is much easier to get good points when in a vehicle than it is going on foot. This shouldn't be the case when individual scoring exists. One possible sollution is to use the mass of stats gathered to equalize the score between infantry and between vehicle classes.

    Say that on average a tank driver will get 25% more kills than an infantryman gets on average. If you then lowered the tanks points for killing an infantryman by 25% the average infantryman and the average tanker would get the same score. Then do this for all vehicles. This should enable skilled people whether on foot or in a vehicle to get a chance to the number one position. Without giving the advantage to vehicles. If you just can't stand being killed by a tank perhaps BF2 isn't the game for you. I hear SF has less vehicles. But if you're only ****ed because you cannot get a higher score than a helo with equivalent skill this should solve your problems.

    Another complaint is that jet's are only vulnerable to jet's and concentrate mostly on ground bombing which isn't their purpose (unless they are in bomber). It takes much more time to down a plane and is much harder than it is for the same plane to bomb the ground and get a higher score with less effort. This is true for many things such as being AT not paying off scorewise for most people. To kill a tank with Eryx or SRAAW takes more time than it takes to kill off a few people with the grenade launcher. This applys to more (most) classes and vehicles but you get the idea.

    My proposed sollution for this is to give jet's more points to down a plane. At least enough to make the dogfighting equal to ground bombing perhaps even weighted towards dogfighting. The same should apply to other cases such as AT getting extra points for offing a tank.

    I don't kid myself that this will ever happen to BF2 but it would be nice with some input. Can anyone find any reasonable objections to why this wouldn't work out?
  • shiremct

    #2
    Re: Altered scoring for vehicles

    I personally have no objections to such a system except that it would be very complicated. I agree that individual scoring should reflect the individual skill, not what vehicle the guy is in, but many BF2 players dont agree. There is a mentality among most BF2 messege boards that the guy in the tank or plane deserves to get better scores and more kills because a tank or plane should dominate infantry. I understand that in a real life matchup, an infantryman versus a jet or a tank is not the best of odds, but in an an online game, care has to be taken to leave everyone with fair odds. Weighting the score values of kills would actually be a nice way to do it, but unlikely to be implemented. By, for example, giving only one point per infantry kill in a jet rather than 2, the jet would still maintain its proper significance over the battle, but the pilot will not dominate the scoreboard simply because he got into the vehicle.

    Kills and deaths are not so much the complaint when it comes to this, its score. The difficulty of stopping a plane and its non-existant counters, etc are another argument. Everyone, no matter what role they play, idealy should be able to get roughly the same score for the same skill at their jobs, but I definitely would not hold your breath on seeing such a complicated system implemented... it would just be too much work and would change the game too much. BF3 maybe...

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    • Hu.Z_of_PLA

      #3
      Re: Altered scoring for vehicles

      I do not agree with such system. Tank combat is easy to learn but diffcult to master. I rountinely get more score with support kit on Karkand than tankers.

      what's needed is more reward for taking out vehicles.

      Comment

      • glaucoma

        #4
        Re: Altered scoring for vehicles

        The only two or three downsides that come to mind
        -A vehicle kill meaning more points, will mean even more frustration for those who have worn the vehicle down and then get nothing for it.
        -I don't quite see why the scoring as is should be altered at all. I find it fully okay that vehicles mean more points, as it requires the player to hone their skills handling the vehicle in question.
        -I have no objections to planes/choppers/tanks clearing the ground for me. True, when a skilled pilot/tankist is on the opposing team, it is annoying to be up against him, but I've never seen people complain when that skilled pilot/tankist is on their team enabling them to win with more ease.

        All in all, your thoughts have much merit, but I simply think one shouldn't cave in to demands of people who are ****ed they can't get the highest score.

        Comment

        • Grafisk

          #5
          Re: Altered scoring for vehicles

          People can still get more points than vehicles if they really try. Perhaps not against an experienced jet-pilot who gets like 100+ in score everytime, but who cares. It's not like the world ends because someone gets a higher score than you just because he's in a vehicle of some kind, right? :P It's enough that they removed the points for passengers...

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          • Kattspya

            #6
            Re: Altered scoring for vehicles

            Hu.Z_of_PLA: I said average. Tankers wouldn't get a lower score they would get an equal score. If you're still great in a tank you will beat the infantry anyway.

            Glaucoma:
            The first point is due to broken scoring anyway. Of course AT should get assist points.

            I don't agree that vehicles should get more points inherently. Being an infantryman and a helo pilot is two differant skill sets. The learning curve is a bit steeper in the helo but that doesn't mean you should get an advantage in individual scoring. The number of kills wouldn't be altered only the number of global points you earn from them.

            I haven't seen any complaints in game either. Perhaps all the whiners on totalbf2 boards only plays karkand. I can't understand where the jealousy comes from, If it isn't the score then what is it? The inability to kill someone? CS-players don't complain about having a hard time to take a M4 wielder out with a glock. What is the differance?

            It's not caving in IMO it's like giving all the different classes and vehicles different purposes. ATM if you want a higher score you have to frag en masse on karkand.

            Grafisk: If the infantryman has enormous luck or is much more skilled than the tanker/helo he could get a higher score. I have never seen it happen on any map but karkand.

            I don't really care about the infantry score, I'm in a helo almost all of the time. What I do care about is all the whiners that wants to turn BF into an infantry combat game and thinks that clicking left mouse when in a AA should negate hours of training.

            Comment

            • Kattspya

              #7
              Re: Altered scoring for vehicles

              I'm bumping my own thread. I should have come up with a better title like: Noob OMG leet or something like that.

              Comment

              • Twisted-

                #8
                Re: Altered scoring for vehicles

                When i take to the air in a fighter, i will only focus on taking out other jets/choppers for the whole round. The problem is as stated all jets being used against infantry because it's the easiest way to make large amount of points. What i would like to see is jets getting 1 point against infantry on the ground not in vehicles or maybe even no points. Maybe boost the points for taking out another jet/attack chopper, to incourage people to use the jets for air to air combat.

                Comment

                • Hu.Z_of_PLA

                  #9
                  Re: Altered scoring for vehicles

                  [quote=Kattspya]Hu.Z_of_PLA: I said average. Tankers wouldn't get a lower score they would get an equal score. If you're still great in a tank you will beat the infantry anyway.

                  no you wouldn't. Tank can't see as well as infantry.

                  Comment

                  • Badboris_uk

                    #10
                    Re: Altered scoring for vehicles

                    I think you should get:

                    2 points for killing a transport (they are squishy after all)
                    4 for armour
                    6 for jet or heli.
                    (only 2 more points for additional people in the same vehicle of course)

                    than all the planewhores would fight amongst themselves :)

                    Comment

                    • raceacontari

                      #11
                      Re: Altered scoring for vehicles

                      Sorry, do not agree. Vehicles are a part of the game, and there are plenty of ways to take them out (jets excluded, hope the patch makes it so you dont have to be a good pilot to take out other jets, I mean for real this time, not like last 1.03's supposed fix to AA).

                      Comment

                      • Kattspya

                        #12
                        Re: Altered scoring for vehicles

                        Originally posted by Hu.Z_of_PLA
                        Originally posted by Kattspya
                        Hu.Z_of_PLA: I said average. Tankers wouldn't get a lower score they would get an equal score. If you're still great in a tank you will beat the infantry anyway.
                        no you wouldn't. Tank can't see as well as infantry.
                        That isn't their only advantage. A few things come to mind like: armor, firepower and mobility.

                        Comment

                        • Kattspya

                          #13
                          Re: Altered scoring for vehicles

                          Originally posted by raceacontari
                          Sorry, do not agree. Vehicles are a part of the game, and there are plenty of ways to take them out (jets excluded, hope the patch makes it so you dont have to be a good pilot to take out other jets).
                          Are you telling me that an infantryman can get a greater score than say an attack helicopter? Just check the scorelist top ten and see if they are infantrymen or tankers.

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                          • alwo

                            #14
                            Re: Altered scoring for vehicles

                            The current system is fine...
                            Also, I play Wake Island the most and I've been getting Golds, Silvers, Bronze Medals quite frequently and I rarely use vehicles...

                            Comment

                            • SQUiB

                              #15
                              Re: Altered scoring for vehicles

                              Good ideas but like some others have said it's too complicated. All that really needs to be done is make players get enemy vehicle damage points like you get negative friendly vehicle damage points. That way people get rewarded for taking on vehicles and we would probably see more AT soldiers around.

                              Tanks and APCs aren't really that hard to take out (2 or 3 AT guys) but it seems like most players are content to ignore them and hope someone else destroys it. That is why they get such great scores on the city maps.

                              Jets are a completely different problem. They shouldn't get points for killing infantry but only for destroying other jets and ground vehicles and flag defense points. Obviously the number of points they get for these things would need to be increased a little but that shouldn't be too hard to do.

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