Engineers, AT Mines, and TK

[Donkey]

Ok, sooooooooo we all know its pretty damn obvious when a frinedly has laid out any explosive device. The big RED skull and crossbones come to mind, yet for some odd reason people just cant see this. Is it that tons of people have crapy monitors and lack the RED color?????

I just dont get it and it sucks to be an engy and lay out mines knowing that you are doing your team a service yet will be penalized for it. I however still lay out my mines, since its all for the team. Basically the current system in BF2 makes the engys "take one for the team".

Well I think there is a solution to this problem. I feel that EA/Dice should nerf the engy AT mine TK, much like they did with the commander and arty. Since we all know people just arent going to stop running them over. I feel that this would make the engy a more valuable player and reward him instead of penalize him for helping the team ward off enemy armor and transports.

What are your thoughts? Please discuss.

[tk471138]

Re: Engineers, AT Mines, and TK

ya thats a big issue i dont use mines as often as i would like becuase of this and im sure it turns some off to this class, however sometimes i do hit the hud toggle button and it turns off by accident but i never punish

[Tekkie]

Re: Engineers, AT Mines, and TK

They should remove TK punish entirely for friendly mines. If people are too blind, busy, ignorant, or stupid to not run over these, they should be forced to respawn anyways. If someone is exploiting it to TK... that's what a votekick is for.

[sabrefan]

Re: Engineers, AT Mines, and TK

Thankfully with patch 1.03, if the mines are placed within close proximity of each other, if one mine is set off, the explosion will detonate the remaining mines. I like the changes made for the mines, since I wont be getting mutiple tk's from team mates running over my mines one after the other, and trust me, its happened on a number occassions to me, and I always place my mines where it is clearly visible to friendlies.

As to the punish system regarding mines, I believe it's fine the way it is, since this will be one less weapon in a intentional tker's arsenal. Honestly what is gonna stop an intentional tker from throwing a mine atop a friendly tank, knowing full well that they can't be punished, and could repeat this tk method to their hearts content.

quick question: have you ever seen a vote passed?? :hmm:

[Tekkie]

Re: Engineers, AT Mines, and TK

quick question: have you ever seen a vote passed?? :hmm:

Good point. Usually a vote is passed when the person being voted didn't do anything. :|:

[ovhermit]

Re: Engineers, AT Mines, and TK

or when the commander is tk arty happy.

[fubars]

Re: Engineers, AT Mines, and TK

This is a real bug bear of mine I saw a noob watch an engineer lay some mines last night across a bridge it was easy to see you couldnt cross it but this noob tried anyway in a jeep & BANG no more noob or jeep, I dont mind so much my team mates running over my clearly marked mines but why punish me for it !!! Yes I have seen couple of votes passed.

[Sneaky Assassin]

Re: Engineers, AT Mines, and TK

I have a new role to blow up mines in my tank, that the engineer has just set, really annoys them, especially when they are still setting them up, blow mines and they get a suicide. Teach them to put mines in daft places so I can't pass

[JoeJJohnsonII]

Re: Engineers, AT Mines, and TK

Ok, sooooooooo we all know its pretty damn obvious when a frinedly has laid out any explosive device. The big RED skull and crossbones come to mind, yet for some odd reason people just cant see this. Is it that tons of people have crapy monitors and lack the RED color?????

Wait a minute here. You mean those big skull and crossbones arent power-ups? and after all this time. What else havent you told me?

Basically Ea is up the creak here. If they make it so mines dont tk or dont get punsihed, then it sets the game up for idiots to ruin the game. If they leave it the way it is, it makes it so idiots can ruin the game for engies. Imagine a guy laying mines all over your base and resupplying at a crate. You have a couple options 1) blow them up and hope a chain reaction doesnt blow up a bunch of other people (or your assests) 2) start a vote kick, to which the other team wont be voting yes because he is helping them win 3) dont use any armor or transport vehicles 4) shoot the guy and take the Tk. Now there could be other options, but I couldnt think of them. None of the options are rather pleasant.

Either way you put it, EA/Dice is going to have to really think about the problem and how to solve it. The only solution I have is to make it so you cant have two mines in any given area. Make it so when you lay a mine, the next one has to be far enough away to not damage the other. I would love to have the engie fixed, but I dont see it happening any time soon.

[F-1]

Re: Engineers, AT Mines, and TK

Actually it is the idiot who runs over the mine after seeing the red skull is the one who must be punished.

The engineer should not be punished for TK with a mine. However, those TKs must be counted for kicking purposes. So if you run a mine the engineer wont be punished, but if you kill five friends with the mines then you should be kicked. this way the engineers will play responsibly and the idiots wont run over the mines because they cannot satisfy their idiotic egos by punishing.

[I-AM-IRONMAN]

Re: Engineers, AT Mines, and TK

The reason some people dont see the skull and bones icon is that if they were to have switched off the "3D MAP" with the Left Alt key then the symbols for mines, ammo bags and medic kits all vanish along with the flag waypoints. For these players it apparantly increases realism ( :laugh: )but at the cost that they pi55 everyone off by running over mines, and worse, decide to punish!

I personally feel that the TKs should not count for death by either friendly AT mines or Claymores, as I have practically stopped using either due to the foolishness of other players.

The fact that Mines must be placed in the open so that friendlies can see them means that the enemy can see them too... what is the point- if they dont remove the tks and tk punishes for this then they may as well just remove the mines, to prevent new players learning the hard way not to bother with them.

[JoeJJohnsonII]

Re: Engineers, AT Mines, and TK

Actually it is the idiot who runs over the mine after seeing the red skull is the one who must be punished.

The engineer should not be punished for TK with a mine. However, those TKs must be counted for kicking purposes. So if you run a mine the engineer wont be punished, but if you kill five friends with the mines then you should be kicked. this way the engineers will play responsibly and the idiots wont run over the mines because they cannot satisfy their idiotic egos by punishing.

But the problem with that is they still can. He may not get points loss, but they can get him banned from the server. You get 5 guys to pile into an apc and find the guys mine. BOOM! Kicked! *laughter* and the idiots win again. If you make it so the guy who runs over the mine is punished, then you still have the problem of someone laying mines all over the place and across vital roadways. I still dont think there is a way to counter the idiots without ruining the game for legit players. Call me pessemistic, but thats just my experience.

[BigBadBob]

Re: Engineers, AT Mines, and TK

If i see a teammates (or enemy's) mines in front of me, i'll shoot them with my tank, or apc. Or if i'm on foot i'll toss a nade or grenade launcher on them.

[Praetorian145]

Re: Engineers, AT Mines, and TK

Nerf it, definately. Last night I was playing Clean Sweep and we (MEC) had been pushed back to a single flag. In a vein attempt to defend the one remaining based against an enemy that now controlled all the tanks except for 1 APC, I spawned as engineer and placed mines at both sides of the entry to the base, leaving a space in the middle large enough for buggies and the IFV to get out. 5 seconds later, a buggy drives right over one and I get a TK. An enemy buggy also drives over one and I get the kill. Then the IFV drives over the one remaining mine which was tucked right into the side of the road. I get punished for that one too. If I'm going to get two TKs for each kill, it just isnt worth it. My score by that point was hovering around 0 and enemy tanks were approaching with no mines left to finish them off. I usually dont play engineer unless Im in a tank and need the spanner, but last night just confirmed it for me. Unless you're in a tank, engineer is a useless class as it is, and I dont think that engineers should be constantly punished for other peoples' stupidity.

[Pilioka]

Re: Engineers, AT Mines, and TK

Same with claymores. Big red crossbones = DONT COME NEAR ME.

C'mon now. Toss a nade and the claymore is gone. Toss a nade and the AT mines are gone. Shoot the AT mines with a tank or APC and they're also gone. The only thing that could happen is people could intentionally TK. But as long as you get punished it doesn't matter.