I'm so sick of airpower ruining this game!

[Jungles]

Re: I'm so sick of airpower ruining this game!

I don't think airpower alone is ruining the game. Rather, it's the lack of counter-air.

Most of the games I've played have hinged on the skill of the pilots, especially jet pilots.

What is needed is a way to defeat or at least hinder enemy airpower, if your team is lacking skilled pilots. Fixed AA should have been strengthened and made more accurate for 1.03, instead of having their range and accuracy reduced. I used to be a pretty good at surface-to-air prior to the patch, but now I can't hit anything with them. The missiles will even miss hovering helicopters, despite missile lock, the target being in the centre of the view-finder, and no decoys.

[imported_The 13th Raptor]

Re: I'm so sick of airpower ruining this game!

At last! Someone with brains!

Boy did I get ****ed when someone did this to me, but it's nice to see someone who uses tactics and brains instead of whining to solve problems.
The thing is, I think people seem to forget what airpower is. If it's in the game it'll be the harshest weapon in it - period. If it is used well. It will be worse. You can not turn this vehical into yet another vehical - it is a fast moving jet in an open sky. People seem to think you don't need skills to excell in it. But this is of course rediculus. There is no wonder why the people who don't fly jets well whine about them - they know they can't use the thoughest weapon in the game, so they would prefer that no one else will be able to use it well. This will make them seem better players.

You know whan did I became a better pilot? In BFV I prefered to fly the choppers at first. But in order to get in one you'd have to perticipate in the most horrible TK fest. I hated that. And jets where much less wanted. They were harder to get points with in BFV. So I went local (you might say loco), and practice like crazy on the jets. I ditched my whinings aside.

Guys, I really think this whole thing is related to how you treat problems. Do you really think there are no creative ways for you to handle jets better?
I'm sure there are - What Malc said here is one of those ways. In a way, Malc does what the Israeli air force did in the 6 days war in 1967 - he destroyes the enemy's air force on the ground because he knows that in order to handle jets in the sky, you need a lot of air power, or that the casualties for you side in such a battle would be too much for you side to withstend.
So the Israeli air force knew he had much less jets to fight the war (they coudln't ask EA to make the "MEC" have less spwaning jets or better AA) - they practically destory ALL the air forces of Egypt, Jordan and Syria on the ground, as an intial attack in the 6 days war. The rest of the war was faught with only one air force in the sky, and you can imagine what that meant.

Just think of it - I know this is only a game, but tactics are the main strength of the BF series. Good tactics can solve problems you wouldn't believe are solvable. Try using the strength of the features DICE gave us. Hint: Team work.

Im sorry but.. hogging the commander toys and basecamping just to keep a pilot down, please..

[stormwolf]

Re: I'm so sick of airpower ruining this game!

Im sorry but.. hogging the commander toys and basecamping just to keep a pilot down, please..

Ok, so you're not that much of a team player.

People used to SpecOps the enemy assets without getting any score what so ever in order to help the team (I know it because I did that a quite a few times).

We come down to what I belived in the first place - you are ****ed others get more points then you using something you don't like, don't want or can't use with great effect as others.

Look man. Again, my point is a general one, and it is the one I think you should direct you energy into (quite true to real life in my opinion) - Try thinking of more tactics and creative ways to handle air power when you have trouble with it.
Asking DICE to change the code so the missiles will have better chance to hit your enemy, even though you'll be doing the exact same thing, has nothing to do with playing BF. If you really dig this game for it's team play and tactics, and you want to get better while playing it - think again what you could suggest or do differently. Malc only suggested one way (I have two others in mind, but I'll keep them to myself).
I am positive there are others. Think tactics instead of technical issues.

I am not objective because I love jets, but I do spend my time on the ground. I have to say that I really don't have any problem with the occisional ace pilots. Even after something close to 100 hours of game play on land, I encountred not that many great pilots that gave my team hell. I had more annoying enemy tank huggers, much more TK problems, and a great load of spwan campers - including the enemy pilots spwan raping which is a whole different issue! And I also encountered much more good ground forces then ace pilots (on land! not while I'm in the air).
So I get bombed once in a while from above. This is what planes are for.

[sT0nY]

Re: I'm so sick of airpower ruining this game!

Meh. I shot down 2 fighters, 2 blackhawks and a cobra in one round last night using AA.

The AA is fine. It's all about your timing.

i 80% know for sure your bull****ting now, come fight me lol i own your ass
i bet you cant hit with the AA for ****.. damn posts about about you have no proof

[inflatable]

Re: I'm so sick of airpower ruining this game!

AA is a bit better now after the 1.03 patch, but still not perfect though.. The most annoying thing is the random Tking it does.. I just love getting 2 or more TK's from a stray missle and offcourse get punished for it..

Imho they should remove the friendly AA-missle tracking completly so TK's are impossible with it..

[imported_The 13th Raptor]

Re: I'm so sick of airpower ruining this game!

Ok, so you're not that much of a team player.

Im a teamplayer, but as i said before no amount of teamplaying is going to help me downing planes, and im not the type of player that basecamps, there is no justification for it in my eyes. Besides.. mr SpecOps Commander wasnt teamplaying, he was just using the commander toys to keep 2 players or so from flying, thats not right, not right at all.

We come down to what I belived in the first place - you are ****ed others get more points then you using something you don't like, don't want or can't use with great effect as others.

Well, you believe wrong. The AA is bugged and crappy, therefor any decent pilot (not just "Aces") are pretty much untouchable once they get up there, unless you have a decent pilot on your own team willing to bother him. I couldnt care less about my score, im a fulltime Anti-tank player, if i cared about my points i'd be whoring the medic class/tanks like the rest.

Look man. Again, my point is a general one, and it is the one I think you should direct you energy into (quite true to real life in my opinion) - Try thinking of more tactics and creative ways to handle air power when you have trouble with it.
Asking DICE to change the code so the missiles will have better chance to hit your enemy, even though you'll be doing the exact same thing, has nothing to do with playing BF. If you really dig this game for it's team play and tactics, and you want to get better while playing it - think again what you could suggest or do differently. Malc only suggested one way (I have two others in mind, but I'll keep them to myself).
I am positive there are others. Think tactics instead of technical issues.

Buddy, listen to yourself. Where am i going to find teamplay on your average BF2 server? And why the hell should i have to use teamplay in order to shoot down a SINGLE enemy player? Every time a decent pilot takes to the sky? Thats absolute rubbish.

When i fire an AA missle at an enemy jet/helicopter, and he doesnt drop any flares, i should have a decent chance of hitting it, at this time, its not the case. Instead i have a big chance of getting minus points. Thats wrong, dont talk to me about using tactics and tricks to down enemy aircraft, thats what im currently doing.. against helicopters at least. But i shouldnt have to jump trough hoops (placing .50's in covered locations) in order to bring flyboys down to the ground. I dont have to in order to kill tanks, why should i have to for planes?.

So I get bombed once in a while from above. This is what planes are for.

Yeah, they are, but one should have a good chance of killing one.

[puglous]

Re: I'm so sick of airpower ruining this game!

Well, let me say its not just the balance that's the problem. It's what slight air advantage of one team changes a game into. There's no teamwork or tactics on either side that can change the course of the game, and the only way to avoid getting bombed by a jet is pure luck (and yes, I know you can get into AA to take down the jets, which, itself, is also pure luck). I admit a degree of skill and strategy can take down a heli IF it is capping flags. If it is attacking the main base trying to fight it off is like trying to fight off an artillery strike.

If you ask me they should take the repair/rearm feature away from airpower. Atleast then, if I damage an aircraft, it counts for something on my score.

[-=[CID]=- Texan]

Re: I'm so sick of airpower ruining this game!

The only air power that is unstopable are the jets. 2 well aimed and guided anti-armor missles will down an attack helicopter every time. The only ones who survive are the aces who manage to fly like spastics (wish i could do that). Blackhawks can take a lot more damage, but are really easy to hit. 2 PKMs work well on choppers as well.

I will say they could have made the linebackers missles a little more effective against jets. And the stinger emplacements are just a bad joke in my opinion.

My advice on surviving jets? Stay off the beaten path and don't use all your squad to take over a flag. Leave some for after the bombs:p

[imported_The 13th Raptor]

Re: I'm so sick of airpower ruining this game!

The only air power that is unstopable are the jets. 2 well aimed and guided anti-armor missles will down an attack helicopter every time. The only ones who survive are the aces who manage to fly like spastics (wish i could do that). Blackhawks can take a lot more damage, but are really easy to hit. 2 PKMs work well on choppers as well.

I will say they could have made the linebackers missles a little more effective against jets. And the stinger emplacements are just a bad joke in my opinion.

My advice on surviving jets? Stay off the beaten path and don't use all your squad to take over a flag. Leave some for after the bombs:p

Im not really bothered with attack helicopters on maps with cover and alot of transports around, on sharqi example i have become really good at taking their asses down. Its more problematic on a map like Wake.

[Donkey]

Re: I'm so sick of airpower ruining this game!

Im not really bothered with attack helicopters on maps with cover and alot of transports around, on sharqi example i have become really good at taking their asses down. Its more problematic on a map like Wake.

Yes but if you make it easier to take down planes you have made it even eaiser to take down helos.... before you know it there will be nothing flying in this game.... then the complaints about the armor and apcs will make it so the only thing left of use in the game is a jeep....

[The Question]

Re: I'm so sick of airpower ruining this game!

What was really funny was when I was the Chinese on Wake Island I flew over the enemy carrier and saw 6 guys waiting in the area for the cobra.

So I dode the carrier's AA guns and drop two bombs right in the cobra area killing all 6 of them lol. I was shocked I noticed it.

Oh and I have taken down a plane with the carrier AA rockets thingys. I shot all 8 at a plane and it got him.

[BurnTheWeed]

Re: I'm so sick of airpower ruining this game!

You know Desert Combat had the balance pretty well. The choppers could get killed pretty easily but that at the same time they were very deadly vehicles. This made it so that pilots had to do a good job of staying away from hostile areas while their gunners took out opposition. A good pilot could stay alive the entire round but it become very obvious very quickly who wasn't very good at flying.

[x2pixel]

Re: I'm so sick of airpower ruining this game!

I find the AA worse now after 1.03

I used to enjoy going AA, especially on gulf of Oman, oh happy days.

Sure I would get bombed out a fair few times by skilled pilots but I was able to kill them a fair few times aswell, and the choppers were great targets

but now the range is shortened so by the time you have a lock they will be gone. And the missiles seem to completely miss choppers much of the time now ????? what the hell is with that

[=HzC=Heinz]

Re: I'm so sick of airpower ruining this game!

the OP has a point. if the jets were removed only about 10-15% of the players would even miss them. not to mentioned the action on the ground would be better.

sounds like it would be a good thing.

[SupUnd]

Re: I'm so sick of airpower ruining this game!

I've killed planes with AA after the 1.03 patch. Once I killed 3 planes in a single round. It certainly is possible. In fact, it's easy with a little practice.

Here's the catch though. I got the plane because the pilot was gunning for me. He was charging straight for me and hitting me with everything he had. Before I died from his barriage I was able to shoot my missile and blow him out of the sky.

It's quite possible to destroy a plane if your timing is impecible and the situation is perfectly set up for you. The problem is, if a plane simply ignores you, there's nothing a ground unit can do to defeat a plane without going to the air.