Just had a brilliant Idea to stop TK for vehicles

[Sloi sauce]

Re: Just had a brilliant Idea to stop TK for vehicles

Although I appreciate the effort that went into your post, Lazza, a multi-level licensing system is clearly superior, cleaner and more easily implemented than what you have in mind with a pilot class. Once the initial planning, license requirements, courses and tests have been designed and mapped out, everything else comes easily without more conditions and programming.

I seriously hope someone at DICE is paying attention.

[Lazza66]

Re: Just had a brilliant Idea to stop TK for vehicles

Although I appreciate the effort that went into your post, Lazza, a multi-level licensing system is clearly superior, cleaner and more easily implemented than what you have in mind with a pilot class. Once the initial planning, license requirements, courses and tests have been designed and mapped out, everything else comes easily without more conditions and programming.

I just can't agree with any assets by rank (licensing) system. Why should someone who has whored an asset for 600 hours get preference over someone who is newish to the game and wants a go at it.

But having said that the licenses would be preferable to doing nothing about these problems.

I do agree that nubs in the best assets can cause the round to be lost, but with my "pilot class" system that wouldn't happen. Good pilots would go "oh ffs", and spawn as a pilot guaranteeing they get the jet next time, not the nub, but at least they both get a go.

When I see a good round go pear shaped it's always for the same reason. People join the server and immediately queue for their asset of choice. If they get it then others are left standing around or go and take someone elses asset. The team loses momentum and the round turns to chaos. Personally I NEVER join a server and go and queue for something that's already being used, I wait for the next round.

I seriously hope someone at DICE is paying attention.

Let us hope.

[Chris_Redfield]

Re: Just had a brilliant Idea to stop TK for vehicles

I just can't agree with any assets by rank (licensing) system. Why should someone who has whored an asset for 600 hours get preference over someone who is newish to the game and wants a go at it.

Actually, the whole point of a pilot licencing system is not to select out the 1337 and the nubs, but to make sure that the guy in an aircraft is capable of operating it well enough. Which means that once you get to grade A, thats it. Whether you have 600 hours or not is unimportant.

I do agree that nubs in the best assets can cause the round to be lost, but with my "pilot class" system that wouldn't happen. Good pilots would go "oh ffs", and spawn as a pilot guaranteeing they get the jet next time, not the nub, but at least they both get a go.

Pilots system is too random, random always give nubs a chance. Nubs need to practice.

[Sloi sauce]

Re: Just had a brilliant Idea to stop TK for vehicles

Actually, the whole point of a pilot licencing system is not to select out the 1337 and the nubs, but to make sure that the guy in an aircraft is capable of operating it well enough. Which means that once you get to grade A, thats it. Whether you have 600 hours or not is unimportant.

Pilots system is too random, random always give nubs a chance. Nubs need to practice.

Exactly, the licensing system has nothing to do with hours spent in a vehicle. There may be a correlation between time and skill, but that's entirely irrelevant with my system: you either pass the license levels or you don't. The game would work on a meritocratic system overnight...

No more BS, instantly.

[Sloi sauce]

Re: Just had a brilliant Idea to stop TK for vehicles

I mean, it would still be possible for an A or B-level player to get stuck with a D-level pilot or gunner, but generally speaking, it would always be the best man for the job. It's a lot better than what we currently experience. Random lotteries for the LOSE.

[[Expletive Deleted]]

Re: Just had a brilliant Idea to stop TK for vehicles

Since choppers are included in this, would the tests be online or offline? Because in single-player and LAN servers I very rarely miss with TVs. But I've been in servers with a ping of 20 and had every TV go right through the other choppers. Hell, I've even had it go through a few tanks, did you know you can see the driver's face in a tank?
So what happens when someone tears up the offline tests and looks like an ace, but never learns how to miss properly to compensate for pisspoor hit detection and netcode?

[Pixiecrap]

Re: Just had a brilliant Idea to stop TK for vehicles

i think this is a great idea, however the PR system does seem more logical... unfortuantely, PR hasnt worked for me for months now. cant figure out y

[Sloi sauce]

Re: Just had a brilliant Idea to stop TK for vehicles

Since choppers are included in this, would the tests be online or offline? Because in single-player and LAN servers I very rarely miss with TVs. But I've been in servers with a ping of 20 and had every TV go right through the other choppers. Hell, I've even had it go through a few tanks, did you know you can see the driver's face in a tank?
So what happens when someone tears up the offline tests and looks like an ace, but never learns how to miss properly to compensate for pisspoor hit detection and netcode?

It could be offline with lag simulation for all I care. I leave that up to DICE.

[waaah_wah]

Re: Just had a brilliant Idea to stop TK for vehicles

i think this is a great idea, however the PR system does seem more logical... unfortuantely, PR hasnt worked for me for months now. cant figure out y

Ask for help here: http://www.realitymod.com/forum/f27-...rdware-issues/

[Lazza66]

Re: Just had a brilliant Idea to stop TK for vehicles

Whatever the other merits of the licensing system are it doesn't address...

...too many idle players queuing for assets.
...tk's for assets.
...commanders in jets.

In my experience these are much bigger problems than inexperienced pilots.
If the license system uses levels it will not allow all players an even chance of getting the asset. And I can pretty much guarantee you now that DICE will not like that concept.

[Sloi sauce]

Re: Just had a brilliant Idea to stop TK for vehicles

Whatever the other merits of the licensing system are it doesn't address...

...too many idle players queuing for assets.
...tk's for assets.
...commanders in jets.

In my experience these are much bigger problems than inexperienced pilots.
If the license system uses levels it will not allow all players an even chance of getting the asset. And I can pretty much guarantee you now that DICE will not like that concept.

What you mention is easily dealt with.

Idle players for assets? Not when they realize their license level isn't adequate to enter the vehicles in question. They'll leave or perform other duties for their team.

Teamkilling? Many solutions have been offered in this thread. It can easily be combined with a licensing system.

Commanders in assets? DICE can program the position so that vehicles cannot be entered unless the player resigns his command.

All of this is easy as pie.

As for the meritocratic properties of a licensing system? What do you think LIFE is? The best students get their pick of the litter, the best job candidates get the offers and the best bachelors get the girls. It's already this way everywhere, so why get all butthurt when a game proposes a system to distribute assets among the most qualified applicants?

[SirCyRo]

Re: Just had a brilliant Idea to stop TK for vehicles

Geee, way to hijack my thread there Sloi.

Back to the original point of this thread. I seriously doubt my idea could or would ever be implemented in BF2. In the original post, last sentence, I say that it would be a great idea for BF3.

Sloi's idea (which should be it's own thread), harkens back to the original idea that ranks should mean more than just a simple title.

[Lazza66]

Re: Just had a brilliant Idea to stop TK for vehicles

What you mention is easily dealt with.

Idle players for assets? Not when they realize their license level isn't adequate to enter the vehicles in question. They'll leave or perform other duties for their team.

No, they'll just stand there waiting for the players with higher licenses to leave. For some spending whole rounds just standing there is not a problem, even as they see their team losing, still they just stand there.

Teamkilling? Many solutions have been offered in this thread. It can easily be combined with a licensing system.

Don't like them, the bubble idea allows players to be deliberately reckless with no comeback. What other exploits could this unveil? Glitching players into buildings etc. Also don't like the suggestion that planes can just push friendlies around, unrealistic and also open to exploits. Tards will be pushing teammates off the carriers into the water and all other manner of exploits. Other ideas of just having "no tk bubbles" around these assets are equally dodgy, someone could just keep C4ing friendly assets, destroying the assets but never getting tk's, and believe me there are a lot of people out there willing to spend hours doing just this sort of thing. These ideas just don't work, not to mention that they take the game further away from realism, when ideally shouldn't these solutions take the game closer to realism.

As for the meritocratic properties of a licensing system? What do you think LIFE is? The best students get their pick of the litter, the best job candidates get the offers and the best bachelors get the girls. It's already this way everywhere, so why get all butthurt when a game proposes a system to distribute assets among the most qualified applicants?

If the user of the asset is just so far above the rest as you're trying to suggest then they won't get destroyed in the asset and the argument is moot. One player should not get exclusive access to the jet for the whole round because he is the only one on the server with a level 4 license. Every player should have an equal chance of using any asset. Maybe one license level to enable use of a type of asset, but equal competition between all with the license. But no, there are still too many issues with queues, tk's, idle players etc. Idea is bad.

[Sloi sauce]

Re: Just had a brilliant Idea to stop TK for vehicles

No, they'll just stand there waiting for the players with higher licenses to leave. For some spending whole rounds just standing there is not a problem, even as they see their team losing, still they just stand there.

I think you'll agree with me that idlers are a minority, and therefore of little concern.

Don't like them, the bubble idea allows players to be deliberately reckless with no comeback. What other exploits could this unveil? Glitching players into buildings etc. Also don't like the suggestion that planes can just push friendlies around, unrealistic and also open to exploits. Tards will be pushing teammates off the carriers into the water and all other manner of exploits. Other ideas of just having "no tk bubbles" around these assets are equally dodgy, someone could just keep C4ing friendly assets, destroying the assets but never getting tk's, and believe me there are a lot of people out there willing to spend hours doing just this sort of thing. These ideas just don't work, not to mention that they take the game further away from realism, when ideally shouldn't these solutions take the game closer to realism.

Realism has never been a major selling point for Battlefield games. In any case, I invite you to enumerate a few additional options to curtail the use of teamkills in order to acquire vehicles.

If the user of the asset is just so far above the rest as you're trying to suggest then they won't get destroyed in the asset and the argument is moot. One player should not get exclusive access to the jet for the whole round because he is the only one on the server with a level 4 license. Every player should have an equal chance of using any asset. Maybe one license level to enable use of a type of asset, but equal competition between all with the license. But no, there are still too many issues with queues, tk's, idle players etc. Idea is bad.

You're making it sound like the top licensing levels would be unattainable to most players. Don't forget that we'd balance it so casual and dedicated gamers could reach it with a certain level of effort.

The idea is fine. You just refuse to accept it

[Lazza66]

Re: Just had a brilliant Idea to stop TK for vehicles

The idea is fine. You just refuse to accept it

Ah well, both our ideas are there for DICE to ignore.