What's wrong with BF2? Nata :P

[Consultant01]

Re: What's wrong with BF2? Nata :P

BF1942 was the purest of gameplay thus far in the BF epidemic. The planes were fielded en-masse, the tanks as well, the AA was player-driven (no locking missles, no countermeasures... if the guy in the AA gun could aim and lead properly he generally won the encounter. The dogfights were REAL dogfights and most of the planes were comparable... guns only, no silly missles.

I take back what I said before, I wish BF3 was another WW2 game. Slow evenly matched planes, AA that worked reliably... medics could heal but not magically revive...

I miss BF1942. Come on Forgotten Hope 2!!

[imported_Sim]

Re: What's wrong with BF2? Nata :P

I agree BF2 is a fun game but 1.3 has really screwed it up.
The game is pretty easy but theres still some major issues with it, the netcoding and other issues need to be fixed.

Just think what this game would be like if the fast moving vehicle bug was fixed, i'm sure the J-10 would be shot down more if it was and people wouldn't be road kill as much lol.

How long till BF3 comes out :laugh:

[markan dorka]

Re: What's wrong with BF2? Nata :P

I don't think BF2 itself is especially easy .. but since there's no nicer way to say this, I'll just puke it out : Vast majority of BF2 players are just plain bad, when it comes to playing first-person shooters. BF2 has gathered lots and lots of players that are entirely new to fps:s, or relatively new. Or ones who actually have played a bit longer, but have played some same limited game over and over with same people, which hasn't taught them anything new for last 2 years.

I'm not complaining, you have to start somewhere. But seriously, I've noticed that I don't often do good because I'm good (I'm really not), but because everybody else sucks.

And, I don't think stats really promote any selfishness or bad behavior. Internet does.

[Chris_Redfield]

Re: What's wrong with BF2? Nata :P

I don't think BF2 itself is especially easy .. but since there's no nicer way to say this, I'll just puke it out : Vast majority of BF2 players are just plain bad, when it comes to playing first-person shooters. BF2 has gathered lots and lots of players that are entirely new to fps:s, or relatively new. Or ones who actually have played a bit longer, but have played some same limited game over and over with same people, which hasn't taught them anything new for last 2 years.

I'm not complaining, you have to start somewhere. But seriously, I've noticed that I don't often do good because I'm good (I'm really not), but because everybody else sucks.

And, I don't think stats really promote any selfishness or bad behavior. Internet does.

I wouldnt say that.

I come from SWAT4. I have NO problem going 4:1 KDR in public server. Ive got a couple of rounds with 30+ kills and 0 deaths. Were talking about a game where random cone of fire engages when you shoot more than 1 bullet and you generally die with 1-2 rounds. Getting killed in SWAT4 is WAY easier than BF2. The issue with BF2 is that people dont know what to do, and this is why you think they dont know how to play.

Set a CS player into BF2 and he cant do much there.

And stats DO promote selfish and bad behaviour. Stats and the lack of team-level objective that in the same time is personal. CTF to this date is by FAR the best team-objective game. Conquest in BF2 is nothing but TDM with a fancy name.

As for OP. Agreed mostly.

[imported_yehaaa7]

Re: What's wrong with BF2? Nata :P

good thread! now i hope ppl understand... sticky this thread

[markan dorka]

Re: What's wrong with BF2? Nata :P

I wouldnt say that.

I come from SWAT4. I have NO problem going 4:1 KDR in public server. Ive got a couple of rounds with 30+ kills and 0 deaths. Were talking about a game where random cone of fire engages when you shoot more than 1 bullet and you generally die with 1-2 rounds. Getting killed in SWAT4 is WAY easier than BF2. The issue with BF2 is that people dont know what to do, and this is why you think they dont know how to play.

Well, not knowing what to do pretty much equals to not knowing how to play.

It doesn't really matter if you require 1-2 shots to get killed, or 10. When you're experienced, you know how to put yourself into advantageous position - maximize your chances to kill your opponent, and minimize the chances of him taking you out. Different games require a bit different approach to those situations, but principles are the same, and you learn quirks of each engine rather fast. Playing different games teach you lots of stuff applicable to other games, such as using keyboard and mouse in unison (you may take it for granted, but lots of people have trouble with it in beginning), knowing what your enemy will do, taking right routes, listening to sounds, making educated guesses based on previous experiences and so on. In my experience, lots and lots of BF2 players lack some or most of that knowledge, which I'd say is just matter of inexperience in playing first person shooters.

Set a CS player into BF2 and he cant do much there.

Well, CS players come in tons of shapes and flavors. Of course, if player plays BF2 exactly as if he'd play CS, he's going to get destroyed, but that goes for ALL the games, unless they're carbon copies :P .. but playing first-person shooters often requires adapting to different situations - experienced player (regardless of game) should know how to adapt, and know how to adapt to different game mechanics.

Then again, all this is a bit irrelevant, since it's pretty much impossible to prove. I'm just trying to say, that I feel that BF2 has reached way wider audience (and not just first-person shooter audience), making the average amount of experience in a given server much smaller, than you'd get in some other game, which is marketed and distributed to people who are familiar to first-person shooters.

And stats DO promote selfish and bad behaviour. Stats and the lack of team-level objective that in the same time is personal. CTF to this date is by FAR the best team-objective game. Conquest in BF2 is nothing but TDM with a fancy name.

Well, TDM is very team-oriented mode, if players actually do play as a team (duh). They just don't, because people play for their own enjoyment first, and they don't care for other players, mostly because they don't know them.. And it's much harder to get kicks out of shared victory with strangers, than with friends, so it's not necessarily worth of going for it.

If you know personally some guy, you don't act like a jackass to him, and you might actually do stuff in game for his enjoyment as well. In online play, most of the other players are faceless, just nicks and names. I personally don't care at all how they feel (even though I don't act like an as**ole in purpose, I don't get anything out of it. If I did, I probably would), because whole nature of internet detaches me from the real people on the other side.

How many times some random guy has told you to go **** yourself in game ? How many times it has happened in real-life ? Stats or no stats, there's going to be huge amount of jackasses (whether it's bad language, griefing or just otherwise selfish behavior), as long as they don't risk of getting told off, ridiculed or beat up in real life.

This happens in EVERY game. Sometimes people just ignore it on purpose, or will exaggerate it for some strange reasons. CS gets lots of bad rep for assholes playing it - some people say that some other game has way more mature and nicer scene .. but to outsider, experience is pretty much the same, regardless of which game he chooses.

[WolfAlmighty]

Re: What's wrong with BF2? Nata :P

Regarding claymores being 'easy' now, the reason they are the way they are is because of whiners and morons. You used to have to place them strategically instead of right in the middle of a busy section of the map, but the people that placed them poorly were whiners, and the people that ran into clays out in the toolies that were covering a sniper despite the big red skull warning were morons. Neither side liked it the way it was. So these people were elated to have FF-off indestructible claymores. Now snipers can get twice as many kills (if not more) than they do deaths without ever actually drawing a gun simply by spawning and spamming. Moreover, idiot teammates love it because it's that much less that they have to pay attention to. Red skull? Who cares! I can charge straight through it without so much as a scratch. Quite possibly nothing irritates me more gameplay-wise than seeing a sniper spawn in the middle of a base that's being taken over (while both enemies and friendlies are fighting for it), immediately switching to claymores, then charging head first into the fracus, knowing that they'll die but they'll still get some cheap kills out of it with no consequences. But then again, I rarely see this sort of behaviour outside of Karkand which is why...

Karkand 24/7 players should be given their own separate game instead of having everyone else's BF2 cheapened, n00bified, and dumbed-down just because something may be preventing them from whoring points faster on Karkand. Just look at the nerfs this game has had and how many of them have originated because of 24/7 Karkand whores or people who start off a whine thread with 'So I was playing Karkand...' Stand/crouch/prone delay? Caused by Karkandites who use macros to abuse hitbox lag. I've yet to see this happen in any of my time on Kubra or OCS. Jump/shoot removal? Because of people who whined about bunnyhoppers on Karkand now we can no longer hop over some barrels and take a pot shot at that APC near the Fish Factory on Songhua and instead must either jump up on TOP of the barrels, wait ~2 seconds for our feet to settle, THEN shoot, by which time the APC has plenty of time to smear us. And as well, this latest patch, 1.4, has been delayed FAR too long. I go through roughly 3 server crashes every day I try to play, on different servers, and that's not including hard freezes and CTDs which didn't even exist pre-1.3, and there should have been a serverside patch (at least) to un-foul up whatever DICE fouled up with 1.3 within a few weeks of these problems showing up, but instead we get a delay because they need to spend time tweaking IO mode to make it perfect for, you guessed it, 24/7 Karkand junkies who hate having to deal with big nasty tanks and APCs preventing them from getting points faster or not being able to kill EVERYTHING with the medic or sniper kit. THAT'S the kind of crap that gets me irritated. Everytime I see the 'There is a problem with your connection.' message or I wait 2 minutes to join a game only to have the screen blink and all of a sudden I'm staring at the 'My Computer' icon in the corner of the screen I give the virtual middle finger to the people that make the game and, therefore, the devs focus on everything to do with pointspointspoints and dumbing the game down.

</rant>

~Wolfgang

[Tobacco]

Re: What's wrong with BF2? Nata :P

No offence of course, but coming from a player who mostly plays one class, I find this hard to swallow. Many of the examples about armour you use can easily be countered by the AT Kit. Claymores can be defused by engineers, so they aren't always a problem, but without an engineer somebody has to sacrifice themselves(only to be revived) in order for the Squad to proceed.

IF the game has become to easy it is because Dice/EA have made many unnecessary changes, or lack there of ie Balance the Jets.

If you want a challenge, use a different Kit, because you seem to have exhausted the Sniper Kit, based on your opinions of BF2.

[Darkfysh]

Re: What's wrong with BF2? Nata :P

Actually, in a tank (i.e. a vehicle) you have several disadvantages:

-Your view is small, so you have little situational awareness.
-Explosives can be stuck to you and detonated much later.
(your only chance of survival is to hunt down the person who did so,
which can be very difficult. See below.)
-You are unable to fit into tight spaces, so your movement is limited.

These are just a few of this disadvantages of being in one of the vehicles, the tank.

[Zer0ed-In]

Re: What's wrong with BF2? Nata :P

You'd be surprised the amount of impulsive behaviour you are succumbed to when you sleep for 2 hours a day. This was a brief 8 minutes... a mere fluke compared to the last time I had an urge to build a robot that responds voice commands via PC.

LMAO..... I wanna see some blueprints for the robot

[CyberPitz]

Re: What's wrong with BF2? Nata :P

I'm a CS player. I played CS from Beta 1 up until the release of BF2. I quit CS *got frustrated with it too much, got boring..yeah, burnt out* and switched to BF2 *Though I played some Natural Selection along the way...that's in no way connected to BF2 at all, thus it doesn't help the shift.*

I like to think I didn't do any of the BS that people spew about "newbish CS players" I thought of myself as a skilled CS player..but that had nothing to do with BF2, why people keep compairing the 2 is silly..it's like compairing an apple to an orange.

On Topic: I do agree completely with the thread. That's how I've been feeling all along. If I truely hated this game, I wouldn't have my 400 hours logged. I would not have bought Special Forces...wait a second, I bought it, played it for 4 hours, and havn't touched it since, DOH..that's a game I hate. :P This game is really good, it's just people like to complain about everything..if there was nothing to complain about, they would find something to..it's just the way of the world sadly.

[redrider]

Re: What's wrong with BF2? Nata :P

I would like to reply and keep it short [Mysis] Spetnaz (hope I spelled it right) I agree with you. Its just that simple. Unusual for it to be that simple for me. . . . . . . .Red

[troybob]

Re: What's wrong with BF2? Nata :P

[*]Choppers hover on their own.

preach on brotha!

anyone who's played DC knows that BF2 falls way short in the area of gameplay and excitability.

[Swanston]

Re: What's wrong with BF2? Nata :P

preach on brotha!

anyone who's played DC knows that BF2 falls way short in the area of gameplay and excitability.

Yes... Yes it does ...:cry:.

As for the original post, the problem to BF2 was like a splinter in my mind, not sure exactly what it was but I knew this game could be great and fantastic with simple changes. Spetznas just put his finger on it, its so basic.

[Roger Smith]

Re: What's wrong with BF2? Nata :P

The game has simply became way, way, way too easy.

easy, well, i would say noob friendly, and vet hard, meaning the learning curve isnt steep enough. you dont have enough opertunities to survive and win, and general infantry/armored combat doesnt really reward quality players (well more than other games though) for instance, the accuracy degredation and boost for moving vs being static isnt a whole lot different, and theres no prone fire delay, why ever not prone in a gun fight? my point is that the arcade arena style gameplay infiltrates too many parts of the game, realism has its limitations, but i think bf2 can go further.

Tactical maneuvers are pointless (UAV, Scan, Commander view).

i think this could be fixed while maintaining commander functionality if people in buildings and if possible, static snipers in vegitation, simply didnt show up on commander assets.

Moving together with clanmates in formation is pointless (Artillery, Nades, Clays).

arty should be more like bf viet/poe2, static arty is cool, but i wanna see palidans and stuff, the thing is, there should always be a threat of arty, but it should have to be spotted and targeted. as for clays, make um destructable, read my explosives thread on my sig. as for nades, i think everyone should get two except for assault which gets his 5, and i also think they should recharge much slower.

it ends up with a single tank rolling into a flag zone with a couple infantry and maybe another tank there too. If lucky, you get a fairly decent fight -- but usually it's a few shots and a flag cap.

this is a lack of teamwork, which is partly due to a lack of info (check my gui thread) basically big squads come rushing in and the only person on your team defending or cutting them off is yourself, thats because people have an assault mindstate, they dont even think about combat support or defence.

Choppers hover on their own.

wtf? do they? operation flashpoint had that feature and it was a great game.

Objectives are little dots in front of your yes.

i dont get it? as opposed to...

Clicking enemy spotted on a blank area reveals the enemy.

ya i hate that too. whats worse is that when you spot and nobodys there, it goes question mark, and since spotting doesnt work right anymore, you just end up with alot of "enemy spotted". spotting has got progressivly worse from version to version, i dont mind that spots disapear when they go out of range, i do mind that i have to stop to spot, that most of the time it wont spot, that sometimes the spot is a squadmates color, and that if two tanks are close, you will probobly be able to only spot one.

Little drones flying the air expose the enemy the entire round, only stopping for a few second intervals to recharge.

i think a cool way to fix this would actually be if the uav was a commander controled vehicle, with no rotation nor pitch. that way the commander would actually have to spot all the targets (it wouldnt say enemy spotted)

Vehicles are the equivalent of an infantry soldier with 10x armor, 10x power and 10x speed. No disadvantages whatsoever. It's illogical.

theres definite disadvatages, but you bring up a good point, the balance is off in many cases

Aircraft are now supersonic airborne cheetas, which pretty much takes BF1942 and makes the aircraft 10x faster... nothing more. They dont retain any modern day advantages other than speed.

agreed, although the balance is off in thier favor aswell.

Players do not have the ability to distinguish themselves.

in cases like the j10 with massive inbalances they do, and in a tank they do, but as an infantryman, you are pretty much subjected to the inadeqencies of your weapons

As a pilot, you're restricted... you can't do any cool tricks. There's no avoiding certain things.

aa needs to be fixed and air to ground combat needs to be balanced

People complain because there is *nothing* they can do to avoid certain things.

yeap and ther should be