PhysX in battlefield

[Living Ghost]

Re: PhysX in battlefield

After 23 years writting video games for some top companies I should think I do understand a few things.

It is very possible Dice have had the dev kits of the Ageia card for a long time. ABout 2 years ago they approached companies. Most companies have had the sdk's for at least a year.

So it is very possible it could be in the engine used in 2124.

So incorperate the sdk into an existing engine is not a great deal of work. It is to add it to a released game hence BF2 will not have it but even if 2124 was 60% done to add it now would not be a majoy problem.

DO YOU UNDERSTAND?

Do you work with DICE Sweden? Canada?

If you don't, don't say anything you don't know.

Look at the support they already supplied: Practically NOTHING.

The engine can't support it, and even if it could, they are too busy working on booster packs and the like to bother.

Seriously, if you honestly have so much hope for DICE, I am amazed.

You should have learned from BFV...

IT'S NOT POSSIBLE, EVEN IF IT WAS, THEY WOULDN'T WASTE THEIR TIME.

You also have to take into consideration people with lower end rigs. You sound like this, "F them, my computer can handle it. Too bad for them."

You also do realize that you don't gain a lot from having 2 cards, right?

Unless you are gaming at something like 1900x1200...And if you are, I hate you very much. :P

[Revoluti0n]

Re: PhysX in battlefield

If that were the case, everyone would have to have a $2000+ rig just to run the game properly. I dont think game developers want to create a product that the majority of their customers would not be able to afford to run. They still want you to cough up another $10 for a booster pack that no one will play like EuroForces.

I'm willing to bet that the individual cards (PCI) will crap out within a year. Instead I believe that ASUS, MSI, ABIT, DFI, etc. will incorporate an additional chipset on the motherboard itself.

[SyDuS]

Re: PhysX in battlefield

After 23 years writting video games for some top companies I should think I do understand a few things.

It is very possible Dice have had the dev kits of the Ageia card for a long time. ABout 2 years ago they approached companies. Most companies have had the sdk's for at least a year.

So it is very possible it could be in the engine used in 2124.

So incorperate the sdk into an existing engine is not a great deal of work. It is to add it to a released game hence BF2 will not have it but even if 2124 was 60% done to add it now would not be a majoy problem.

DO YOU UNDERSTAND?

you have mispelled writing more times than i can count and please explain to me how you are running dual x1900s since as far as i know only geforce 6800+ can run in SLI mode. but wait you have been writing software for 23 years but can't even put a simple sentence together so u must know all

[imported_rancid_elf]

Re: PhysX in battlefield

you have mispelled writing more times than i can count and please explain to me how you are running dual x1900s since as far as i know only geforce 6800+ can run in SLI mode. but wait you have been writing software for 23 years but can't even put a simple sentence together so u must know all

Ok.. I am running dual ATI x1900's on a crossfire mother board. That is the ati equivalent to the Sli.

As for putting a sentance together, well I never claimed to be great at english, I am just good at maths which is what I use more in programming.

To answer a few questions from others...

As for high end and low end rigs, it has always been like that. There is always a top end and bottom end. I am not saying F U to those who dont have a high end PC. I love new technology and I love messing about with software for it.

Somone said I am mad for buying a card now. Well luckily I can afford it because of my job and secondly I will have fun playing with the sdk for it and creating my own stuff on it. I do not just use computers for playing games but as I said writting them as well.

I am sorry this thread has turned out like this. I just wanted to see peoples views on PPU's and spread the excitment that I felt knowing that gaming has just entered a new age...OF PPU's

[Skwurl]

Re: PhysX in battlefield

Well this post is a bit of WISH full thinking that Dice might actually consider using the Ageia PhysX hardware in the new battlefield 2024.

It would be nice if they added it into the current engine ready for a future patch but im sure thats not goin gto happen

I purchased the card on release last week and man its a nice maths co-proccessor.

Think about what could be done in battlefield with it...as long as you have good video cards ( I have 2 x1900's so im ok ) then think about things like firing the tank at a building wall and you see bits flying off it everywhere.
Or shooting at a fence and it shatters properly.

The possibilities are endless :) Cant wait to see this hardware in action in new games :)

Don't count on it. It's the same engine (with some added HDR bloom), which means it will still be using the software driven soft bodies.

[imported_rancid_elf]

Re: PhysX in battlefield

Don't count on it. It's the same engine (with some added HDR bloom), which means it will still be using the software driven soft bodies.

But to modify a software physics engine to use a hardware one ( when you have been given an sdk for it ) is not much work. So for someone like Dice to incorperate the sdk from Ageia into their own engine is not a big deal.

Its not like they have to touch the renderering pipeline or anything.


One last note though...I will not be keeping the card in my games machine until I have my water cooling in it ( another week or so before its delivered ) Any those of you who have seen the Asus motherboard I have will know that you only really get 2 available pci slots.

The PCI-e slots have been seperated with 1 PCI between them This creates a lot of heat. The water cooling blocks will remove those huge heatsinks and fans on the x1900's and give more space for air cooling on the Ageia chipset.

[Skwurl]

Re: PhysX in battlefield

But to modify a software physics engine to use a hardware one ( when you have been given an sdk for it ) is not much work. So for someone like Dice to incorperate the sdk from Ageia into their own engine is not a big deal.

Its not like they have to touch the renderering pipeline or anything.

Well, 'not much work' is kinda a relative term. Programmers will still have to modify the engine to make it functional. At the end of the day, DiCE probably doesn't see the benefit of enabling the PPU option for a small minority of gamers.

It just isn't mainstream enough yet.

No doubt it would be cool, but I would rather have the development resources focus on optimizing the current engine with HDR.

[imported_rancid_elf]

Re: PhysX in battlefield

Well, 'not much work' is kinda a relative term. Programmers will still have to modify the engine to make it functional. At the end of the day, DiCE probably doesn't see the benefit of enabling the PPU option for a small minority of gamers.

It just isn't mainstream enough yet.

No doubt it would be cool, but I would rather have the development resources focus on optimizing the current engine with HDR.

Games companies do not work like that.

When you have base libraries everything builds from that. For example they have the rendering libraries, the sound librarues, the physics libraries.

Those libraries will be constantly updated and improved for future games. No company starts from scratch for each game.

At some point Dice will incorperate into their base code a library for PPU's and there is no reason not to already have done that.

There are currently over 100 companies liscenced teh sdk's from Ageia and most of those will have started on the development for this to incorperate into a current project or a future one.

Look at the unreal 3 engine. Its in there which means a lot of companies who have already liscenced that engine will already be doing stuff for PPU's in the games.

[[2bit]Modmaven]

Re: PhysX in battlefield

Interesting reading this....Seems like to me, to be able to do some of the things mentioned, like taking down the crane, the object has to have AI built in. In other words, the object has to have the intelligence to know what to do when nailed by a tank shell. This intelligence, of course, places higher strain on the CPU and the GPU, while the CPU decides what needs to happen (shards everywhere or whatever), and the GPU then renders and spits out what it looks like to you.

This kind of intelligence built into every object is where the physics chip will help out immensely. The calculations and so forth needed to figure out where every piece of glass needs to go when you break the window in game, will be done by the physics chip. This frees up the CPU and GPU to do what they need to do. All in all, this new chip should alllow game developers many more intelligent objects to be added, making more and more things destructible and movable.

[Skwurl]

Re: PhysX in battlefield

Games companies do not work like that.

When you have base libraries everything builds from that. For example they have the rendering libraries, the sound librarues, the physics libraries.

Those libraries will be constantly updated and improved for future games. No company starts from scratch for each game.

At some point Dice will incorperate into their base code a library for PPU's and there is no reason not to already have done that.

There are currently over 100 companies liscenced teh sdk's from Ageia and most of those will have started on the development for this to incorperate into a current project or a future one.

Look at the unreal 3 engine. Its in there which means a lot of companies who have already liscenced that engine will already be doing stuff for PPU's in the games.

Where the hell did I say that DiCE would be creating the game engine from scratch? Of course they're going to use the old libraries they have - what I'm saying is that they're probably not going to implement the PPU code for a minority of players that have the supporting hardware.

Instead, they're going to focus their resources on modifying the BF2 engine to implement HDR - something that a good chunk of gamers will benefit from.

And yes, developers do work like that.

[SciFiMan]

Re: PhysX in battlefield

Yes, I've already said that the server side will need need the card too. They have the SDK so you don't have to worry about it. I'm sure the programers can read the manual and include what's needed. The server admins will install the card and driver for us if they wish to support it. According to you, I can save $300 buy not buying the card at all, and I'll get all of the benefit because the client side doesn't do anything. Good to know I will only need a PPU for playing single player mode.

Anyone here trying GRAW and have a PhysX card? If that's a multiplayer game, could you please post how it works with and without the card installed?

game-play related calculations _MUST_NOT_ be done by the client. They need to be done by the server to ensure that everyone sees the same thing. You may pretty up your falling crane but in the end everyone needs to see the same thing. In order to stick with your barrel example:
You are walking next to the barrel and suddenly it blows up, your shiny new PPU creates a lot of dust and debris and parts of the former drum fling left and right - you can see squad ... but those effects are damn cool to watch, right?
Now ... I dont have that fancy PPU and all I see is a little *poof*, a jumping barrel and a disoriented SciFiMan - guess who dies in the next scene?

[SciFiMan]

Re: PhysX in battlefield

Yes, I've already said that the server side will need need the card too. They have the SDK so you don't have to worry about it. I'm sure the programers can read the manual and include what's needed. The server admins will install the card and driver for us if they wish to support it. According to you, I can save $300 buy not buying the card at all, and I'll get all of the benefit because the client side doesn't do anything. Good to know I will only need a PPU for playing single player mode.

Anyone here trying GRAW and have a PhysX card? If that's a multiplayer game, could you please post how it works with and without the card installed?

game-play related calculations _MUST_NOT_ be done by the client. They need to be done by the server to ensure that everyone sees the same thing. You may pretty up your falling crane but in the end everyone needs to see the same thing. In order to stick with your barrel example:
You are walking next to the barrel and suddenly it blows up, your shiny new PPU creates a lot of dust and debris and parts of the former drum fling left and right - you can see squad ... but those effects are damn cool to watch, right?
Now ... I dont have that fancy PPU and all I see is a little *poof*, a jumping barrel and a disoriented SciFiMan - guess who dies in the next scene?

[SciFiMan]

Re: PhysX in battlefield

Sorry everyone. I don't know why I'm getting double posts here. I get a lot of timeouts on this forum.

[imported_SpungE]

Re: PhysX in battlefield

Bad reviews for the card are due to ghost recon and it's poor integration. It's not that the hardware is bad, it's just the GRAW team used it poorly.

[BPCrusher01]

Re: PhysX in battlefield

Think about some quick obvious things a PPU will allow:
1 - Arti will make big craters in the ground instead of just scorch marks and momentary dust. On Karkand you can bomb the river crossing so it becomes impassible except to APC's. But then your team can't cross easily either so have to think strategically.
2 - Two engi's in tanks are killing your team. Can't kill them, then shoot the crane and let it crash down on the tanks instead.
3 - Can't get those snipers on the roof? Just knock down the whole bloody building.
4 - All doors and walls are destructible so if you're backed into a corner, just blast through and exit the building or climb to any roof or floor.
5 - Crash your APC into building columns to knock the whole building down, blocking an entire road or two until the round ends.
6 - Blow out window glass and players nearby take damage from the glass shards.
7 - Spec Ops blows up a dam causing a small flood downstream, or it washes away a key bridge.
8 - Gernade blows a wheel off a Jeep but unfortuneately the wheel rolls down the road and kills your squad leader.
9 - AT guy runs out of ammo and pushes a boulder down to cause a rock slide destroying that tank.
10 - Annoyed by that sniper on the watertower? Tank blows a hole in it, washing enemies away. Sniper respawns and climbs into the new dark hole for safer shooting.

That would be absolutely BADASS! I would love if developers could implement this, even if it is years off.