Insurgency Mod - BETA Patched Up

[Fragalishus]

Wow, whoulda thought Jack Thompson could have gotten laid? Then had a kid and named him ALT+F4. So it's ok to shoot Special Air Service men or Navy Seals in Counter-Strike, just not Marines in Insurgency? Or is it only ok because those came out before the war started? It's a game dude...



Well I keep trying to give it another chance. On a p4 2.4 (@ 2.9) it's just not playable, even with an x1950 and 2gb of ram. Even put it on dx7 (everything low) and ran around an empty map, averaged about 28fps in the open areas. That's barely playable, add 5-10 player models in a firefight and it's a slideshow.



Aside from the performance it's just the most annoying game I've ever played. In its strive for realism it actually becomes even more unrealistic. I'm fairly confident that any modern combat soldier can pull out his pistol and empty the clip in about 2.3 seconds. Takes at least 3 seconds just to get the pistol out. I'm also fairly sure they can empty the entire clip of a 9mm without it kicking up to the ceiling. Even if it did have some kick, which a 9mm doesn't, I seriously doubt it would push my torso and eyeballs up towards the sky. I know why it is the way it is, doesn't make any less annoying, and certainly makes it less realistic.



And do you really need that many utility poles? With physics wires at that? You make a couple of them physics for realism and the rest static for performance. And usually 2 utility poles can provide enough realism as opposed to 4 or 5. Just like Turtle Rock there's just too much useless clutter eating up cpu cycles, combined with a constant barrage of error messages in console that can't possibly be helping anything.



The death notice is probably the biggest kicker for me. Without some sort of feedback on whether or not I'm actually doing anything, I just don't see any reason for playing it. Running around shooting at things and having no idea whether or not I killed them seems pretty pointless. Even if you see them die you have no idea if it was your shot or the guy next to you's.



meh...I might check back if another "various fps improvements" update comes out, cuz this first one didn't do jack squat.

[omgomgz]

Edited by [user="381418"] @ [time="1184012681"]

tcviper wrote..

Typical americans

By the way, had those rotten "typical Americans" not existed, the only video games that would exist today would be "Hitlers Dreamhouse" and "Grand Theft Gestapo III."



For the most part, many Americans I know have a lot of respect for Europe, how about returning the favor once in a while? We're not all thieving, bloodsucking capitalists, and I think if you changed your attitude, you may start to like some of us.



This post comes as a result of about the 100th time I've seen the phrase "typical americans" posted on CSNation. Happy Birthday.

[ALT+F4]

Edited by [user="3356"] @ [time="1184013900"]

Wow.



Zips, you have an absolutely uncanny ability to miss. or more accurately, ignore my point, which in this case is that I, personally, will not play German, Japanese, Islamic or any other kind of fuckhead attempting to kill US soldiers, even in a game. It's that simple.



Make no mistake: I'm not some rabid, demented anti-gamer decrying virtual violence and bloodshed. I've played through every WWII, Korean and Vietnam war game made, plus all the modern-day and endless crappy Star Wars conflicts and I've never once felt the urge to play as "the enemy." (OK, I admit to gleefully killing Ewoks by the score.)



I'm all for people getting shot -- as Dirty Harry says, "There's nothing wrong with shooting as long as the right people get shot." -- but the "right people" in this case, however, are not the men and women serving this country, computer generated or not, so that you can sit at home playing video games. It's a moral line in the sand from a different generation, I guess, but it's one I don't cross.



ETA:

Fragalishus wrote..

So it's ok to shoot Special Air Service men or Navy Seals in Counter-Strike...

Counter-Strike is presented as a tightly timed and supervised training exercise, complete with radio announcements of which team wins, not a real-world battlefield. All that's missing are blank firing attachments on the weapons to complete the picture. I don't recall Insurgency's massive pools of American blood anywhere in CS.

[Zips]

It's a game.

[ph03nix(k)]

It's funny because there are plenty of real soldiers and stuff who play games like BF2, and they have no problem playing either side.

[ALT+F4]

Zips wrote..

It's a game.

Well, dee-dee-dee! Proving my point yet again.

ph03nix(k) wrote..

It's funny because there are plenty of real soldiers and stuff who play games like BF2, and they have no problem playing either side.

I'd say they fucking earned the right.

[Zips]

Uhm, how is it proving your point when you can't get past the fact that you're supposedly killing persons in our own army/armed forces or whatever.



If you know it's a game, it shouldn't be an issue.



Just a game.

[Death-M0nk]

it's fun to kill the Marines in the game

[ALT+F4]

You prove my point by repeatedly ignoring my point and repeating yourself ignoring it, repeatedly.



I get it. I admit that I get it. You apparently never will.



"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosopy."

[-:Nighthawk:-]

I'd like to dissect ALT+F4's post and see if perhaps I can do so without "missing the point."

ALT+F4 wrote..

Zips, you have an absolutely uncanny ability to miss. or more accurately, ignore my point, which in this case is that I, personally, will not play German, Japanese, Islamic or any other kind of fuckhead attempting to kill US soldiers, even in a game. It's that simple.

So let's see if I get this clearly: you are against playing video games that present semi-realistic combat situations that feature US forces as an enemy. Correct?



By this logic and morality, you have established that anyone belonging to another country which disagrees with U.S. politics is inherently evil, and any patriot in another country who loves their country and will stand up and bear arms to defend that country from an outside attack is a "fuckhead" if the forces invading their homeland are American.



Yet a patriot in America defending Pearl Harbor against an attack by the Japanese is a hero, a fine man or woman that you'd proudly imitate in the video game arena.



I'm American myself, and still find this perspective sickening. The whole world, ourselves included, knows that the USA is not infallible, not every war we have fought in has been completely just (Vietnam being a prime example) by anyone's definition of the term, and at times our boys have been off killing innocents along with combatants; men and women themselves just villagers with rifles attempting to stop an invading army from burning, pillaging, raping and murdering their families.



To deny these facts is to stick your head in the sand and willfully ignore reality. War is not a clean affair with demarcated "right" and "wrong" sides to it -- it is one nation asserting its will, viewpoints and perspective onto another country. Sometimes this will is largely in accordance to the will of the citizens of that country (liberating France from German occupation) and other times it is oppressive to those conquered (Russian occupation of East Germany).



Either way, no matter who you fight for, you will be killing many men and women who are simply trying to protect their homes, their families, and their way of life.



Yet this is okay to do as an American, but evil and wrong as member of any nation that disagrees with us? That viewpoint is full of self-centered, close-minded self-righteousness, and quite frankly it disgusts me. I certainly respect our armed forces, and am thankful for their sacrifices, but they aren't God's army -- let's not forget that.

Counter-Strike is presented as a tightly timed and supervised training exercise, complete with radio announcements of which team wins, not a real-world battlefield. All that's missing are blank firing attachments on the weapons to complete the picture. I don't recall Insurgency's massive pools of American blood anywhere in CS.

What are real-life training simulations? They're mock exercises meant to mimic as closely as possible what the actual battlefield will look like. What are realistic war-themed video games? They're mock exercises meant to mimic as closely as possible what the actual battlefield looks like.



The only difference between the two is where the realism comes in. Real-life training with MILES gear is incredibly close to what real-life combat is like, with the exception that nobody really dies, thus you don't see blood spurt out and people writhing and screaming in pain as they finish the last few minutes of their abruptly shortened lives. Computer combat features a better approximation of what it looks and sounds like when people die (with blood effects and player animations) but falls short in every single other category of simulating the combat environment.



Saying "it's just a game" doesn't ignore your points: in fact, it directly addresses your claim to feel that training simulations with blanks (thus no consequences) are perfectly fine, and justify CS through this reasoning.



By saying that CS is justifiable because it's like combat training, you're saying that it's fine to shoot at US soldiers in a completely realistic situation where the only separation from reality is using blank ammunition. Yet the far less realistic simulation found in a computer game, where likewise no one really dies, you find such actions reprehensible?



Your logic is flawed, your morality is questionable, and your arguments fall flat on their face. Ultimately, however, none of this makes any difference. At the end of the day, you're still going to continue avoiding playing as "the bad guys" because it bugs your conscience despite having no logical reason for doing so. We too will continue to play either side with no bother to our own consciences, because we realize it's just a game.

[ALT+F4]

-:Nighthawk:- wrote..

Your logic is flawed, your morality is questionable, and your arguments fall flat on their face. Ultimately, however, none of this makes any difference. At the end of the day, you're still going to continue avoiding playing as "the bad guys" because it bugs your conscience despite having no logical reason for doing so. We too will continue to play either side with no bother to our own consciences, because we realize it's just a game.

On the contrary, my logic is perfect, my morality unassailable and my arguments sound enough to shatter glass, in the context of my opinion on this matter. You, on the other hand, are just trying to argue the case of mindless video violence for its own sake, completely devoid of symbolic content or philosophical differences.



Which is fine -- really, it is. In fact, I've argued in favor of the Grand Theft Auto series and the cheerfully nihilistic carnage of the ignorant and undereducated feeding on each other's petty and pathetic worthlessness portrayed -- nay, celebrated therein. Scum on scum crime does not faze me. Rejoicing in the anguish and sacrifice of Americans preserving your right to sit there with your entitled snot-nosed suburban thumbs up your ass whining about whether or not it's just a game does.



But, hey -- you play however the fuck you like and I'll do the same.

[Zips]

You missed quite a few more of Nighthawk's paragraphs here, and have thusly ignored him. Clearly, you missed his point.

[zazenXhagakure]

If we all played as the marines, who would play as the insurgents? Often, like just 5 minutes ago as one example, I've played on servers where the majority of people were playing on the marines side. It was 2 to 1, and it happens often. I'd like to play as the marines every time, but then you just end up stacking the teams, and the game is unbalanced and sucks.



If we all played as Marines there'd be no one to play against, so someone has to play as the insurgents. And if you can concede to that, you'll auto-team every time you enter a server.



Honestly, I don't think the INS team created the game to let you kill Marines. They created it to let you kill insurgents. But if its a multi-player game, one side has to play as the insurgents.



I understand that this isn't a logical issue to you, its emotional.



But when you say you feel wrong for playing this game, you imply to others that its wrong for us to play the game.



The rest of us feel emotion too, but I don't feel emotion for video game characters, only their real life counterparts.



I imagine I'm missing your point, but it sounds like you don't want your point to be countered. That's called set-in-your-ways.

[ALT+F4]

And yea, a voice of reason resoundeth amidst the chaos as

zazenXhagakure wrote..

I understand that this isn't a logical issue to you, its emotional.



But when you say you feel wrong for playing this game, you imply to others that its wrong for us to play the game.

You're right, except that I did not mean to imply that it's 'wrong' for anyone to play as they wish. It just started to appear that way when a bigger deal about my otherwise simple observation was made.



And, again, my call for AI solves my problem with team stacking



Let's leave it at this:



Yes, it's only a game. It's just pixels on a screen. No one really bleeds, suffers or dies. Life, as such, has no real value because it's only a game. I've been playing games longer than most of you have been alive. I know the fucking difference.



But it's a very realistic looking game and certain images have a very powerful impact, inseperable, to some degree, from reality.



I've tried playing the Japanese campaign in MS Combat Flight Simulator 2 and I just can't bring myself to pull the trigger on those deep blue Navy birds.



So it's me. It's my line in the sand. Game over, man. Game over.

[Diamond Dust]

Lets face it we aren't killing anything in a video game. We are just pressing buttons and making a collection of pixels change colors. You explain to me how that relates to life.