cpoint: lists

[Dagan]

ReFresh33 wrote..

the only reason y i think cs is at 83 is because its an old game. If cs was a new game and it was still compared to all those other games on the list, i would have to say that cs would definitely come in at least the first 20 or even 15.

But see ReFresh thats the fundamental problem, it's all subjective material. Because IGN made the list, IGN gets to choose what goes on the list. It's almost completely BIASED personal opinion with a pinch of ignorance and pinch of common sense thrown in. My main thought is that CS, as Asspennies pointed out, is inherently good only because of the cult-like following it has. CS doesn't deserve to be 83 nor, on the same note, does it deserve to be #1 or even *gasp* #20.



Half-Life kicked it off, CS was just a very well delivered clever idea, but consider this: if 90% of all current players of CS suddely decided to go play...say BF1942, or Q3A, or another mod that I'm unaware of, would you continue to play? And if you would continue to play, would it feel the same? Would it be as good...? I personally doubt it.



Myself I'll go along with the tide of people, I'm a social gamer and general popularity decides where I play. By no means does this say I'll play some poorly made game simply because people play it, all it means is that the community has the power to make or break, in many ways, a fantastic game. And due to this fact a Multiplayer game that has a huge following can be abandoned and inevitably forgotten in but a few years which makes it an unsuitable choice for Top #"__" Lists.

[Se7eN!]

Wow. After reading that list... Omg. Makes most gamers want to throw up. I love seeing how shitty these lists are. Though it would probably be lame to put CS in the top 20 as its bad graphically and wasnt as "revolutionary" as some other games, and has such a high learning curve. But anyone whos played it much would agree its at LEAST top 40-ish.... Half those titles on the list no one even fucking bought them. Though some of the titles on the list are "unique" and u dont see them on others, most are simply freaking pathetic.



Oh and I agree. FF7 and FF3 are greatest FF games ever. Seeing FF2 and FF10 on that list is pure BS. Yes FF7 is genius AND revolutionary. Started the whole 3D RPG and cinematics craze we see today.

[Buddah]

I'd disagree with a few making the list, but damn Square got it's well earned share.



THE WORLD IS SQUARE.

[Shadow]

Wait, Spoonman, back to the first post thing. What if i have a very good thought about the story, post that thought, then write BTW and put the first post thing? Would that be okay? Or is that STILL bad?



Okay, back to the list. I think the list is a bad idea, as we are all different, and have our opinions. Isn't a list kind of restricting your own thought? I mean, someone could play a crappy game on the internet and call tat their #1 game. Crap, now i sound like my guidance counselor.

[Pharlap]

blood on the top of the list woot!



http://www.oldmanmurray.com/features/41.html

[Dinjack]

Yo asspennies, I noticed you questioning if Goldeneye was more influential than Half Life. I love Half Life like the mutant zombie child I could never have, but Goldeneye changed first person shooters from mindless blowing everything away to thinking and objective meeting, which you do loads of in HL. I just wanted to point out that while Half Life may have been the better game, Goldeneye paved the way.

[asspennies]

Don't get me wrong, I recognize Goldeneye's influence, but Half-Life's influence on FPSes, and indeed, on games in general, has been far greater and far more powerful. Not to take anything away from Goldeneye, which I frankly loved, it's just that it's not as good a game as Half-Life, and there's a chance that Half-Life would have existed without Goldeneye. I don't think that Halo, for example, would have existed (in its present form) without Half-Life.

[ShadyMilkman]

[V@GuE]

the list was complete crap why is deus ex up so high it started the whole "open-ended" type of FPS cs what was that like 82nd thats crap HL should been 1st GT 2 should have been in top 5 bah the ign.com writers must get paid to write such craptastic lists

[russianmobster]

I think you guys made perfectly good points. The Mario #1 slot is total bull, I think. And yes, I have played those games. But seriously - you gotta see this as a top 100 games of ALL TIME list. Not top 100 games right now. Right now it would be like battle field, splinter cell, crap like that. But if you really want to dig down, there are other games that would take the #1 spot. But it sure as hell wouldn't be Mario!!

Oh yes and FFX sucked so so so incredibly bad. I hated it. I wanted to murder Tidus. I also wanted to kill Yuna because of the way she said "yes" and "ok". GOD!!!

I also think you guys are wrong when you talk about Quake and UT. Those games were cool, sure, but Quake SUCKED. No story line. You just run around killin bad guys and get a super nail gun (which was awesome). One of those should have been on there just for the fy_iceworld type of killing where you just pick up a fat gun and go kill people. I remember in some game...I think UT...I could get hit with a rocket launcher 3 times and live. Yea...that's cool.

Wolfenstein was fun as hell first time I played it, Duke Nukem was also a stepping stone. The final fantasy series should have been mentioned more, in my opinion, and so should have many other games. Lists are stupid, make your own. VH1 and MTV suck. Those are my opinions in a nut shell...im a loser.

[RadioactiveDecay]

I agree, that list is crap. ok. Anyway. asspennies, i read that Entertainment Weekly thing too, also looking for Office Space (it was on the cover too if i remember correctly). They didn't include it in the list... but they did a two page spread on it on the following pages. I don't know why it's not in the list, or even given a number, but by the coverage they gave it, they might've had it at #1...?

Just a thought. Nice work ppl.

[[Z.E.J.]]

Oddly enough, lists have always seemed incorrect to me. Recently, I've been paying some views to MTV channels on cable and skimming through their top 25 hip-hop music videos or top 50 songs to have sex to and all that. And what is it that they show? Some crap from the 70s.



What the hell was that? I was born in 1984 and the most recent bit of fun entertainment me, my friends, and collegues are music from the 90s like Three Doors Down, movies like A Beautiful Mind, Moulon Rouge (SP), or Matrix, and the like. That is literally what I expected. These are the things people of all ages can remember in the here and now. You'd have to be some World War II veteran to actually consider black and white movies as things to be counted in lists. But noooo... MTV sees kiddy films staring Michael Jackson as top movie #1.



The thing is lately people who make these lists lack logic. If people were creating lists like "music" followed up by "of all time", yeah I would appreciate things from 80s or earlier. They specifically say "of all time" so its legitimate. But when they don't say things like that and pull a game like Super Mario Brothers 3 (a game practically 10% of the world population actually remember what it was and like...like me), no doubt people will question its success because 90% of them never played it. It's only up there because the list makers: 1) lack the logic and rationale to make a proper list or 2) are being very subjective and let their personal interests interfere with public lists.



I looked at IGN's list and I say alright. Super Mario Brothers came out in late 1980s or so, and it is in an "of all time" list. I'll admit that some of my opinions speak only for a select group of people, but it's only logical that things should go where they go. I agree with rizzah's point that multiplayer games and single player games should be separated. The quality and purpose are just uniquely different. Super Smash Brothers Melee and Counter-Strike involve multiple players and start wave after wave of competition. But in Ocarina of Time, there is purpose, there is story (things that cannot be neglected in choosing a good game). You can't merge them both because the tie between the two classes is waaay too loose.



MTV would be wise to add some clarity. But lists...in most cases I've seen, lists are entirely subjective, as asspennies has stated. Better to read a review on games like Vice City and try it for yourself becuase screw the masses! Keep your biased thoughts to yourself (bad ending lol).

[ChinoKix06]

Maxim did one of these lists and of course they had pac-man, galaga, and super mario brothers 1, 2, and 3, which was a load of crap. But i think they still did a better job at ranking doom at 4 and Cs at 13.

[bgrd]

Edited by [user="143737"] @ [time="1057223100"]

i was thinking about that Police Quest: SWAT game when you brought up worst gaming experiences, and was overjoyed when you mentioned it.



my idea of what makes a good or bad game is the utilisation (over, or under) of established or new technologies, or gaming trends.



Super Mario Brothers was good - i'm sure it pushed my little 8bit NES as far as it could go. Super Off Road and Duck Hunt overshadow it though...they did far more, gameplay wise, for the system.



Police Quest: SWAT, however, during the time of emerging fps's, used a kind of 'aim the mouse around a still screen' play. It was like shooting bottles. It was a nothing game and should be remembered by Sierra fans forever for their complete and utter laziness.



Evidently, the major gaming trend in recent years is 'multiplayer'. And Counter-Strike has this down to a tee, whilst still, 4 years later, having acceptable graphics.

[Zorba the Geek]

It is idiotic to try and compare games. How do you compare Mario Kart with Mist with Quake with Everquest (which isn't on the top 100 list btw)? You can't use criteria such as story line, as some games don't need em. Graphics? Nope... The only 2 things I would use to rank games are: a) the addictiveness of the game AT THE TIME OF RELEASE, and b) the impact it had on games thereafter.



When it comes to sheer hours spent enthralled and engrossed, my top 5 list would have to be:



1. Mario Kart (the original)

2. CS

3. Zelda: A Link to the Past

4. Zelda: The Ocarina of Time

5. Starcraft



For impact:



1. Mario

2. Wolfenstein

3. Half Life

4. Warcraft 2

5. My grandmother



I'm bored, so I'm going to go do something else now.