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  • Assault nerfed.....why?

    After taking a few months hiatus from BF2 (for WoW) I decided to install the new patch and check it out.

    I must say, I was a bit confused about the direction the devs took that game with this patch.

    I thought the game was supposed to be built around "squad player roles".

    Ie: each person in a squad has a specific strengths, and therefore contributes a specific "function" to the squad.

    What the roles SHOULD be in my opinion:

    -----------------

    Assault - Role: Main infantry-infantry attack

    Assault should be the MOST effective at killing opposing infantry..plain and simple. Attack weapon and/or body armour should put assault at SIGNIFICANT advantage over all other classes for mobile ground assault.

    If you want to run and gun assault should be your PRIMARY choice.

    Special Ops - Role: Secondary assault / infiltration / demolition

    Special Ops should have good killing ability vs. infantry but less survivability and firepower then assault. The should have increased mobility, stealth and the ability to set demolitions traps to make up for the 1 on 1 killing disadvantage.

    Medic - Role: Support / Healing

    Medic should have very reduced assault abilities, and should not, under normal circumstances be able to kill an opposing assault class in a close or medium range 1 on 1 battle. This is balanced by there ability to self-heal, heal teamates and revive the wounded. Medics should NOT be the jack of all trades class that give overall utility.

    Support - Role: Immobile ground firepower / ammunition

    Support should have the BEST medium / long range firepower in the prone position. They should excel at killing enemies at distance while assault classes capture strategic positions. The also are responsible for ammunition.

    Engineer - Role: Vehicle repair / anti-vehicle mining

    Excel at vehicle repair, therefore suited for driving vehicles. Given the powerfull nature of vehicles engineer should have the significantly nerfed infantry-infantry combat effectiveness.

    Sniper - Long range anti-infantry

    Excel at long range anti-infantry killing (best in game). Highly mobile, self sufficient

    Anti-tank - Anti-vehicle

    Excel at dispatching vehicles (all situations). High survivability, Anti-infantry combat should be significantly limited.

    --------------------------------

    Okay, so those are what I think the class roles should be, but if you actually LOOK at the game right now they are TOTALLY out of wack.

    1. Assault: Previously the grenade launcher gave the assault class the best anti-infantry weapon in the game allowing them to fufill their class role to a reasonable degree.

    The nerf of the GL, has made the assault class TOTALLY USELESS. They are NOT the infantry killing machines they should be and the survivability given by increased body armor is not enough to offset the utility medics and spec ops players are given.

    Assault do not fullfill their class role:

    Improvements required:
    Most lethal rifle weapons at short and medium range (with 30 rounds at least), more body armor. Basically assault should have a significantly better weapon then Spec Ops.

    2. Spec Ops: Right now this class has the best weapons in the game overall, and also has C4 to fullfill their class role.

    Spec Ops fullfill their class role

    Improvements required:
    None (if assault is boosted)

    3. Medic: Main rifle too powerfull for class role, given healing ability and role

    Medics are overpowered (which is why everyone plays them)

    Nerfs required: Decrease primary weapon usefullness OR decrease body armor
    Improvements Required: Increase mobility

    4. Support:
    New patch make non-prone accuracy too high, yet prone accuracy should still be better

    Nefs required: Decrease non-prone accuracy to almost useless (ie: running and gunning only at UBER close range)
    Improvements: Increase prone accuracy (ie: a 1 on 1 prone battle should ALWAYS be won by support vs. other classes except at extreme long range with single shot from rifle)

    5. Sniper: I haven't played sniper yet so I have no comment, they should have the stealth capability of spec ops however.


    6. Anti-tank:
    Anti-tank should be the BEST anti-vehicles class and the worst anti-infantry class. Right now spec-ops has a 1 shot anti-vehicles kill (C4), making them more usefull in some circumstances then AT?!

    Nerfs: Anti-infantry weapons should be slightly nerfed (DA0-12)
    Improvements: SIGNIFICANT increase in anti-armor effectiveness of this class

    Tank Rear - 1-2 shots (depending on exact hit location)
    APC rear - 1 shot
    All other vehicles: 1 shot any place


    7. Engineer: Engineer is quite balanced. However, I think that they should SLOWLY repair ground vehicles (not air vehicles) while inside them, especially to make up for the inproved anti-tank abilities I proposed.

    Improvments: Allow slow repairing of ground vehicles while being driven


    -------------------

    Right now Dice has made too many classes "equal" and has not created enough of a specialization in the classes. This is what 80% of people play the "jack of all trades classes" = medic and spec ops.

    Assault SHOULD be the most desirable class to play for general killing....NOT support classes.

    Right now NO ONE plays assault, and that is really a shame. When everyone has medic bags and C4 it makes the game less interesting in my opinion.

    I can understand why the Devs wanted to nerf the GL, since it changes the 1 on 1 dynamic of the game...HOWEVER, even pre 1.2 MOST PEOPLE played spec ops / medic and FEW played assault!!!

    So, nerfing the ONLY effective killing weapons assault had is going to make people play assault MORE?!...nope. Assault is useless now, either take it out of the game or make it usefull again.

    /end of rant

  • #2
    Re: Assault nerfed.....why?

    Assaults not nerfed, GL's are.

    Assault still has F2000 and G3 as unlocks, two extremely powerful and accurate guns. And smoke grenades/flash grenades to which you can use to give you that much more of an advantage while capping a flag. or running across and open street.

    and as for medic vs assault? assault shouldn't win, neither should medic... its called player skill...even with 2 bots playing as the role the assault wont always win.

    finally as for nerfing current weapons Dao-12, if an AT guys is able to get that close to you for the gun to be deadly (extremely short efective range) you deserve to be killed.

    But, yeah i agree the speed at which you repair while in a vehicle is little too fast, this coming from an engineer.


    oh yeah, i forgot, most people now play sniper due to explosive ff off so they can just claymore whore everywhere, and support cuz the PKM got an incredibly unfair accuracy boost. (people can snipe with it, to some point)

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Assault nerfed.....why?

      @ topicstarter, you just don't get anything about gamebalance at all .

      And do you realy think if it was very hard for a medic to win over another class as assault, spec ops, .... there would be many medics around ? no, everybody would just be assault whoring

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Assault nerfed.....why?

        Originally posted by rombaft
        @ topicstarter, you just don't get anything about gamebalance at all .

        And do you realy think if it was very hard for a medic to win over another class as assault, spec ops, .... there would be many medics around ? no, everybody would just be assault whoring
        Well, right now NO ONE is assault. I played on mashturr last night which is a GROUND ASSAULT CITY MAP and I was the ONLY assault out of 40 people....if you don't think that says something about balance then you are the one who needs to look at the game objectivley

        Most were medic and spec ops (as per usual).

        So, I think I understand game balance just fine thank you. Assault SHOULD be the bread and butter class and the SUPPORT classes should be just that SUPPORTING the bread and butter classes.

        You don't go to war with 50 medics and no assault.

        Just like playing the support class gives you and ADVANTAGE (like healing and C4) assault should give you and ADVANTAGE....in killing.

        Rombaft, so medic should get basically the same gun as assault (F2000 is just as good as G3e) AND unlimited healing and the chance to get uber points from all support work?

        HHAHAAHHA that is just so stupid I can't even respond.

        Why would ANYONE bother to play assault right now?....exactly

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Assault nerfed.....why?

          Interesting idea. I see your point about spec-ops being the same as assault. When I first started, I always played assault but was annoyed at being killed by tanks. Going spec-ops gave me the same advantages and a chance in destroying tanks - the best of both worlds.

          In 1v1, as previously said, it's about skill. It is about balance because you don't want a first timer to pick up a gun, start spraying and killing everyone.

          I don't think anything needs to be done.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Assault nerfed.....why?

            rombaft, you don't have a clue either. Gamebalance doesn't mean "everyone can kill everyone just as effectively". Gamebalance means letting each class do it's job. If you are a medic and can kill people very effectively, well that's just not right. The medic should be unbalanced in the sense that it can't kill as effectively. This also goes for Dilla_Incognito. What should happen is that the medic strategy be adjusted so that they spend more time doing medic stuff, and less time being as good a killer.

            Medics dominate the point-wh0r3ing. That means there is an issue with it.

            Supe

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Assault nerfed.....why?

              Originally posted by dblEdge
              you don't want a first timer to pick up a gun, start spraying and killing everyone.
              that made me smile


              Originally posted by =HPSF=Supe
              This also goes for Dilla_Incognito. What should happen is that the medic strategy be adjusted so that they spend more time doing medic stuff, and less time being as good a killer.

              Medics dominate the point-wh0r3ing. That means there is an issue with it.

              Supe
              Yeah, i see what you mean, but lowering the medics wepaons capabilities isn't gonna do much, its the player who decided whether he wants to use a certain class for its intended purpose or whether he is partial to the gun they carry.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Assault nerfed.....why?

                Originally posted by dblEdge
                In 1v1, as previously said, it's about skill. It is about balance because you don't want a first timer to pick up a gun, start spraying and killing everyone.
                Ok so let me get this straight....if 1 on 1 it was ONLY about skill that would mean that in a 1 on 1 situation both people should be equal right?

                THEN WHY HAVE DIFFERENT CLASSES!??!

                This whole "skill" arguement is so closed minded I can't even believe it. People want 1 on 1 to be equal but they want all their goodies too.

                If you want goodies like C4 and healing you have to GIVE UP SOMETHING!

                This game isn't about being equal 1 on 1 INFANTRY!! It is about being on a TEAM and being in SQUADS not everyone running around as jack of all trades and bitching when, as a support class they get owned by an assault class

                You don't see assault people whining about not being able to heal people or having trouble with tanks...GEEZ

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Assault nerfed.....why?

                  One word... G3.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Assault nerfed.....why?

                    =HPSF=Doctor Doom,


                    I believe you are correct with most of your statements, however I believe you are wrong about the medic, they should stand a chance against assault classes, you do not need to nerf their weapons that much, the reason for a medics weapon is self-defense, tell me what good a self-defense weapon is if you can't kill anybody cause their weapons are 20 times better than yours because some dude thought that they shouldn't be able to do squat?


                    and with your 50 medics no assault statement I believe we should implement part of the Battlfield 1942 system into BF2....limit the amount of players that can play as the same class at the same time

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Assault nerfed.....why?

                      I didn't say the medic should have a G3 or F2000 , where did I say that ?

                      Your point is that you want to put the assault class more up, and this will cause unbalance,
                      Now the assault is still the most powerfull class for killing infantry , but it has to be this way, another player in another class as a medic who is also suposed to be infantry, should be able to have a good chance against the assault class , this is my point , assault is the strongest, but only a bit stronger then other classes that should be infantry .

                      like the engineer, as infantry, he won't make lots of chance killing another infantry guy (exept up close) , this because he isn't suposed to be infantry .

                      Sniper, is on distance

                      Support is also infantry , so he also whould have a good ability to kill other infantry, such as assault , also because it's suposed to be an infantry person .

                      This is gamebalance , not making a super killing class standing up above all, and some other classes that only can do specific things, this because some other classes are also ment to be infantry .

                      Get it now or not ??

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Assault nerfed.....why?

                        Originally posted by Dilla_Incognito
                        but lowering the medics wepaons capabilities isn't gonna do much, its the player who decided whether he wants to use a certain class for its intended purpose or whether he is partial to the gun they carry.
                        The point is he SHOULDN'T be able to use a medic in a assault role.

                        Self-Healing is an EXTREME advantage, and combined with being able to heal remotely (ie: with bag drops) AND being able to revive comrades makes that particular "skill" VERY powerfull.

                        So, to balance things you need to take something away from that class, or everyone will play it....lol.

                        I am not saying a medic will NEVER be able to kill an assault, but with 2 equally skilled players going 1 on 1 a medic should lose by a healfy margin pure and simple.

                        Right now this isn't the case, and is again why playing assault is totally useless.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Assault nerfed.....why?

                          Alright Doom i see what your saying, and im pretty sure everyone else does too. Yes, classes have their own certain skills, yes if you pick that class you should use its skill...( i do, i don't know why others don't, it just results in an extra kill or teamwork point) But, you can't negate the fact that there are some noobish or less team oriented people that play BF2 and only care about killing and if that means using Spec-Ops super accurate carbines, or being able to heal themselves (medic) Then they'll do it, but there's really no way you can stop it. Unless you're an admin, on a completely squad/teamwork based server.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Assault nerfed.....why?

                            Originally posted by =HPSF=Doctor Doom
                            Ok so let me get this straight....if 1 on 1 it was ONLY about skill that would mean that in a 1 on 1 situation both people should be equal right?

                            THEN WHY HAVE DIFFERENT CLASSES!??!

                            This whole "skill" arguement is so closed minded I can't even believe it. People want 1 on 1 to be equal but they want all their goodies too.

                            If you want goodies like C4 and healing you have to GIVE UP SOMETHING!

                            This game isn't about being equal 1 on 1 INFANTRY!! It is about being on a TEAM and being in SQUADS not everyone running around as jack of all trades and bitching when, as a support class they get owned by an assault class

                            You don't see assault people whining about not being able to heal people or having trouble with tanks...GEEZ

                            I think 1 on 1 should resort to Skill with the main weapon, not the power of the classes the "goodies" as you call them are what make the classes, not the guns or knives or even pistols, it's the other stuff like C4, GLs, MedKits, Defibs, etc. etc. etc. every body should stand a one on one chance with the enemy infantry, that's why they have guns in the first place, what you are proposing is to take the guns completley out of the game and leave the fight to the so called "goodies"

                            YOU are the one that is closed minded

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Assault nerfed.....why?

                              GLs are perfectly fine. If you think assault is now useless youre a bunny hoppinh noob toobing player and you got what you deserved.

                              Comment

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