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Actual Solutions: Bunny hopping, GL abuse, prone spam, etc. etc.
Actual Solutions: Bunny hopping, GL abuse, prone spam, etc. etc.
Good suggestions.
The proposed patch does a good job addressing jet/chopper superiority, which is sorely needed. But it doesn't do a good job fixing bunnyhopping or dolphin diving.
Actual Solutions: Bunny hopping, GL abuse, prone spam, etc. etc.
This post builds on Wargimp's and extends the analysis to other issues.
As usual, DICE has failed to understand the real causes behind the problems everyone is complaining about. Let's get to the meat here and talk about the real issues at hand and the solutions.
Bunny Hopping
Two types: offensive (jumping and shooting) and defensive (repeatedly jumping to avoid being hit).
Offensive bunny hopping
It's is never an issue unless it's paired with the grenade launchers or C4. When players do jump and fire the grenade launcher (or throw C4), they usually only have to jump once within a 5 second span.
Why DICE's solution doesn't work:
Technically, removing shooting while jumping does prevent offensive bunny hopping, but it also prevents many other actions that players unanimously approve of, such as jumping to throw grenades or ammo/health packs. Fix 2 things, break 3 more - obviously that's not viable.
What will work:
Preventing players from deploying C4 or firing the grenade launcher while airborne. I realize that it'll take more coding to accomplish, but this is something that needs to be done right over being done fast.
Defensive bunny hopping
The act of repeatedly jumping up and down to avoid being shot.
Why DICE's solution doesn't work:
They don't address it! Preventing players from shooting while jumping doesn't stop them from jumping over and over.
What will work:
Wargimp's suggestion - make jumping take 1/3 of your stamina bar, or so. That way, a given player could only chain 2-3 jumps in a row.
Conclusion
Players can never jump more than 2-3 times in a row, and cannot fire the GL or throw C4 while in the air.
Grenade Launcher Abuse
Players can use the grenade launchers at very close ranges without killing themselves and always killing the opponent. This is due to the shape of the splash damage and the lack of a minimum effective range.
Why DICE's solution doesn't work:
They haven't formally proposed anything yet, but during the DEV chat they hinted at reducing the splash radius of the GL, which is precisely the wrong thing to do. It stands to further reduce the risk to the shooter in CQC, while retaining most, if not all, of the close range lethality. It also weakens the GL at longer ranges or for killing groups of enemies - two of its legit uses.
What will work:
Create a minimum arming time/distance for the GL. Say, 15m, to prevent players from being able to induce an explosion at close ranges. Retain projectile damage (similar to the regular grenades) such that players hit by the physical grenade itself (prior to explosion) will still be killed by the inertia. This is an homage to reality, as well as a reward for those that can aim.
Conclusion
Prevent the GL's ability to cause general, close range explosions by creating a minimum range, but retain its ability to physically kill if aimed well in CQC.
Prone Jumping/Dolphin Diving
There's much confusion here, so let's try to deal with it. There are a few actions that fall under this category. The first is staying prone while hopping up and down, and the second is running, then jumping, then going to prone and flying through the air only to land and immediately have fantastic accuracy.
Prone Jumping (bouncing while prone)
The act of repeatedly jumping up and down to avoid being shot, while staying in the prone position.
Why DICE's solution doesn't work:
They haven't addressed this yet.
What will work:
Gravity being what it is, it makes much sense to allow players to quickly move fron standing to crouch/prone, but require time to get up. In particular, it might take 1-2 seconds to stand up from being prone, but you could still drop to the floor almost instantaneously. This also prevents players from spamming prone over and over.
Prone Jumping (running, jumping, proning and thusly flying
The act of sprinting into a jump, then going prone and flying through the air, making it impossible to hit you and yielding near perfect accuracy the moment you lane on the pavement.
Why DICE's solution doesn't work:
They haven't addressed this yet.
What will work:
Only allow players to change stance while on the ground.
Conclusion
Players can only change stance while on the ground (not jumping). Players can go down in position quickly, but it takes time to stand up.
Thoughts? Obviously these are theoretical. Don't flame too hard.
Re: Actual Solutions: Bunny hopping, GL abuse, prone spam, etc. etc.
good post there, very good solutions, ppl are happy because they think this will stop bunny hopping but they will be sad pretty quickly when they realise that they are affected aswell.
Re: Actual Solutions: Bunny hopping, GL abuse, prone spam, etc. etc.
Originally posted by ||ass||variable
This post builds on Wargimp's and extends the analysis to other issues.
As usual, DICE has failed to understand the real causes behind the problems everyone is complaining about. Let's get to the meat here and talk about the real issues at hand and the solutions.
Bunny Hopping
Two types: offensive (jumping and shooting) and defensive (repeatedly jumping to avoid being hit).
Offensive bunny hopping
It's is never an issue unless it's paired with the grenade launchers or C4. When players do jump and fire the grenade launcher (or throw C4), they usually only have to jump once within a 5 second span.
Why DICE's solution doesn't work:
Technically, removing shooting while jumping does prevent offensive bunny hopping, but it also prevents many other actions that players unanimously approve of, such as jumping to throw grenades or ammo/health packs. Fix 2 things, break 3 more - obviously that's not viable.
I dont really consider that "breaking", players will do anything to boost the range at which they can trow things, if Dice wanted players to trow ammo/health/nades as far as you can while jumping, i think that would have been the default range, dont you think? It makes the most sense. The jumping is just a little extra, in BF2's case, 6 feet of vertical elevation. Instead of insisting that you should be able to trow these things while jumping, why not ask Dice to increase the range of nades and support/medic packs?
What will work:
Preventing players from deploying C4 or firing the grenade launcher while airborne. I realize that it'll take more coding to accomplish, but this is something that needs to be done right over being done fast.
That might be crazy enough to work!
seriously tho, i dont understand why they didnt do that..:hmm:
Defensive bunny hopping
The act of repeatedly jumping up and down to avoid being shot.
Why DICE's solution doesn't work:
They don't address it! Preventing players from shooting while jumping doesn't stop them from jumping over and over.
What will work:
Wargimp's suggestion - make jumping take 1/3 of your stamina bar, or so. That way, a given player could only chain 2-3 jumps in a row.
Conclusion
Players can never jump more than 2-3 times in a row, and cannot fire the GL or throw C4 while in the air.
If i read things correctly before the release of BF2 that was the initial idea, jumping and sprinting would not be possible without stamina.. but, for some reason i didnt make it in.
Grenade Launcher Abuse
Players can use the grenade launchers at very close ranges without killing themselves and always killing the opponent. This is due to the shape of the splash damage and the lack of a minimum effective range.
Why DICE's solution doesn't work:
They haven't formally proposed anything yet, but during the DEV chat they hinted at reducing the splash radius of the GL, which is precisely the wrong thing to do. It stands to further reduce the risk to the shooter in CQC, while retaining most, if not all, of the close range lethality. It also weakens the GL at longer ranges or for killing groups of enemies - two of its legit uses.
What will work:
Create a minimum arming time/distance for the GL. Say, 15m, to prevent players from being able to induce an explosion at close ranges. Retain projectile damage (similar to the regular grenades) such that players hit by the physical grenade itself (prior to explosion) will still be killed by the inertia. This is an homage to reality, as well as a reward for those that can aim.
Conclusion
Prevent the GL's ability to cause general, close range explosions by creating a minimum range, but retain its ability to physically kill if aimed well in CQC.
15 meters is a little extreme, 10 i could agree with. 15 is just to much in the scaled down world that is BF2.
Prone Jumping/Dolphin Diving
There's much confusion here, so let's try to deal with it. There are a few actions that fall under this category. The first is staying prone while hopping up and down, and the second is running, then jumping, then going to prone and flying through the air only to land and immediately have fantastic accuracy.
Prone Jumping (bouncing while prone)
The act of repeatedly jumping up and down to avoid being shot, while staying in the prone position.
Why DICE's solution doesn't work:
They haven't addressed this yet.
What will work:
Gravity being what it is, it makes much sense to allow players to quickly move fron standing to crouch/prone, but require time to get up. In particular, it might take 1-2 seconds to stand up from being prone, but you could still drop to the floor almost instantaneously. This also prevents players from spamming prone over and over.
Prone Jumping (running, jumping, proning and thusly flying
The act of sprinting into a jump, then going prone and flying through the air, making it impossible to hit you and yielding near perfect accuracy the moment you lane on the pavement.
Why DICE's solution doesn't work:
They haven't addressed this yet.
What will work:
Only allow players to change stance while on the ground.
Conclusion
Players can only change stance while on the ground (not jumping). Players can go down in position quickly, but it takes time to stand up.
Thoughts? Obviously these are theoretical. Don't flame too hard.
I think this: "- "Dolphin Diving" is no longer possible " will eliminate prone jumping as well.. but dice isnt exacly clear in their wording.
Re: Actual Solutions: Bunny hopping, GL abuse, prone spam, etc. etc.
we can all hope they change their minds about this issue before they release the patch, its clear by all the bf2 forums there is more ppl complaining about the fix now than ppl complaining about bunny hopping itself.
i say
DICE!! CHANGE IT WHILE U HAVE TIME!!!!! (no one from dice will read this but at least i've tried hehehe)
Re: Actual Solutions: Bunny hopping, GL abuse, prone spam, etc. etc.
I say they leave the play well enough alone, and fix the bugs, and optimization issues.
If they must change anything reguarding the hopping, increased stamina lose, and ridiculous inaccuracy while flying through the air, and an arming distance for GL's.
You know they aren't going to recode a difference for medic/ammo bags and grenades, as opposed to C4. And what about claymores, will we not be able to throw them over walls now either? There's still plenty of ways to spam C4 without being able to throw it.
Re: Actual Solutions: Bunny hopping, GL abuse, prone spam, etc. etc.
Originally posted by Auto-ER-
And what about claymores, will we not be able to throw them over walls now either? There's still plenty of ways to spam C4 without being able to throw it.
You only get 2, they have a minimum timer before they arm, and claymores are destroyable with grenades and the wrench. But sure, rope them in if you like. Most snipers won't mind.
I'm not sure what you mean by "spamming C4", but the biggest perversion of C4 right now is being able to use it like a super grenade. Remove that and it's back to use as an explosive that you "set", which is where it ought to be.
Re: Actual Solutions: Bunny hopping, GL abuse, prone spam, etc. etc.
Thank you ||ass||variable for this well constructed post. I really, really hope that DICE is reading the forums, as they say they do, and paying close attention.
Please don't nerf the 'nade throw distance, and the ability to chuck ammo/med packs to ledges where your teammates are. Please.
Re: Actual Solutions: Bunny hopping, GL abuse, prone spam, etc. etc.
i've said this on wargimps post before but i think it applies here too.
The new fix by DICE fixes the whole issue of bunnyhopping.
Why?
Because offensive bunnyhopping will be effectivley eliminated. The real advantage from that tactic is due to the ability to nade or throw C4. Nading is extremley accurate while jumping + u dont get hurt doing it close range. But you can easily put down anyone who's doing it without those weapons. Just dont panic. Make your shots count. Dont unload your whole magazine and hit nothing. Stay cool just like in real life. You may say now, "thanks Mr. Miagi" but really many players do just that.
Defensive bunnyhopping is not an issue. Come on now. U see somebody doing it. How hard is it to adopt to that tactic? Is it really so diffaucult to lead the hopper and shoot him when he comes down? Or with support even in the air. I got shot a couple of times by good snipers while jumping.
Sure prone jumpers have an incredible accuracy when they hit the pavement + the evasive bonus from the jump. Go prone while they jump and, oh what's that, all of the sudden u have the same accuracy advantage. Sometimes they own u sometimes it's the other way around.
Re: Actual Solutions: Bunny hopping, GL abuse, prone spam, etc. etc.
Originally posted by ||ass||variable
You only get 2, they have a minimum timer before they arm, and claymores are destroyable with grenades and the wrench. But sure, rope them in if you like. Most snipers won't mind.
I'm not sure what you mean by "spamming C4", but the biggest perversion of C4 right now is being able to use it like a super grenade. Remove that and it's back to use as an explosive that you "set", which is where it ought to be.
By spamming, I meant camping a spawn point next to a supply crate or support kit, which is more annoying to me than using them as a grenade (unless I'm doing it :P )
Why is it annoying that people throw it, and not annoying that say in Kark the alleys are nothing but exploding grenades? I just don't see the point of nefting half the game because people refuse to accept that it is a game, and have some vision about it being some ub3r tactical roleplaying simulation, when there are actual problems in the game that should be fixed first. Everyone wants them to address the latest way they had their ass handed to them in the last round they played, and IMO are going to be less than happy with the proposed changes because instead of fixing problems with the game they spent their time catering to the wrong issues.
All the accuracy fixes sounds great, and if they implement the anti exploits correctly, than fine, but they don't have a history of actually doing what they say, and instead of fixing them right, I fear they are just going to make things worse. I'd rather play it as it is, than have it screwed up more.
Re: Actual Solutions: Bunny hopping, GL abuse, prone spam, etc. etc.
I'll analyze the original poster's points quickly:
Bunny hopping:
Not allowing any weapon to fire while jumping SOVLES the problem of c4ing and noob tubing while jumping, BUT it does prevent shooting, grenades, etc while jumping.
Personally, I think that not being able to do anythign would change Battlefield for the better, but thats not being debated.
Bunny hopping... jumping takes about 1/5 your stamina bar. Changing it to a third or half would do nothign because you can jump with no stamina.
DICE did say they are going to fix a 'stamina exploit'. The only thing I can think of that sounds like a 'stamina exploit' to me is being able to jump with no stamina. If that is put into effect, DICE will have stopped longterm bunny hopping.
The easiest to fix bunny hopping after this would be to half the jump hieght to 4 feet. This won't mess up game dynamic, contrary to what DICE says. There are very few things you can't jump with an 3 foot jump that you can jump with an 8 fott jump in BF2.
Grenade Launcher (noob tubing):
The main cause of noob tubing is that the grenade launcher is
A) Too accurate
B) Has no barely any radius of damage.
Adding a minimum distance the nade has to fly before it'll explode like in AA would be the best help, as most noob tugin happens at close range.
Making the nade launcher take longer to steady, and increasing it's blast radius will make it be used more like a real nade launcher: controlled, and with care, instead of randomly while runnign around.
Dolphin Diving, etc.
Caused by:
A) Horrible animations
B) Too fast player movement and transition between stances
The prone animation shows a person holding a large gun, wearing a good amount of gear, going from standing to absolutely flat in about .2 seconds. Try emulating that motion. You'll break your wrist, or at least hurt your self, or windyourself or something. Also, you can get up from prone and instantly accelerate to a 10mph sprint in .2 seconds. not good looking.
Look at FH for 42. You push shift, half a second later, you actually crouch. The animations are slowed down, and the delay makes it more realistic. In FH, it takes so long to trasition from standing to prone, that if you try it in midair, the animation shows you a little less than halfway through the going down animation if you hit the prone button right after you jump.
In short: Animations and animation timing need heavy modifying.
Re: Actual Solutions: Bunny hopping, GL abuse, prone spam, etc. etc.
Originally posted by RingPirate
Defensive bunnyhopping is not an issue. Come on now. U see somebody doing it. How hard is it to adopt to that tactic? Is it really so diffaucult to lead the hopper and shoot him when he comes down? Or with support even in the air. I got shot a couple of times by good snipers while jumping.
The problem with defensive bunnyhopping, and all bunny hopping (and prone jumping, and dolphin diving, etc) i think lies primarily that it looks really, really stupid. I mean, while most of us didn't buy this game thinking it would be a sim, a lot of us probably bought it because we wanted an immersive, fun, action-packed wargame. I don't think anyone picked it up because they thought they would be facing people flying around 5 feet off the ground like a gimped version of superman in combat fatigues.
Re: Actual Solutions: Bunny hopping, GL abuse, prone spam, etc. etc.
Originally posted by ||ass||variable
This post builds on Wargimp's and extends the analysis to other issues.
As usual, DICE has failed to understand the real causes behind the problems everyone is complaining about. Let's get to the meat here and talk about the real issues at hand and the solutions.
Thanks for the nod. Good extentions. I'll add some comments.
Bunny Hopping
Two types: offensive (jumping and shooting) and defensive (repeatedly jumping to avoid being hit).
Offensive bunny hopping
It's is never an issue unless it's paired with the grenade launchers or C4. When players do jump and fire the grenade launcher (or throw C4), they usually only have to jump once within a 5 second span.
Why DICE's solution doesn't work:
Technically, removing shooting while jumping does prevent offensive bunny hopping, but it also prevents many other actions that players unanimously approve of, such as jumping to throw grenades or ammo/health packs. Fix 2 things, break 3 more - obviously that's not viable.
Agreed. This will also impact the engineers quite a bit. I tend to find that the pump shotguns are the weapon that I most often use for jumpshots. This is simply because I tend to find myself in tight situations involving low barriers around the flag. With the shotgun you have to get damned close. If they are hiding behind snadbags you have the choise of running into their field of fire or diving over it. When using option 2 if you don't get your shot off in the air, yer dead.
What will work:
Preventing players from deploying C4 or firing the grenade launcher while airborne. I realize that it'll take more coding to accomplish, but this is something that needs to be done right over being done fast.
Actually, I think getting extra loft on the C4 with a hop is not only legit, but almost required. I do this fairly often, but not for spamming foot troops. Rather, I use it to get the C4 onto targets I don't want to aprouch... like tanks. Preferably from a rooftop.
I feel the same about the GL. It's not that you can jumpshoot with it that makes it so foul, it's the point blank jumpshots that suck the icky stuff from a dead monkey's arse.
Proposed soultion; balanace the weapons themselves!
For C4, the most obvious fix is to impose a delay on pulling the detonator. 3 seconds should do it. That's a nice balance between being able stick a tank, get away, and blow vs impeading spam "air bursts". It would also fix the bug where you blow yourself up with your last C4 if you accedently double click.
The GL is covered later so I'll wait on that.
Defensive bunny hopping
The act of repeatedly jumping up and down to avoid being shot.
Why DICE's solution doesn't work:
They don't address it! Preventing players from shooting while jumping doesn't stop them from jumping over and over.
Nope... doesn't do a damned thing.
What will work:
Wargimp's suggestion - make jumping take 1/3 of your stamina bar, or so. That way, a given player could only chain 2-3 jumps in a row.
And recall that those 2-3 jumps are assuming that you haven't been sprinting all over the place.
Conclusion
Players can never jump more than 2-3 times in a row, and cannot fire the GL or throw C4 while in the air.
Well, I'm still not liking those cannot fire/throw in the air solutions. But here we are at the 'nade launcher section!
Grenade Launcher Abuse
Players can use the grenade launchers at very close ranges without killing themselves and always killing the opponent. This is due to the shape of the splash damage and the lack of a minimum effective range.
Anyone who doesn't think this is a cheap/abusive stunt is full o crap. I've tried it. It made me feel dirty.
Why DICE's solution doesn't work:
They haven't formally proposed anything yet, but during the DEV chat they hinted at reducing the splash radius of the GL, which is precisely the wrong thing to do. It stands to further reduce the risk to the shooter in CQC, while retaining most, if not all, of the close range lethality. It also weakens the GL at longer ranges or for killing groups of enemies - two of its legit uses.
'Zactly. I don't think Dice is understanding the issues at all and seeing those comments in the interview only backed those feelings up. The no-shoot-while-jumping seems to be their idea of fixing this problem. Ah... point blank noob toobing works perfectly fine when you've got your feet on the ground. You just have to be a little less pointblank. Reducing splash agravates that.
What will work:
Create a minimum arming time/distance for the GL. Say, 15m, to prevent players from being able to induce an explosion at close ranges. Retain projectile damage (similar to the regular grenades) such that players hit by the physical grenade itself (prior to explosion) will still be killed by the inertia. This is an homage to reality, as well as a reward for those that can aim.
Unfortunatly, I don't think the engine is really up to handling on-the-fly min range based arming. On the otherhand, we know that it's able to do time based arming (The gas launcher does it). So if the GL round had to wait even as little as .75 seconds (the things fly fast!) this would aproximate the effect that we want. You point blank shoot someone and it just bounces of them or the ground, resulting in a random blast. With luck, in the face of the noobtoober.
Psudo code:
On_Grenade_Launch
Set MinimumArmTime = CurrentTime + .75
Do LaunchFunctions
Done and doner.
(If you don't understand psudo code, don't worry. The above makes sence to those who do )
Conclusion
Prevent the GL's ability to cause general, close range explosions by creating a minimum range, but retain its ability to physically kill if aimed well in CQC.
It's my feeling that doing this would preclude the need to nerf jumpshots. In fact, this would be a worse thing to do to people who like their point plab jumpshost since it's likely that from an downward angle, the round is more likely to bounce back into their face.
Dats a good ting IMHO.
Prone Jumping/Dolphin Diving
There's much confusion here, so let's try to deal with it. There are a few actions that fall under this category. The first is staying prone while hopping up and down, and the second is running, then jumping, then going to prone and flying through the air only to land and immediately have fantastic accuracy.
Prone Jumping (bouncing while prone)
The act of repeatedly jumping up and down to avoid being shot, while staying in the prone position.
Why DICE's solution doesn't work:
They haven't addressed this yet.
What will work:
Gravity being what it is, it makes much sense to allow players to quickly move fron standing to crouch/prone, but require time to get up. In particular, it might take 1-2 seconds to stand up from being prone, but you could still drop to the floor almost instantaneously. This also prevents players from spamming prone over and over.
I'd just note that I suspect that it would be more elegent (and less harmful to legit use) if you were to flag the time limit to the action of going prone as opposed to imposing a "get up" time when you try to stand.
Ie, when you first go prone, you run a timer (I'm thinking 3 seconds). Until that timer is expired, you cannot get up. At all. Nor can you jump.
The reason I like this more is because it doesn't impact people who are going prone in legit was nearly as much. If they've gone prone to get a tactical advantage, they aren't likely to need to get up for at least a few seconds.
Prone Jumping (running, jumping, proning and thusly flying
The act of sprinting into a jump, then going prone and flying through the air, making it impossible to hit you and yielding near perfect accuracy the moment you lane on the pavement.
Why DICE's solution doesn't work:
They haven't addressed this yet.
What will work:
Only allow players to change stance while on the ground.
Conclusion
Players can only change stance while on the ground (not jumping). Players can go down in position quickly, but it takes time to stand up.
Again, we have here an issue with legit use being hurt by an attempt to fix an exploit. Doing a running dive over a wall while taking heavy fire (usually from a vehicle) is much fun and not what I'd consiter an abuse.
Rather, I'd point to the above solution of impossing a 3 second "you can't get up" time from when you first go prone. The result here would be that you'd run, jump, dive, *thump* into the ground and not be able to get up. Very much like being winded from bellyflooping on the ground.
Infact, if I had my way, I'd flag "LandWhileProne" as an even that causes your vision to blur for a short time (simulating "OOF!").
Thoughts? Obviously these are theoretical. Don't flame too hard.
We've presented some slight variations on how to deal with these issues, but I think either way we're way ahead of what Dice had proposed.
Re: Actual Solutions: Bunny hopping, GL abuse, prone spam, etc. etc.
Originally posted by Wargimp
Actually, I think getting extra loft on the C4 with a hop is not only legit, but almost required. I do this fairly often, but not for spamming foot troops. Rather, I use it to get the C4 onto targets I don't want to aprouch... like tanks. Preferably from a rooftop.
I think there's an ancillary issue at work here that I didn't mention the first time around. C4 should not be a ranged weapon. As it is, the ability to launch C4 (at a tank, at infantry, etc.) has marginalized the AT kit, especially in middle-range situations.
You see 80% of the team as Spec Ops because it can perform the role of 2-3 other kits, and that's not the way a kit system ought to work. I am all for extending the throw range on the C4 by a meter or two (to help get it over railings, etc.) but it shouldn't be frisbee'd. Hence the limit on jump throws.
Originally posted by Wargimp
I feel the same about the GL. It's not that you can jumpshoot with it that makes it so foul, it's the point blank jumpshots that suck the icky stuff from a dead monkey's arse.
My beef is with the near-perfect accuracy of a jumping GL user (combining great defense with great offense). If you can still shoot it while jumping, it should be affected by deviation from jumping similar to, if not moreso than, other guns.
Originally posted by Wargimp
Unfortunatly, I don't think the engine is really up to handling on-the-fly min range based arming. On the otherhand, we know that it's able to do time based arming (The gas launcher does it). So if the GL round had to wait even as little as .75 seconds (the things fly fast!) this would aproximate the effect that we want.
That's cool - the net effect is the same.
Originally posted by Wargimp
You point blank shoot someone and it just bounces of them or the ground, resulting in a random blast. With luck, in the face of the noobtoober.
Precisely. Don't think I didn't think about that :) Though I do think that direct hits with the physical projectile should do some serious damage.
Originally posted by Wargimp
I'd just note that I suspect that it would be more elegent (and less harmful to legit use) if you were to flag the time limit to the action of going prone as opposed to imposing a "get up" time when you try to stand.
Ie, when you first go prone, you run a timer (I'm thinking 3 seconds). Until that timer is expired, you cannot get up. At all. Nor can you jump.
The reason I like this more is because it doesn't impact people who are going prone in legit was nearly as much. If they've gone prone to get a tactical advantage, they aren't likely to need to get up for at least a few seconds.
Well, not always. Many AT players will pop up and down in order to do battle with tanks, or any player in a fire fight. I don't really like the idea of being "stuck" in a certain position for no reason, but I can logically understand it taking time to get up - as long as I can initiate said get-up whenever I want to. Plus, if we did it the way you mentioned, we'd have to add a visual timer for "can't get up for 2 seconds" so players know when they're eligible to stand. Otherwise, they're going to get frustrated pounding the key waiting to get up, and intuitively, it'll make no sense.
Originally posted by Wargimp
Again, we have here an issue with legit use being hurt by an attempt to fix an exploit. Doing a running dive over a wall while taking heavy fire (usually from a vehicle) is much fun and not what I'd consiter an abuse.
In the 5 minutes I spent typing up the post, this is the issue I was least confident about solving. As per the original suggestion, you could still dive over a wall, but you'd have to land on your feet before you could land on your belly. We could implement a running dive, but I'd like to see the animation for "going horizontal" happen at the tail end of the jump's arc, as opposed to much earlier as it happens now. The insane jump height also contributes to this issue of a "flying man", but they already said they wouldn't change that bit.
If you look at the animation from standing to prone, it looks pretty good - the player does a little hop forward onto his belly. A decent player could easily time a run + jump, land then prone maneuver, but it'd be much less cinematic than the current move.
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