Anyone else notice the correlation

[Nadokings]

Or just no rules.

[RUDEnKRUDE]

Base raping and spawn camping - all fine by me.

It's the sneaky, crafty stuff that make BF2 so compelling. The objective is to disable and overcome the opponent, not hang back like with Queensbury rules...

If a team can't get its act together and defend against the above, too bad.

And - in the event of a (perceived) map bias - the favour can be returned when teams switch sides.

It's all about TEAM!

(Draw the line at hacking tho - mechanics are there for a reason).

Arbitrary rules cramp the game so much. E.g. being kicked as Spec Ops for base attach. Like, WTF? :shakehead

[The Laughing Man]

So at what point do you draw the line?

TKing isn't very fun, especially if it's you being TK'd because someone else wants to grab a resource.

By measure being an American side and being in the situation where you're stuck on the carrier having the cr*p raped out of you. No chance of getting off the carrier so you've got a choice try and get off the carrier and get nailed by the gunship or the J10 that's flying past picking off boats or stay on the carrier and get killed. The only chance of scoring any sort of results is if you go a medic.

Now yes you can twist the rule by saying no carrier attack until at least one flag is captured but since the use of aircraft is often a key defining role in weather you win or loose what's the point? This is made doubly worse by the fact that American jet pilots will spend more time respawning than those in the other team because the F35Bs are so bloody awful.

The objective should be to create a server that is fun for everyone to play on. If the rules do this then does it matter how stupid they may appear? I would rather play on a server that is fun to play and has a series of rules than one that allows players to have at it and have to put up with being stuck on a carrier whilst having the mince blown out me by arty, 2 J10s and 2 z10s.

[LightBred]

So at what point do you draw the line?

TKing isn't very fun, especially if it's you being TK'd because someone else wants to grab a resource.

By measure being an American side and being in the situation where you're stuck on the carrier having the cr*p raped out of you. No chance of getting off the carrier so you've got a choice try and get off the carrier and get nailed by the gunship or the J10 that's flying past picking off boats or stay on the carrier and get killed. The only chance of scoring any sort of results is if you go a medic.

Now yes you can twist the rule by saying no carrier attack until at least one flag is captured but since the use of aircraft is often a key defining role in weather you win or loose what's the point? This is made doubly worse by the fact that American jet pilots will spend more time respawning than those in the other team because the F35Bs are so bloody awful.

The objective should be to create a server that is fun for everyone to play on. If the rules do this then does it matter how stupid they may appear? I would rather play on a server that is fun to play and has a series of rules than one that allows players to have at it and have to put up with being stuck on a carrier whilst having the mince blown out me by arty, 2 J10s and 2 z10s.

Being american you're not "stuck" on the carrier... You can choose a different spawn point like with WAKE or use an RIB which is there for a reason.

The only way a team gets baseraped is by defending inappropriately. The bases were meant to be attacked either way as they have defenses in place..

Obviously you shouldn't play BF2 multiplayer and should stick to single player with bots and GOD mode on.

[DontKnockIt225]

Although strict rules sound bad... they work. Many bf2 players are vehical whores, they like doing it. If you get rid of that you lose a big audience. So it depends play a rape all server if you like, but i expect it would be a lot less popular.

Also queing is bad rule because not every1 reads and it gives a lot of work to admin... Also they cannot always trust players.

You make a very good point about getting more people involved though.

[LightBred]

The most popular servers I have been in have the less rules especially the ones allowing baserape as it should be.

[[Expletive Deleted]]

Being american you're not "stuck" on the carrier... You can choose a different spawn point like with WAKE or use an RIB which is there for a reason.

The only way a team gets baseraped is by defending inappropriately. The bases were meant to be attacked either way as they have defenses in place..

Obviously you shouldn't play BF2 multiplayer and should stick to single player with bots and GOD mode on.

How far do you get in that rubber coffin? They are bullet magnets and get chewed up in seconds by even the .50s on DPVs. Not a viable option.
Also, the Phallanx lock range is a lot less than the range a jet can shoot the machinegun. And pilots often start shooting from out of view range. The damage isn't equal, either. Barely a viable option. And even then only when the splash damage doesn't kill you while you try to hide.
Granted, a pilot can only kill a few things in one strafe, but they can come back for another in less time than it takes for another jet, Phallanx, chopper, or whatever to spawn.
If there are decent J-10 pilots, Americans ARE STUCK at their spawn points or very near them.

[Rugerdog]

The most popular servers I have been in have the less rules especially the ones allowing baserape as it should be.

Yeah I've seen those. They are called IO Karkand FF Off servers. Just because a server is popular does not mean that it is fun to play on. There are plenty of popular servers that just suck. Server rules unless they break the ROE are just a matter of taste, so go ahead and have fun with your carrier raping, I can't and wont do anything to stop you. I will be waiting on a different server that does not punish a team for spawning as the US and having my own fun doing it.

[LightBred]

How far do you get in that rubber coffin? They are bullet magnets and get chewed up in seconds by even the .50s on DPVs. Not a viable option.

I have never had a problem making it to land in a RIB with both J10s and a chopper in the air WITH competent pilots. As for the .50 cals taking them out??? well yea... even the choppers come down in a few moments under .50 cal fire. Obviously it would be better to use some intelligence on your approach rather than just make a straight line rush for the nearest shore.

Also, the Phallanx lock range is a lot less than the range a jet can shoot the machinegun. And pilots often start shooting from out of view range. The damage isn't equal, either. Barely a viable option. And even then only when the splash damage doesn't kill you while you try to hide.
Granted, a pilot can only kill a few things in one strafe, but they can come back for another in less time than it takes for another jet, Phallanx, chopper, or whatever to spawn.
If there are decent J-10 pilots, Americans ARE STUCK at their spawn points or very near them.

There are TWO phalanx for a reason..... As for the being stuck at spawn yes I completely agree, if the players have no idea what they are doing or just a handful are trying to play while the rest camp the carrier and wait for a jet or round end, the americans will stay in spawn the entire round.

Yeah I've seen those. They are called IO Karkand FF Off servers.

Wasn't referring to anything to do with I/O or karkand for that matter. Last time I checked we were discussing vehicle servers more specifically ones with carriers which you obviously know hence your referring to it later in your post... Just like pointlessness?

Just because a server is popular does not mean that it is fun to play on. There are plenty of popular servers that just suck.

Different people like different styles of play... What would bore most people out of their mind would probably be the funnest thing in the world to you and vice versa.

Server rules unless they break the ROE are just a matter of taste, so go ahead and have fun with your carrier raping, I can't and wont do anything to stop you.

It's only common sense if you want to win to keep enemy assets both in the air and on the ground to a minimum. Wherever they maybe. Obviously it would be better to take out a threat while it is stationary than to WAIT for the threat to become airborne and pretty much knocking at the front door before saying "oh now lets get him".

I will be waiting on a different server that does not punish a team for spawning as the US and having my own fun doing it.

Playing fairly and the way the game was intended is punishment?

Different servers and styles of play are a given, I get people like different things but it gets to a point things are just ridiculous. I can understand some rules, even the no attacking carrier or uncaps til whoever has at least one flag but the current rules of majority of these so called servers pretty much is to give the lame no skilled players a place to hide and wait the match out until the end of the round comes and they can be on PLA.

[Teh_Diplomat]

I see this debate going off the tangent of "Well it would be great, but J-10's are too good" and "Well that's nice and all, but the USMC start from one location and because of this are easier targets to baserape"


First off, The J-10 can be brought down by teamwork, of the opposing side. I know this sounds like a lot, but an F-35 in the air, and with IGLAs positioned on the map, many times we just lure them down to where the IGLA forces them to drop flares, and then F-35 rapes with cannons and missiles.


I've ALWAYS said, and firmly believe that a slighty organized US side >>slighlty organized PLA side. What I meant by slightly is when in a pub servers and people join clans to talk, a pretty simple requirement to meet in servers which regulars attend. The reason I think that the USMC can win when organized even on the same level as the PLA is their central starting location, this leaves it up to the PLA to be constantly reacting to the USMC's moves.

You have a plethora of objectives and any number of ways to complete them.

1 - A RIB can always make it to the North side shores before the jet can make a strafing run, or the helo is within TV striking distance. From there the SL can run along the side of the beach until N. village.

2 - A Blackhawk at high altitudes can drop on any flag and capture it within 6 seconds with just a squad of three soldiers.

A) You can drop at the Villages and work your way up; Drop at beach and flank out in both directions, or just stay in the air until the Airfield has been taken, and in a war of attrition, the J-10 runs out of missiles and can not re-arm, and the Attack Helicopter takes too much damage from 50.cals and missiles, SRAW's, etc, and blows up.



With just a little organization the PLA is sent on random duck hunts or left with one sniper defending against an entire squad for a Capture point.


The only time I've lost with USMC, which is quite a bit is when no one wants to work together in those crucial first moments of the round.

[LightBred]

^Completely agree.^

[The Laughing Man]

First off, The J-10 can be brought down by teamwork, of the opposing side. I know this sounds like a lot, but an F-35 in the air, and with IGLAs positioned on the map, many times we just lure them down to where the IGLA forces them to drop flares, and then F-35 rapes with cannons and missiles.

Yes you see the small problem with that theory is that it assumes you have people at the IGLAs, however if all the Americans are starting off at one point how do you get them to the IGLAs to set up the J10 before it is on top of the carrier bombing the living daylights out of you?

All very well saying it's easy but it isn't. You need to secure the area and spawns around the IGLAs to stop you getting shot when you mount up and if you have another spawn point then the whole carrier raping issue is moot. Besides any half decent J10 pilot will hit the IGLAs as they fly past just to make sure.

A RIB can always make it to the North side shores before the jet can make a strafing run, or the helo is within TV striking distance. From there the SL can run along the side of the beach until N. village.

No it can't.

From Carrier to shore takes 52 seconds. In a J10 I can take off, fly over the RIB ingress route, hit the carrier, fly back over the ingress route on RTB, reload come back and fly over the ingress route for a third time before it gets to the shore.

A Blackhawk at high altitudes can drop on any flag and capture it within 6 seconds with just a squad of three soldiers.

Yeah all it has to do is avoid the Z10s and the J10s to get in position first. A half decent Z10 co pilot can take down a blackhawk with a TV missile before it's even 3 quarters of the way to the land, let alone anywhere near a flag. A decent J10 pilot can take off, cannon kill one of the anti air phalanx, bomb the carrier and still have enough time to kill the blackhawk on the RTB run.

[[GCA]Tim270]

I hate servers with any rules pretty much, imo fighting on the carrier is one of the best parts of the game. Baserape, i agree can be a pain in the ***, but you should do your bit for your team so that wont happen.

[Webs961]

Having adminned servers with no baserape rules at all, I can safely assure you that if you have very experienced players on PLA who move the tanks and DPVs up as well as highly skilled pilots in the J-10 and Z-10, the Americans will not move, period. The Z-10 just sat down near the boat bay and proceeded to rape anyone who spawned there. Couple this with an infantry squad who did a HALO jump onto the Carrier as well as the PLA commander artying every few minutes, and you have a recipe for a non-moving American team the whole round. You've got snipers and the tanks picking people off on the island, two supply crates and a DPV with an engineer near the tank, plus about three snipers with L96s right at the edge at the beach, and they're certainly not leaving the island alive.

Believe me, I've seen the PLA waste good American teams several times, even though the Americans were trying to coordinate. But, did we ever disallow baserape? No. Then the map becomes unbalanced against the PLA as once the J-10 goes down, the airfield is bombed unmercilessly, seeing as it does not qualify for the no baserape rule.

[DontKnockIt225]

lol wake island is one **** map when all the good people join 1 team. Cant get off carrier or lose airfield... terrible map unless the teams are fairly even :)