'Lack of Support'

[Liam.]

I'd like someone to fully explain WHERE BF2 is missing 'support' from EA Games and DICE. I just don't see it. Where is it not there? The modding community? The player community? The cheater community? The simple fact is that EA/DICE are no different to any other game developer/publisher.

As we all know, BF2 was released June 24, 2005, 2 years ago. Since then, EA/DICE has recieved a whole lot of crap from this community. They've released 10 patches (excluding 1.4 BETA 1 and 2). In some of the newer patches, two new FREE maps have been added - Wake and Jalalabad. Also, two new game modes were added FOR FREE. Then, expansions adding even more content were released for what can easily be considered reasonable prices with regards to the actual level of content. Content along the lines of new maps, new kits, new vehicles, new toys (zip line etc).

That is a hell of a lot of additions to the game, something they didn't need to spend time, money and resources on creating for this community. But they did. They gave more and more to us. Yet, you people sit and whine and pretend that EA/DICE don't care and it's all for the money, well congratulations. THEY ARE A BUSINESS; businesses are THERE TO MAKE MONEY. Just like any other game developer or publisher.

As for technical support, there's a website for all EA games titles here:

http://support.ea.com/cgi-bin/ea.cfg/php/enduser/home.php?p_sid=EL96qOAi

There's an official forum where you can talk with other players to get help
http://forums.ea.com/mboards/categor...&categoryID=71

Now, you may have to wait a long time to get a response, or may not get one at all. Now consider that BF2 sold over 2 million copies ALONE, think about how many emails they receive for every game they published. That's a hell of a lot, and I don't think they employ 2 million people, let alone the amount that they actually sell across all games. As of 2006, EA employed 7,200. 7200 people can not instantly respond to 2 million emails per game.

As for EA releasing poor games, try considering the following fact:

EA is the best reviewed third-party publisher by some distance, only beaten by Nintendo among all major publishers. For 2006, the games review aggregation site Metacritic.com gives the average of EA games as 72.0 (out of 100); 2.5 points behind Nintendo (74.5) but ahead of the other first-party publishers Microsoft (71.6) and Sony (71.2). The closest third-party publisher is Take 2 (publishing as 2K Games and Rockstar) at 70.3

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EA_Games

The 'best reviewed' figure is also supported by the net revenue (data correct as of fiscal year March 2005) of US$3.129 billion. People buy their games, then they buy other games. Not just BF2, but everything else they release. If EA is so bad, why do so many people spend their hard-earned on their products year after year?

Let's also consider that people started flouting the stats system, they started running 'Infantry Only' servers against the TOS to increase their points. What did EA/DICE do? Implement the VERY POPULAR feature themselves. They saw what a major part of the community wanted and they did it. Now, they continue to take extensive feedback from the community (as they did with other patches) and are potentially developing yet another patch, despite the fact that the majority of that community whines about everything they do. It seems that a lot of people think that the game was developed specifically for them to play, that every change should be geared to their personal wants. This just defies all common sense.

[Jemme101]

Re: 'Lack of Support'

[Liam.]

Re: 'Lack of Support'

That post just proves my point.

[Mo0by]

Re: 'Lack of Support'

You sir, should be prime minister :O

[MooseHouse]

Re: 'Lack of Support'

What you say is true, but look at the patches, are they any good? CTDs, Unbalance became even more unbalanced, nerfs, etc. Although maybe this is DICE's fault, but when the game was still developing, EA rushed Dice leaving a lot of cool stuff out

[Liam.]

Re: 'Lack of Support'

What you say is true, but look at the patches, are they any good? CTDs, Unbalance became even more unbalanced, nerfs, etc. Although maybe this is DICE's fault, but when the game was still developing, EA rushed Dice leaving a lot of cool stuff out

DICE recieved a lot of feedback from the community for each patch, it's also likely that they monitored the fan sites aswell themself. Each time, people complained about things that were not real problem, hence DICE take their focus away from fixing real problems and start adjusting gameplay to try to make people happy - which in turn causes more complaints from the people who think the game was developed around themselves.

[MooseHouse]

Re: 'Lack of Support'

Erm... J10, wtf? (Just a Main example) I don't think this game is developed for me, but I think if DICE/EA Actually spent a little more time on the game, it would be way better. The J10 was not uberpowered until Patch 1.3 ?? (I dunno which one), then after it it was just the king of the sky, though thousands of people claiming it wasn't good, no reaction :|:

For example stuff that never came into bf2, but that was planned:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d_dd23Pi0NU&search=BF2http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d_dd23Pi0NU&search=BF2

[Liam.]

Re: 'Lack of Support'

Erm... J10, wtf? (Just a Main example) I don't think this game is developed for me, but I think if DICE/EA Actually spent a little more time on the game, it would be way better. The J10 was not uberpowered until Patch 1.3 ?? (I dunno which one), then after it it was just the king of the sky, though thousands of people claiming it wasn't good, no reaction :|:

For example stuff that never came into bf2, but that was planned:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d_dd2...0NU&search=BF2

This can be taken both ways, yes, the J10 has been ignored - but ask yourself this: is it because people whined about a lot of other stuff instead?

As for that video, that means nothing at all, it was a pre-release trailer. I defy you to tell me a SINGLE game that didn't change considerably during development. Look at Half Life 2, during development there was a watery monster called Hydra, but it was buggy so they scrapped it, there was a promotional DVD released with videos of some extended Ravenholm maps that didn't make into the final game. Also it's worth thinking about this video of San Andreas early development:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-1gSlDFdoOc

These two examples are no different from DICE and BF2, sometimes things just get changed after they've been made public. It's not a reflection on DICE or BF2, nor is it a reflection of Valve and Rockstar respectively. Radical changes during development is just a part of the process, it's been happening since the early days of gaming.

[MooseHouse]

Re: 'Lack of Support'

This can be taken both ways, yes, the J10 has been ignored - but ask yourself this: is it because people whined about a lot of other stuff instead?

As for that video, that means nothing at all, it was a pre-release trailer. I defy you to tell me a SINGLE game that didn't change considerably during development. Look at Half Life 2, during development there was a watery monster called Hydra, but it was buggy so they scrapped it, there was a promotional DVD released with videos of some extended Ravenholm maps that didn't make into the final game. Also it's worth thinking about this video of San Andreas early development:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-1gSlDFdoOc

These two examples are no different from DICE and BF2, sometimes things just get changed after they've been made public. It's not a reflection on DICE or BF2, nor is it a reflection of Valve and Rockstar respectively. Radical changes during development is just a part of the process, it's been happening since the early days of gaming.

True, but! A lot of content was is still in the game, just not finished/ready for use. EA just hurried Dice, and BF2 was actually unfinished.

[Garabaldi]

Re: 'Lack of Support'

Where is it not there? The modding community?

If the modding community was supported, more mods would have been released as of now, and the entire community wouldn't be in such shambles.

You are either dellusional, or simply uninformed if you think the modding community is, or at any time was being suported.

Also, two new game modes were added FOR FREE

I only know of two game modes. Conquest and IO. What is the other one? IO isn't any big feat either. I'm sure most mappers could remove vehicles from any map in a matter of minutes.

EA has supported the rest of the community, although poorly. Patches generally broke more than they fixed, and the most blatant issues (J-10 imbalance, insta-proning) were left unfixed, and unfixable, due to the hardcoded nature of the engine.

[camper.]

Re: 'Lack of Support'

I just had to "LOL" at your sig, Garabaldi.


Sure, EA support BF2. The same way they supported Westwood Studios.

[zipp0r]

Re: 'Lack of Support'

i have 2 game types in total as well. only infantry only was added.

2 new maps, well wake island isnt really that good... jallalalalalalabad is ok.
but wheres all the extra things? you gotta pay for them....
their support is so poor they cannot offer any help with account problems. their patchers keep being told to change things so nubs find it easier, but they always stuff it up as well as making too extreme changes.

a few patches doesnt mean they give good support to the peopel that have the game. they only tend to care about money and profits and only give a patch when theres something seriously wrong with the game (pretty much always). 2 new maps were just to shut people up, remember we wanted more game modes, something like ctf, teamdeath match or supply lines as well as maps!

now it makes me wonder, what if they didnt spend so much time messing with all the things the nubs wanted changing, maybe we could have had the content we wanted ??

[flippy199]

Re: 'Lack of Support'

This can be taken both ways, yes, the J10 has been ignored - but ask yourself this: is it because people whined about a lot of other stuff instead?

As for that video, that means nothing at all, it was a pre-release trailer. I defy you to tell me a SINGLE game that didn't change considerably during development. Look at Half Life 2, during development there was a watery monster called Hydra, but it was buggy so they scrapped it, there was a promotional DVD released with videos of some extended Ravenholm maps that didn't make into the final game. Also it's worth thinking about this video of San Andreas early development:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-1gSlDFdoOc

These two examples are no different from DICE and BF2, sometimes things just get changed after they've been made public. It's not a reflection on DICE or BF2, nor is it a reflection of Valve and Rockstar respectively. Radical changes during development is just a part of the process, it's been happening since the early days of gaming.

those san andreas changes are tiny compared to the bf2 ones.... different character models, vs a black hawk with missles. different pedestrians and transparent windows on one building vs being able to laser designate a target.

[Liam.]

Re: 'Lack of Support'

If the modding community was supported, more mods would have been released as of now, and the entire community wouldn't be in such shambles.

You are either dellusional, or simply uninformed if you think the modding community is, or at any time was being suported.

Battlefield 2 was not made as a base for modders to create their own games. DICE didn't have to release the map editor, nor did they have to create the extensive tutorials in using the map editor. Go to the EA forums, there's two BF2 subforums there: Battlefield 2 Mods & Editing and Battlefield 2 Mappin’ - these are the place to go for mod 'support'. This is the same level of support as games like Americas Army. A map editor, tutorial and forums. They didn't have to do any of these, that is 'supporting the mod community'.

I only know of two game modes. Conquest and IO. What is the other one? IO isn't any big feat either. I'm sure most mappers could remove vehicles from any map in a matter of minutes.

EA has supported the rest of the community, although poorly. Patches generally broke more than they fixed, and the most blatant issues (J-10 imbalance, insta-proning) were left unfixed, and unfixable, due to the hardcoded nature of the engine.

Cooperative Gameplay, known as “co-op”, is same as conquest mode except that players also play with and against computers or known as “bots”. This game mode is not part of the ranking system.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battlefield_2

Conquest, IO and COOP makes three.

Again, EA/DICE never had to release patches. But they did. They listened to the community. They took feedback (and continue to do so without any official announcement of further patches) and worked with that, it took precedent over the real issues due to the volume of the feedback.

they only tend to care about money and profits

Once again, EA/DICE are both BUSINESSES, which part of this concept do you not understand?

those san andreas changes are tiny compared to the bf2 ones.... different character models, vs a black hawk with missles. different pedestrians and transparent windows on one building vs being able to laser designate a target.

San Andreas had car washing cut, if you read the description - you were able to buy cigarettes and bubble gum at 24/7 stores, these were cut, gang members could follow you into buildings - this was cut, background objects could burn - CUT, in normal gameplay cops could jump on the back of a car - CUT. Those are not 'tiny' changes by any stretch of the definition, these were big changes in the game that were publicised but didn't appear in the final product.

[Garabaldi]

Re: 'Lack of Support'

Battlefield 2 was not made as a base for modders to create their own games.

Ah. So you aer simply misinformed :-).

Dice indicated that they would release comprehensive mod tools - they also indicated that the engine would be easily modifiable - it is not. The two previous iterations of the series have been much easier to modify, and the modding scenes in both have been much larger than BF2's currently is, and ever will be.

Somebody from Dice even said that they will leave the 'realism' to the modders - unfortunately, modding BF2 is unnecissarily hard. They did intend to support the mod community.

Once again, EA/DICE are both BUSINESSES, which part of this concept do you not understand?

A busniess must also satisfy its customers needs and wants if they wish for people to continue purchasing their product or service. EA is not doing a very satisfactory job.